Primary reason for building a six?

The Legendary Falcon Six

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Primary reason for building a six?

Economy-mileage
21
13%
Performance
14
9%
Appearance
6
4%
To be Different
90
57%
Other
28
18%
 
Total votes : 159

Primary reason for building a six?

Postby AzCoupe » Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:12 pm

This is a simple one, but it will help me make some decisions for future projects/parts. One of my main reasons for asking, is to find out what direction we should go when we start building crate motors. Would potential customers be more interested in performance, economy, a combination of both, simple and efficient, or just the opposite, or something with lots of eye appeal that looks totally diferent than the normal cookie cutter V8s?

There are a lot of directions we can go, but I prefer to narrow it down to two or three motors to start with. Personally I like one with a solid bottom end, aluminum head, 4V carb (or injected), and a Paxton (or Procharger) blower with 6-7 lbs of boost (no intercooler for easy of plumbing). But that may be to pricey.

Basically I'm interested in why you kept the six, and if you plan to build a motor in the near future, would it be primarily for performance, ecomomy, or ???
Last edited by AzCoupe on Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:59 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Postby Asa » Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:16 pm

originally kept Susie a six cylinder because i didn't have the money to swap to a V8 and i enjoyed being different

got a 4.9 F-150 because i heard of how reliable they were through this site
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Postby BIGREDRASA » Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:50 pm

Old Charlie came with a six. It was such a good deal, I couldn't pass it up. Since it ain't broke, no reason to "fix" it. :D
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Postby max » Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:56 pm

Mainly performance, and if it improves mileage too that's a bonus.
I wouldn't do an upgrade just for improved economy unless the upgrades paid for themselves in about 3 years.
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Postby jamyers » Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:08 pm

Because Dad's Ranchero had a 6 in it, and I promised him that I'd keep it stock or at least stock-appearing. Lotsa family history in the ol' yeller Ranchero, and I'm not going to screw it up if I can help it.

Different car, Different engine, Different driving experience. I love it.
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Postby 64falconsix » Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:38 pm

I've seen too many falcons with v8s, just wanted to be different. ..........64 falcon 2 door sedan 200ci .040 . comp 260/ .440 D.U.I , triple webbers, dual outlet header, modified 79 log head w/c4and 3.20 rear gears. soon to add a C.I. timing set.[/quote]
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Postby falcon fanatic » Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:42 pm

All out performance. How can you beat a car that does 0-60 in 12 seconds and still get s 13 MPG. If I wanted fuel economy, or to be different, I would build a V-16 604 CID.
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Postby Straight Six » Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:54 pm

My 1st car came with a six(by chance) -so did my 2nd and soon a 3rd(by choice). Six will get better mielage but also "I'M SICK AND TIRED OF ALL THE STUPID PUTDOWNS ABOUT OUR SIXES JUST SO A V-8 CAN BE SWAPED IN".So many people just like lemmings-lets all do it---"NO Thanks" I liked the fact that I could do my own oil changes,spark plugs,alternator--etc. I wont deny there was 1 point when I had my 1st car I thought about a 289 swap--but it dawned on me one day that my car was just fine the way it was-and I know it would do over 120mph:):):):) interstingly enuff the cop never pulled me over just shined his light and I slowed down--lol. With the fact that we now can add performance to our cars Im happier than ever.
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Postby Patrick66 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:00 am

the main reason i kept mine was because it was the original engine. its been modified now, but the car came with a straight six and i wanted to keep it. i am also hoping to get better gas mileage.
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Postby woodbutcher » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:08 am

:D My first car was a flathead six.53 Studebaker Starlite Coupe.Three on the tree,with electric OD.
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Postby jamyers » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:21 am

Also: I can change the oil without getting under the car to get the plug out of the pan. Try that with anything else! 8)
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Postby rbohm » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:23 am

8) i decided to keep the six in my 64 falcon to stay true to the original intent of the car. economy.
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Postby BUZZ » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:25 am

I'm just tired of v8's I've had and built to many. My goal is to build a fast car that still gets good mpgs. When I told a guy at work I was planning on spending about 7 grand on my six he said I was nuts, thats more than he's got in his dragcar motor, but I don't care I want my six. I got my header today a T5 is next :twisted:
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Re: Primary reason for building a six?

Postby Straight Six » Fri Mar 07, 2008 1:22 am

AzCoupe wrote:This is a simple one, but it will help me make some decisions for future projects/parts. One of my main reasons for asking, is to find out what direction we should go when we start building crate motors. Would potential customers be more interested in performance, economy, a combination of both, simple and efficient, or just the opposite, or something with lots of eye appeal that looks totally diferent than the normal cookie cutter V8s?

There are a lot of directions we can go, but I prefer to narrow it down to two or three motors to start with. Personally I like one with a solid bottom end, aluminum head, 4V carb (or injected), and a Paxton (or Procharger) blower with 6-7 lbs of boost (no intercooler for easy of plumbing). But that may be to pricey.

Basically I'm interested in why you kept the six, and if you plan to build a motor in the near future, would it be primarily for performance, ecomomy, or ???


If your going to go with 3 motors then Build one that is improvement over original with economy 1st a slight performance upgrade(true 120-140hp)--build one that is mid performance upgrade(150-200hp)--build one that is high performance 200 or 250 with 200 hp ++++.

But if you build only 2 then make 1st one economy/performance upgrade then the 2nd one go with higher end performance but not maxed out but offer upgrade parts to max it out.
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Postby 350kmileford » Fri Mar 07, 2008 2:26 am

I chose performance, just barely over 'to be different'. Economy in 3rd place.
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Postby 250mav » Fri Mar 07, 2008 2:43 am

it was there when i got it so im just gonna do what i can with her. if ever wanted to go for some real hi-po id probably swap in something with more cylinders just because its cheaper to build one of those up. you just dont get the bang for the buck with a 6 so i cant really see myself throwing alot of green at it
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Postby Bort62 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 3:11 am

(Common) V8's are boring, No imagination or inventiveness there. Been there done that, had fun at the time...

But got sick of keeping up with the jonses (someone is always faster), so now I just diverge. Way more fun and way less money. (and w/ the turbo, I'm keeping up ok despite my best efforts). If you build a V8 car, there is always another V8 car that is faster, better, and cooler that someone will compare it to. With the 6, you are the king of your castle... very rarely is there someone around with a 6 that you can compare to, and if there is - it's usually someone from this forum and you know them already.

So it takes the &^&* measuring out of the car hobby. No one will try to compare you to the multitude of better funded cars out there 'cause you're "just a six". - That's fine by me... and then when people see that you have done some unique, inspirational, and EFFECTIVE things to your six, they really get stoked, and really are willing to dish out the praise - It let's you run in your own class as opposed to trying to run w/ the herd.

My car is way cooler than some gay bellybutton V8 muscle car anyways. At least I think so - and that's all that matters. Instead of sitting here browsing through summit trying to decide which cookie-cutter bolt-on to add next (which of these 5000 different intake manifolds should I use?), I am constantly using my brain (and this forum) to devise solutions to the problems the car gives me, because the off-the-shelf solution to those problems doesn't exist. If I had a V8 car right now, I would just throw dollars at it and have it working perfect. No thinking needed. Where is the fun in that? I've done that before, but it was more fun 'cause I had less dollars, and that dictated more thinking. Now that I am fortunate enough to have a little more money for the hobby, having a bastard-child of a motor forces me to use my brain, and not just my wallet. (Where's the forged stroker rotating assembly for 1800 bucks Mike, cmon... )
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Postby kirkallen143 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 8:25 am

It's the same old saying, " swap that chitty 6 for a V8!" I got tired of hearing it and told I was keeping the six. "You won't make any power with that!"
Well you can figure how far their jaws dropped when I had beaten 12 V8 broncos in the sand drags and won the competition for standard tranny class. Enough said.

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Postby KEWL65 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 8:52 am

When I was in my early twenties, my mates were buying muscle cars with V8s while I was playing with a 1600 in a H^&%$ Gemini (rebadged Isuzu). This was before 4 cylinders and turbos became the "in" thing. I was different then 8) and I'm different now :) . When all my mates and brothers are putting SBC and big blocks into rods and american cruisers, i'm still there playing with something different only this time its got 2 more cylinders but its still inline. Whats even better is that the I6 I play with is a classic 8) 8)
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Postby JackFish » Fri Mar 07, 2008 10:25 am

I picked "other". It came with the car.

I had never seen one before, but thought that since I had a fox-body I could buy a 302 and Bob's yer uncle.

But after realizing how basic and easy and cheap to work on and maintain it was love. :oops: :lol: "I" can work on this car without having to go to a mechanic to change the spark plugs. I'm new to the "car" hobby so it's been a great learning platform.

Kind of like you found a stray dog, and it wants to be your best friend. And if you don't take care of it, it's going to the pound. :cry:
Yes, it's almost like a responsibility now. :lol:

However, if I had not found a site like this it would be extremely difficult.
This site was probably the most compelling reason for me to pursue this obsession.
Without this place there would be a deep void in the access to information.
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Postby Bort62 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:01 am

JackFish wrote:However, if I had not found a site like this it would be extremely difficult.
This site was probably the most compelling reason for me to pursue this obsession.
Without this place there would be a deep void in the access to information.


I found this site somehow before I even owned a 6... A friend of mine had a 71 mustang w/ 250 and he sent me some links here 'cause he needed help with some stuff...

That was back on the clifford forums :) He's long gone, and yet somehow I still remain.

Weird. I would have never thought about owning one of these motors w/o this site.
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Postby x21 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:04 am

Just as others have said- because it was the original motor in my 68. Then as I got to delve more into it, I experienced how easy it was to work on. While by no stretch a 'wild' or even 'mild' modified 6- a couple of upgrades for performance keep me happy. Later, I also keep the 6 out of spite for all those who have been telling me "man, you should drop a V-8 in that". And did I also mention reliable- the original 200 I had in there kept going! Yeah sure, right before I replaced it, it used a ton of oil and blew headgaskets left and right, but it wouldnt quit!
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Postby 82F100 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:59 am

I posted just to be different. I've had sixes almost all of my driving life.It's also something different.People scoff at you sometimes when you talk about your ride but then again thre's a large majority of Old Schoolers and my generation that like the non cookie cutter, why didn't I think of that stuff aswell. I don't know about some of the other members I'd assume they get the same reaction though, that Kelly gets with her car, the foot traffic that comes by in the pits or at a car show.Seems like its someone older dragging a friend or kid with them to look at the car,taking them back to the good ol' days and they always have a story about a six they owned or a friend owned. I beleive that the Nostalgia and Rat Rod movement have welcomed these motors with open arms and along with strides MR Inliner has made with the performance of these engines and everyone on the forum as well. we'll be around for along time.
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Postby CZLN6 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:14 pm

Howdy All:

Neat mind-grinder Mike. I voted for "others" because I could have said "yes" to all of the above. It might be intersting for you to do a poll on uses. Like; street driven only, daily driver, sunny day driver, track only, street and ocassional track, and maybe some other uses. The point being that I believe there are more of us who get great pleasure out of driving our cars/engines. I also believe that most of us were drawn to the six because we are on a limited budget.

There are several other things that drew me to our six.
*Required ingenuity and problem solving skills- there is no cookie cutter solution to blindly follow. Our engines require some thought and problem solving skills partly because we are rare, and partly because commercial solutions are scarce.
*Satisfaction- Take a grungy, lowly six and make it look good and run better than when it left Henry's garage. Aww, that feels good!
*Reasonably economical- not only in mileage, but in building and maintaining. By that I mean swapping and upgrading parts, scrounging parts, modifying parts. Our projects are comparable to a 10,000 piece jig-saw puzzle. You don't have to do it all at once. You can do some now, and somemore later. With a plan, you can add parts or modify as your time and budget will allow. Progress and satisfaction can come a little at a time.

Well, as usual, I've gone on too long. You shouldn't get me started. Sorry. I did enjoy it though. Oh, did I mention "enjoyment and pride" in marching to a different drummer?

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Postby hasa68mustang » Fri Mar 07, 2008 2:12 pm

hmmm primary reason for building the 6.... because my dad wouldnt let me have a v8, boy did he regret it when he found out his sons I6 with a $100 turbo could beat his 5.0. :lol:
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Postby blueroo » Fri Mar 07, 2008 4:13 pm

Misty came with a six. I hated it at first. I wanted a 427 but brought that down to a 289. Dad liked the idea of a 289, mom said no. I even tried a 221 w/a 1v carb to limit the performance. Mom wouldn't budge.

So I kept the six. At first there were plans of swapping it to a V8 after I turned 18 which was the only way mom would allow a V8. But the six started to grow on me.

With the 40 Series it sounds similar to a small block V8 but it gets more looks at shows because it's different.

For a crate motor, I'd like something that could run with the small blocks and still get decent economy.
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Postby 69Falcon » Fri Mar 07, 2008 4:29 pm

Like I said in your other poll, I use the Falcon as my daily driver. If I could have some mildly improved performance and keep it at 20mpg, I'd be satisfied.
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Postby jamyers » Fri Mar 07, 2008 4:33 pm

For a crate engine, I think a stock engine would be pointless, you could get one done locally easy enough.

If/when I get in the market for an engine or a rebuild, I'll be looking for as much performance as can be had in as stock-appearing engine as possible. I'd pay extra for the internal goodies like pistons, cam, head-work, rockers, etc, but I'd really like to avoid a header (which on these engines prolly makes a lot of internal goodies pointless, I know...).

What'd be way cool would be some cast iron exhaust manifolds that acted like a header, kinda like the EFI 300 ones are supposed to.
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Postby Anlushac11 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 5:19 pm

I want performance and economy and its totally different than a cookie cutter V8.

With gas probably going to hit $4.00 a gallon here soon I want a car that has good performance but gets significantly better gas mileage than a 5.L V8.

People pop the hood of a Fox body expecting to see a V8. They see a long valve cover and assume its a inline 4cyl 2.3L turbo.

Then they realize its too long to be a 4cyl and then the realization its a I6 sets in. The look on their face at that moment is priceless.

While the BMW M3 Coupe has been my role model I do understand Im not likely to get anywhere near that level of performance, but I think I can get close on handling and power to weight ratio.
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Postby Does10s » Fri Mar 07, 2008 5:33 pm

Well, since we're all confessing here......
I owned a '65 ''Stang with a six back in '87 or so and I hated it. To slow. So I sold it. Never owned another one until we picked up Kelly's car.
And the only reason we kept the six in her Falcon was that we "tried" to race it with the 170 and the crowds that came by the pits was unreal.
So being different was the reason we kept it a six. Had we swapped it with a V8, it would've never been in two magazines.

If Kelly's Falcon would've been powered with a 260, then you would've never heard of "Does10s". :cry:

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Postby falcon fanatic » Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:02 pm

Allright, I'll give a real answer. My car came with a six. It a nice, convertible cruiser, not a racecar. I like hotrodding cars. Any car, any engine. the fun is in the doing. Getting power is a little more challenging out of some engines than others. this one's a toughie, but that doesn't mean it can't be done, and it certainly doesn't mean that the doing won't be fun. So, I chose a six 'cause that's what came with the car.
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Postby Geezer 300 » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:42 pm

Why do I have a six?? Was looking for a truck to tow my boat. Came to a choice between a red Ford w/a 302, a yellow GMC w/ a 292, or a tan Ford w/ a 300. Well, red fades real quick in the sun down here. The GMC dealer wouldn't deal with me on what few options I wanted. So that left the truck I got... a BB six I brag about on the SB thread :shock:
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Postby AzCoupe » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:44 pm

Here's my story. About eight years ago my son got his license just before Christmas, so my wife and I decided to buy him a car for X-mas. I had no clue what I was going to buy, but told a friend a mustang would be cool as my first car was a 66GT. Then he told me he had a friend that was selling a 67 with a six. The price was right, and we like the six for two reasons, no power and good economy.

The following summer we decided to restore it, so I let my son drive my pickup while we were working on it. By the time we got it done, my son decided he wanted to keep the pickup. He felt safer driving it and didn't have the emotional ties like I did. It took a while for him to tell me, as he was afraid it was going to hurt my feelings. However, I was having the time of my life working on it, not to mention all the fond memories. Needless to say, we made the swap permanent.

At that point I was sorry I didn't buy a V8. I thought about doing a swap, but I had just installed a fresh motor during the summer, so that was out of the question for the time being. The obvious thing to do, was to look into ways of getting more power out of the six. The more I looked into it, the more I realized how much fun I was having, doing what everyone told me couldn't be done. Of course, I heard the same thing we all have heard a thousands times. I'm the type of person that won't take no for an answer, or someone telling me it can't be done. There's nothing I love more, than proving someone wrong. The rest is history.....

So I guess my reason is, because I can't. :wink:
Last edited by AzCoupe on Sat Mar 08, 2008 2:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby MercuryMarc » Sat Mar 08, 2008 1:36 am

To be different-
Pop the hood at a car show and heads turn!
And of course to be able to "hang out" on this great forum!!!
Thanks for asking!
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Postby FLSHBCK » Sat Mar 08, 2008 9:58 am

To be different.

Originally I kept the six just because it was impractical to switch. The changes to suspension, brakes, and driveline were enough (financially) to dissuade me from doing the swap.

Now I really like the idea of having something a bit different. That said, I'm hoping to squeeze as much performance out of it as I can, and I'm planning on upgrading everything else anyway... 8)
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Postby Harte3 » Sat Mar 08, 2008 9:58 am

I've had a number of v8's...and each time I traded one it was for an I6. Obtaining more performance while retaining a measure of economy has always fascinated me.
A Ranchero, Econoline pick up, Maverick, Fairmont, Chevvy II, Dodge Duster /6, F100, Bronco...except for the Chevvy, I wish I had them all back... My F150 I6 is NOT for sale.
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Postby MrMootsie » Sat Mar 08, 2008 10:10 am

....because I was offered a deal I couldn't pass up on my 65 Mustang vert. Now, I'm going to have about 4K to drop into the engine bay on it. I'd like to do a good street crate engine, but I'm unsure if 4K is going to hack it. If not, I'll just do what I can.
65 200 convertible Mustang, Pony interior, SSBC power discs, Pertronix, 15X7 Konig Rewind Silver, 205/25/15
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Postby LincolnMarkVII » Sat Mar 08, 2008 1:30 pm

I voted "Other" because my reasons are a little bit of everything else mentioned.

Economy is important to me to a point. (I won't be driving a Prius anytime soon, but I'd consider driving an Escape hybrid if I didn't dislike SUVs so much)

Performance is important to me to a point. I don't race or even like any form of racing, even being next to someone at a stoplight whose pants are figuratively on fire.. but I do love enthusiastic driving. My area is perfect for it, with dozens or even hundreds of miles of little-used roads.

Appearance is probably the least important, but still somewhat important. I want something that I like the look of, even if only half a dozen people aside from myself ever get to look under the hood. I'm not a show-off. I could easily drop 30 grand or more tarting up my Fairmont and never let anyone (aside from friends and family) know what I've done outside of obvious exterior changes.. but I want what I see under the hood to please me. As an example of how I feel about appearance vs. appearances, if that makes sense: My ideal car is an Aston Martin DBS, but only driven at night on rural roads.

To be different.. that's a funny one. Yes, I want to be different.. but I don't care whether or not most people know I'm being different.


Mainly I just love the inline 6.. especially Ford I6s.. but any decent non-Chevy I6 (or V12, if you think of it as two I6s stuck together) would do. I'd consider owning something like a Supra or BMW M3 to enjoy a good I6, if I didn't have ambitious plans for the I6 already in my driveway. I'd even love to get to a point where I had enough money to start my own company to design and build unusual engines so I could build (among other things) a W18 consisting of 3 I6s sharing a crank. Anyway, I have plenty of V8s laying around, and I may even build them as well.. but the project that gets the lion's share of my attention is the I6 project.


I'll be very interested in what products you offer for the small Ford I6s. I'm still hoping to stuff a turbo/EFI 250 into my Fairmont soon. I'm definitely interested in the new head, for example. Assuming all else goes to plan, and the economy doesn't get to Great Depression levels of awfulness, I should be starting my main project within the next 12 months.
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Postby Ba Mustang » Sat Mar 08, 2008 2:20 pm

Asa wrote: i didn't have the money to swap to a V8 and i enjoyed being different



That is why i still have my I6. My friends says go V8 all the time says the I6 sucks. I told him " I dont like being the same, I want to be different."" My car is original with the I6, yours is V8 and isn't."
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Postby Asa » Sat Mar 08, 2008 11:14 pm

jamyers wrote:For a crate engine, I think a stock engine would be pointless, you could get one done locally easy enough.

i don't know about that
the only way i know of a decent machine shop in town is because my dad's friend has been working here for forever, if i hadn't known him i would have to search all over
i'm not even gonna mention getting one from autozoo or wherever

i can see the point of doing a mostly stock crate engine, not a completely stock one though
Right and Wrong are just words, what matters is what you do

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Postby jamyers » Sat Mar 08, 2008 11:52 pm

MercuryMarc wrote:To be different-
Pop the hood at a car show and heads turn!
And of course to be able to "hang out" on this great forum!!!
Thanks for asking!

Amen to both points. Last year I was at the major annual Cruise Night for around here, lots of high-dollar and rare cars (like a hemi Superbird with 7K miles). The Ranchero was parked next to a really nice and clean 'Cuda with a 6-pack and all the goodies, but guess which one got more attention and comments? Heh.

And this place rocks as well. 8)
James - '62 Ranchero (200cid), '71 LeSabre (464cid)

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Postby 66shelby » Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:43 pm

I bought both my daughters 6's intentionally to keep them under 100 mph.
Then I figured out I could maintain the engine while standing, change oil, swap starter, etc.
Now the convertible is mine.
I was inspired by BMW to go the turbo route and keep the six "to be different".
Then I found Ford Six and saw I wasn't alone.
I have a V8 Fastback that gets 13 mpg and a 250 Convertible that gets 20 mpg.
They both rate very high on the spg (Smiles per gallon) !!!!
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Postby ludwig » Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:51 pm

Why a six? Well, why does one guy like liver jerky and another guy like lima bean custard? As a great man once said: "It just bees that way." I forgot who it was, but it was in the 60s.

Me? I like it because I can fix it myself and nobody who has a lick of sense would steal it.
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Postby Mustangaroo » Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:01 pm

To Be Different
I have had such great comments about my Mustang and it's Supercharged Inline Six. As far a crate motors, I'd make a mild 120-150 HP and one 200-250 HP :shock:
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reasons changed

Postby bazza102 » Mon Mar 10, 2008 5:52 pm

bought a 71 nz falcon as a gt replica that i thought i could enhance. but paying the money on the sound of the 351 clivo exhaust note and assesing body in rain and at night was not a good idea. eventually swopped all v8 parts into sound body and was left with a recently recond 6. fixed replica body, repaint, 2v head,triplle oers, cam, toyota 4 speed etc. now used for towing race car. the amount of interest when you lift bonnet, the brain power that required to come up with new ideas for motor is way more fun. not following like a lemming has its own satisfaction.

whilst i voted for other it was only because i couldnt vote for performance and other together, because in my book they are equal
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Postby 66 Fastback » Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:01 pm

Other: Because it was there.

If it had a 4 cyl or a straight 8, I would have kept / rebuilt whatever came in the vehicle.
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Postby woodbutcher » Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:24 pm

:D They are fun and different.
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Postby Billr57 » Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:17 pm

I DARE to be Different.

"That's awesome! Nice engine.
You have balls to show a 'stang without a V8, too."


The swap to a V8 has been done to death, anyone can do the V8 thing. But to do a Inline it takes some serious thinking and planing, you can go to places like Jegs and Summit and order anything you want for a V8, Just try to do that with a Inline.

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Postby xctasy » Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:28 am

I'll never own a V8 Ford, they are crap.

Down here, the I6 is the easiest Ford engine to get, easiest Ford engine to repair...even if you can blow it up, you can still rebuild it in one weekend.

All my mates with thin wall small block 289's, 302W's, 351w's 351C's were practically broke after building there Falcons and Cortinas, and those engines are fundamentally flawed due to either poor head or block castings, or detonation issues on modern gas.

Servicing the small blocks with good ignition and fuel systems was a nightmare, and any hop-up gear was expensive. The power figures (my mate Blairs had 375 hp, did 12-18 US miles per gallon) created axle and drivetrain problems, and the cost of really good manual gearboxes was huge.

I had to work to a budget, and over here I6 Falcons and Cortinas come with reasonable stock axles which can take 250 foot pounds without going exothermic, there are plenty of alternative ratios, any number of good manual gearboxes, and there is so much fun picking up a junked Ford I6, and rebuilding the engine into something wild.


My mate Richie taught me a lot, a shoestring budget, and a 165 hp EFI 4.1 Cortina 5-speed, and he had a 351 Falcon Ute before he saw the light.
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Postby shmoozo » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:11 pm

Which few crate engines to develop and build? I'm guessing you're talking small sixes here, so I'd say the following general builds might be something like what the market would go for.

The Stage 1 build ("the upscale daily driver"):

* Classic Inlines Head
* Classic Inlines 4 barrel intake with either a large 2 barrel carb or a small to medium 4 barrel carb (whatever actually works best)
* A mild performance cam which will give smooth idle, good fuel economy, and "significantly better-than-stock" performance when combined with the rest of the build
* hypereutectic pistons which produce a compression ratio that is perhaps slightly higher than stock, but which will still let the engine run on regular unleaded
* An electronic ignition of some sort
* Shorty headers or (if you can develop it in time) a "header-like" cast iron exhaust manifold which is either a dual 3-into-1 design something like the big six's EFI exhaust manifolds, or a really swoopy 6-into-one design
* compatible with both manual or automatic transmissions, but might require a torque converter with slighter higher stall speed than stock if used with an automatic

The Stage 1.5 build ("the upscale daily driver with a brain"):

* similar to the stage 1 build, but switch to an EFI induction comprised of a Classic Inlines 4 barrel intake with a fuel rail, injectors, sensors, a simple, low-cost, OEM throttle body of appropriate size (from a large displacement factory EFI 6 of some sort perhaps?), wiring harness and some sort of pre-programmed EFI controller (The idea here is to have it be as close to a bolt-in EFI set up as possible.)

The Stage 2 build ("the weekend cruiser"):

* Classic Inlines Head
* Classic Inlines 4 barrel intake with an appropriately sized 4 barrel carb
* A mid-range performance cam which will produce an idle with no more than a slight bit of lope, give reasonable fuel economy, and even better performance
* hypereutectic pistons which produce a compression ratio that will generally require a grade gasoline better than regular unleaded, but not necessarily premium
* A better electronic ignition, but not necessarily a DUI
* Long-tube headers or shorty headers as dictated by what can fit into the engine bay into which it will be dropped
* manual transmission recommended, but could perhaps work with an automatic if used with a torque converter with a higher stall speed than stock

The Stage 2.5 build ("the weekend cruiser with a brain"):

* similar to the stage 2 build, but switch to an EFI induction comprised of a Classic Inlines 4 barrel intake with a fuel rail, injectors, sensors, a simple, low-cost, OEM throttle body of appropriate size (from a stock small block V8 of some sort perhaps?), wiring harness and some sort of pre-programmed EFI controller (The idea here is again to have it be as close to a bolt-in EFI set up as possible.)

The Stage 3 build ("the weekend warrior"):

* A CNC ported and polished Classic Inlines Head
* Classic Inlines 4 barrel intake with an appropriately sized 4 barrel carb
* A "street-strip" performance cam which will likely idle with more lope than stage 2 and yield even better performance
* hypereutectic (or forged?) pistons which produce a compression ratio that will require premium grade gasoline
* An upscale electronic ignition like a DUI or something comparable
* Long-tube headers or shorty headers as dictated by what can fit into the engine bay into which it will be dropped
* manual transmission required

The Stage 3.5 build ("the weekend warrior with a brain"):

* similar to the stage 3 build, but switch to triple two-throat, side draft, throttle body injection units on a Classic Inlines intake manifold of some sort, and all the other goodies required for a screaming EFI system

The Stage 4 build ("the rocket"):

* Two words: Forced induction. (I'll leave it to you to work out the rest.)

You've probably noticed that I've left out all the boring details on these engines like fasteners, timing chain sets, connecting rods, fuel pumps, gaskets, bearings, and seals, but I'm sure you could work out which bits and pieces to use on these things.

Frankly, I tend to think you would sell mostly stage 1 and stage 2 engines, a smaller number of stage 1.5, stage 2.5 and stage 3 engines, an even smaller number of stage 3.5 engines and perhaps a handful of stage 4 engines.

If I had to narrow it down to just 3 of them for you to add to your offerings, I'd say the stage 1, stage 2 and either the stage 3 engine or perhaps either the stage 1.5 or 2.5 engine would be the ones to work on first. They shouldn't be too difficult to develop, and I would expect them to be the ones that are most likely to sell well enough to help fund the development of the more potent engines.

If I had to narrow it down to just 2 of them for you to add to your offerings, I'd say either the stage 1 and the stage 2 engines or the stage 2 and stage 3 engines would be the obvious ones to work on first. They shouldn't be too difficult to develop, and I would expect them to be the ones that are most likely to sell well enough to help fund the development of the more potent engines.

If you only wanted to begin with one, I'd probably begin with the stage 2 engine as the first offering. I really think it is the one that would be the best balance of attracting attention to your overall crate engine project while also being a model that would actually sell well enough to give you the funds to get the other models of the crate engine line developed. After that, either the stage 1 engine or the stage 3 engine would probably be a good choice.

By the time you get the first two offerings available I think you'd have a better idea of what people were looking for in these crate engines so you'd get a better handle on what direction you really ought to go next with them.
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