200 4 bearing crank vs 7 bearing crank confusion

[PhilOO]

Can someone please set me straight?

I've got the book "Ford Falcon 6 cylinder Performance Handbook"
It states that 200 with 5 frost (welsh) plugs are 7 bearing crank.
It states that the US 200's went from 4 to 7 bearing in like 1964.
Also gives engine number prefixes that are either 4 or 7 bearing.

Well I have just pulled 2 engines from cars (XM & XP don't know if engine is orig), popped off the sump only to find they were 4 bearing, even though all the info above predicted they would be 7 bearing.

I am looking for early 7 bearing 200. (ie predating the switch to 188/221 in the XT) Did they exist in Australia? Was the XR 200 7 bearing, or did we wait till a later model before went to 7 bearing (like XA)?

Thanks

 

[addo]

The XR series 170 and 200 were seven main. I have one in an XP Falcon. Your giveaway detail, is that bellhousing pattern is the later style used until the last XFs, and uses a flat flywheel if manual.

The XR 170/200s also use a 52-link timing set, like later models. I don't see why you couldn't squeeze a 221 crank into a 200 XR block and use some lower crown height pistons...

 

[PhilOO]

Thanks, for that. Gives me 2 more questions:

1. If I couple the XR 200 to a C4 whats involved with getting it into an XM which was 2 speed Fordmatic. (I want a C4 coz its stronger & I have the option of putting a valve body in it.)

2. Has anyone put a 221 crank in a 200. I was wondering if it clears everything. I am changing pistons anyway so I like the idea. So you are saying keep the 200 rods? I will end up with a 221 that looks like a 200 externally.

cheers

 

[gb500]

phil -

are you saying that the xm and xp blocks had the 5 welsh(freeze)plugs and when you took crank out they were only 4 bearing ?

or are you saying that as they are post 64 they should be 7 main bearings but were infact 4?

are they definitly 200's?

you may have some trans tunnel mods to fit the C4 into theXM ( as you need to with fitting the 3 speed bw35)- unless its a large tunnel XM
look at this link:

http://www.stormloader.com/falconccwa/v8hint.htm



brett

melb

 

[PhilOO]

phil -

are you saying that the xm and xp blocks had the 5 welsh(freeze)plugs and when you took crank out they were only 4 bearing ?

YES

or are you saying that as they are post 64 they should be 7 main bearings but were infact 4?

NOT SURE

THE BOOK CLAIMS THAT IN 1964-1965 THEY WENT TO 7 MAINS 5 FROST PLUGS, ENGINE NO C5DE ONWARDS. ELSEWHERE I THINK IT SAID EARLIER ONES ARE THREE PLUG. BOTH WERE 5 PLUG WITH 4 MAIN. I NEED TO GO BACK & RECORD ALL THE ENGINE NUMBERS. SO DONT KNOW IF THE 7 BEARING EXISTED IN XP OR WAS PURE XR. REGARDLESS ITS THE ENGINE I WANT I THINK.

are they definitly 200's?

I MEASURED THE BORES OF BOTH AT ABOUT 3.68" (JUST WITH VERNIERS) THEY WERE DEFINATELY MORE THAN THE 3.5" OF A 170, ONE WAS ABOUT .030" OVER THE 3.68

you may have some trans tunnel mods to fit the C4 into theXM ( as you need to with fitting the 3 speed bw35)- unless its a large tunnel XM
look at this link:

http://www.stormloader.com/falconccwa/v8hint.htm

THANKS. I WILL STUDY CLOSELY. I DON'T WANT TO CUT MY BODY, THE CAR IS TOO GOOD. ANY MODS HAVE TO BE EASY TO PUT BACK TO ORIGINAL

brett

melb

CHEERS
PHIL
NOT YELLING - JUST USED UPPERCASE TO STAND OUT FROM YOURS

 

[gb500]

thanks -
not that i am an expert - but i didnt think they made 5 welsh plugs with only 4 mains cranks.allways a learning experience

if you have the 2 speed auto then you will have a narrow block six. the 3 speeds and later (ie XR onwards) have a wide block . this refers
to the gearbox /auto mounting lugs.

i have a narrow block 200 at sitting at home that has a 1/4" adapter plate to go from narrow block to 3 speed auto.

it has the 5 welsh plugs - havent taken the sump off to see if its 4 bearings or 7 bearings.


i would take with a pinch of salt the US book re change of bearings as i this may only apply to american production- not real sure though.



i think the 4 mains are sturdy enough for a 40 year old car to cruise in- unless you are wanting to go every where at 6000rpm.....

the best /easiest swap is to look for a 221 engine- extra power + 7 bearings and 'generally' accepted as being within the +10% eng capacity increase allowed by the rego authorities for engine rebuilds.



there was on ebay a month or so ago a bellhousing to go from ford six to C4.

search australian ebay in completed items for item number:

320210243973.

for a picture - probably by dellow

have alook at this link - bloke putting a 3 speed ( ie BW35) into an XM - which has pics of his hump panel beating.- but its not a C4

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread ... ge=3&pp=25


Brett
melb.

 

[PhilOO]

thanks Brett

i just joined fordforums another great resource.

i reckon I will go the 221 route if I can find an engine for recon.

cheers