Fuel Octane

[peeeot]

Guys, I'm sorry if this is a beaten-to-death topic, but I seem to be completely inept at using the search function because I seldom get usable results

I'm just wondering what grade fuel is recommended for a stock 200. I assume it has hardened valves since it's been rebuilt, but I don't know.

I've been using 87 and it seems to run well with no pinging, so as far as I can tell there's no reason to start using 89 or 93. Any thoughts?

 

[wallaka]

Use the lowest octane that doesn't ping. Anything more is a waste of money.

 

[page62]

Use the lowest octane that doesn't ping. Anything more is a waste of money.

What he said.

 

[The Plankster Prankster]

i agree, but NEVER use the discount brands, as they will destroy your fuel economy and your engine. around here that means ARCO and 7-11/CITGO. don't know what brands are near you, but you know which ones.
funny thing is, i ran that trash in the F150 for awhile, switched to good quality fuel, and saved enough fuel to actually spend less money per mile when using the good brands
i would never have thought to switch until i vowed never to set foot in that store again. ever. but that wasn't a fuel reason, that was personal

 

[CobraSix]

Name brands are a misnomer for fuel. CITGO is a name brand as is ARCO. Heck, I buy most of my fuel from Lukoil now (the main russian oil company) because of price, full service (for cheaper then most self serve), and the amount of fuel they move because how busy they are.

What you want to avoid is the mom and pop small service stations that don't tend to move enough fuel to keep the ethanol in the tanks from condensating (in the summer) or gelatonizing (sp?) during the winter.

Otherwise, no need to use higher grade fuel unless you anticipate a trip that is going to take you into higher elevations then normal. Then you may want to spend the extra on higher octane.

 

[fordconvert]

Name brands are a misnomer for fuel. CITGO is a name brand as is ARCO.

Most markets it all comes out the same pipe line or 2. Its just the additive pack that could change based on 'brand'.

Heck, I buy most of my fuel from Lukoil now (the main russian oil company) because of price, full service (for cheaper then most self serve), and the amount of fuel they move because how busy they are.

What you want to avoid is the mom and pop small service stations that don't tend to move enough fuel to keep the ethanol in the tanks from condensating (in the summer) or gelatonizing (sp?) during the winter.

Otherwise, no need to use higher grade fuel unless you anticipate a trip that is going to take you into higher elevations then normal. Then you may want to spend the extra on higher octane.

I agree, this is good info.

 

[Bort62]

Funny, because I use the cheapest gas I can find in my honda and track my fuel mileage obsessivly.

It's pretty damn consistent. Never noticed an increase when I was forced to buy
"name brand" fuel.

I guess the gas-and-go around the corner must run their own refinery somewhere if their gasoline is different from the "name brand" gas

And funny that I saw a truck with a "name brand" logo pumping gas into their tanks.

 

[ludwig]

When I was in high school, I dated a girl who's father was a regional manager for APCO gasoline. Now you probably wouldn't know that name if you were not familiar with FINA or SPUR or HOLIDAY or - in Canada - L'AiGLE D'OR gas.

As he explained it to me, these were all third tier providers who bought remaindered gas on the spot market. That means that at the time, they would accept end and short loads from primarily second an sometimes first tier providers where the full amount was undeliverable and there was product left over. They would accept this at their storage facility or even pump it into the tanks at the local station. I remember seeing a Phillips 66 unloading at a SPUR station. Wow.

"All the majors share the pipelines. Except Standard (American). They have their own pipelines," he told me. This is still true today.

Third tier merchants would also collect the remaindered fuel from large tank clean-outs and pipeline purges. That is where one product is put in a pipeline behind product from another supplier and marked with styro balls or some non-miscous substance where they met. Just before and just after the 'brand-name' product there was some mixing of product along with the markers. They would buy this and clean it up. Naturally it was of variable quality or characteristics.

These sources were undependable and that was one reason why you might drive into a third tier station and find no regular or no super on a given day.

Most of these were bought up by the majors or driven out of business. 7-11 cut an exclusive deal with Citgo (a second-tier midwestern and southern/western company) when they got to sell gas in most states. Some places still forbid gas where they sell beer or outlaw 'self-serve' as in Oregon. Did you ever notice how the brands are arrayed north to south and not east to west across the US? That is because the pipelines all run north to south. The dealers line up along the pipelines.

Anyway, the second-tier product is still inconsistent and often stored or held in vessels (trucks, tanks, underground mom n' pop tanks) that are not clean or well maintained. Often it is delivered from a common supplier terminal, like the refinery south of Mpls/St Paul according to individual recipes. Sometimes this product is a bit mixed or of variable quality due to the variety of recipes they deliver.

High volume merchants of major brands have the resources to deliver consistent product and require their merchants to maintain the good condition of the storage and pumping facilities.

 

[Harte3]

Ditto for diesel. PILOT buys spot market fuel...and makes Lucas rich. Petro Stopping centers seem to have the most consistent fuel and they have their own additive package.

 

[Eric Rose]

I always get my fuel at Quik Trip because they always have a high turnover and they are also usually the cheapest around because they make more of their money from the convinience store than the pumps.

I don't know who their supplier is, but if I find out its Exxon Mobil I will to find somewhere else to fuel up. I tried to reaserch who their supplier is but their website didn't say : Guess I will have to call their corporate offices.

Different elevations have different formulations of gas too. I filled up my VW Jetta in Bristol, TN and went to West Virginia. I was struggling to get up the mountains. When I refueled in West Virginia it was like I got back the power I had lost.

 

[peeeot]

Seems like an awful lot to think about when picking someplace to fill up. I usually use Crown these days, though for a long while I used Exxon most of the time. The only reason for the switch is that crown is consistently cheaper, though of course we're talking less than 10 cents difference.

I've heard that different fuel can make as much as a 10% difference in economy, but there are so many other factors involved with computed economy for a given tank that I'm not sure I'd trust my own results. It would take months of careful monitoring to come up with convincing results, and there are so many local stations that finding the best one might take a year. I'm working on the assumption that each tank takes a couple weeks to empty and that maybe 5 tankfulls are enough to provide convincing data.

I'll definitely keep running 87.

 

[CobraSix]

Yeah, it's a lot of information. The one answer it points to is there are too many variables to come to a good answer as to who has the best gas.

I just recommend the cheapest place you can find that is convienent and has a relatively high volume of traffic so the fuel does not get old. Old ethanol fuel can reak havoc on a carb'd engine. Even more on 2 stroke marine engines (EFI or Carb). I can't count how many fuel systems I've had to get overhauled on customers boats from letting the fuel sit for 2 months.

I used to try to avoid the Exxon's and such...until I researched and realized how futile that effort was. Like previously mentioned...it all comes from the same places and same companies.

 

[ludwig]

Read it an weep, all you petroleum consumer advocates:

http://www.us-highways.com/sohist1999.htm

 

[Lazy JW]

... I'm working on the assumption that each tank takes a couple weeks to empty and that maybe 5 tankfulls are enough to provide convincing data.....

Yup. And by then the formulation will probably change depending on where you live. There are different formulations for winter gas and summer gas, plus the erratic levels of oxygenates..... it really is about futile.

As mentioned above, just find something local that works for you, preferably a high-traffic station that keeps plenty of fresh fuel.

I always use the discount brands; never had any problems that I know of but reckon I could just be too dumb to know it
Joe

 

[Bort62]

I wish each tank took a couple of weeks to empty, where are you guys living? lol.

Out here in Commutifornia, I go through 400 miles a week.

 

[addo]

300-odd (miles)/wk here, typically.

One thing that people can do before pointing the finger, is track fuel usage via an Excel spreadsheet. The catch is, you really need to run it right down and refill fully each time for the most consistent/accurate findings. You need to fill in each of the categories and then manipulate the figures...

Date - Qty (gal) - Price - Distance - MPG - MPG averaged - Brand - Notes

Notes would include such things as unusual traffic events (changed engine conditions), variations to load or tyre pressure, different octane rating.

Oddly enough, it tends to stop a lot of the misapprehensions dead.

 

[Bort62]

300-odd (miles)/wk here, typically.

One thing that people can do before pointing the finger, is track fuel usage via an Excel spreadsheet. The catch is, you really need to run it right down and refill fully each time for the most consistent/accurate findings. You need to fill in each of the categories and then manipulate the figures...

Date - Qty (gal) - Price - Distance - MPG - MPG averaged - Brand - Notes

Notes would include such things as unusual traffic events (changed engine conditions), variations to load or tyre pressure, different octane rating.

Oddly enough, it tends to stop a lot of the misapprehensions dead.

Funny because I've done exactly that for the last 5 years. It is depressing to see how much money you spend on gas lol.

I buy the cheapest gas possible, and the correct octane for my vehicle.

My '98 Ranger get's 1 mpg more (24) with 89 as opposed to 87, no increase w/ 91. Synthetic oil made no difference.

My honda shows no increase with anything over 87.

No discernable difference with brand. I get a consistent 30 with my honda in mixed city/hwy commute as long as don't go above ~ 70 mph. Crusing at 80 mixed with city gets me approx 28.

Cruising at 55-60 mph nets 34 mpg! I try to hold ~ 65.

I'm not going to disclose how much I've spent on gas in the last 5 years, but I bet it would make some of you blush

 

[Eric Rose]

I wish each tank took a couple of weeks to empty, where are you guys living? lol.
.

I drive from Athens to Cartersville (about 200 miles round trip) every weekend. And thats in a V8 Grand Marquis. I do take another passenger who splits the gas money sometimes so its not as bad as it could be, but it is still a lot of money spent on gas

 

[addo]

Surely you can get 22-odd MPG because it's "steady state" operation with minimal loading? That's about $35 presently for the round trip.

 

[Bort62]

That's nothin. I am commuting 80 miles a day to work @ 4.25 a gallon!

Then, if I decide to drive down to work on the ranchero on the weekend (which I always do) that adds another 150 miles a week.

So 550 a week / 30 is ~ 18.5 gallons a week. @ 4.25 a gallon that's $78 a week, 311 a month, and 4044 a year

You gotta love living in CA to wanna be here