HP increase with M90

66Sprint6

66Sprint6

Famous Member
Hey,
I was wondering, what percent increase of horsepower would I possibly be lookin at if I put an Eaton M90 on my 200 (25%-40% being an example). Also, how "changeable" is the boost settings on these superchargers??? I have no clue so I ask,
ALSO,
With the mods done below, Dual out header, port divider, 40 series flows, Holley 2300 carb, Duraspark II, K&N filter, Head ported, 3 angle valve job, how much Horsepower (rough guess) do you think I would be putting to the crank/ground??? Thanx again guys!!!!!!!!
Matt
 
how changeable?
if i'm correct, all you gotta do to get more or less boost is swap out a pulley
you make that as hard as you want to

sidenote/tangent directed to AzCoupe:
Mike, how is your supercharger project coming along? last i heard it was possibly getting scrapped because of lak of interest
 
Ive seen where MSD had an ignition box that had a boost switch, will thgat change anything with the supercharger???? Is it worth getting the ignition with the timing retard for the supercharger???
Add that to the other questions above!
Matt
 
Where do you propose to mount this? I realise this is not an answer to your horsepower question, but a consideration. One of the reasons, in fact, that a turbo is easier...
 
Some sort of ignition retard is needed with any forced air application. You need to retard the timing based on boost pressure. But that has nothing to do with boost.

Several ways you can control boost. Pulley size as mentioned before. The other is a Blow off Valve. I'm not sure if the later would really work though for your applications. It's used more for turbos to protect the turbo and engine from boost spikes during shifts (the turbo lags both before and after giving it gas). I'm sure the same principle applies for a supercharger.

the M90 will be a tough one to mount, even on the driver's side. I looked at it and did some measurements, and the dizzy gets in the way, or will be very close.

Another option, though more expensive is a centrifugal supercharger like a vortech or paxton (I think they are the same company now). They are a little bit smaller and may pose less of a problem.

to your question though, the amount of HP will be dependent upon the amount of boost. In theory, if you were to run 7.2 PSI of boost, you can expect about 50-60% gains. The reason is that a 7.2PSI you are at 150% volumetric efficiency where a NA engine is aroudn 80% VE. you have 70% more air and Fuel, which should translate to around 70% increase in HP...in theory. HP and power in general is linked to how much fuel and air you engine can efficient combust.

so...stock with the modifications you talk about, will get you around 80-90 RWHP. Take 50% of that and you should be aroudn 120-130 RWHP I would guess at 7 PSI.

But one thing I'm unsure, are you going to be using the stock 1v log head? Those estimate are for that. Also, consider doing a hotter cam before supercharger, that will help a lot. Or at least do a cam swap when you put the supercharger in.

Another issue with the M90, is you have to do draw thru with the carb. This can both help and hurt you situation. It means you'll have to remote locate the carb before the supercharger. Most cars get around then by putting the supercharger on top of the manifold and after the carb. This can help you locate the carb and supercharger to a more desirable location. The other way I saw to make it fit without interferance (and I hope you don't have AC or PS, is to move it out from the engine some on the drivers side (about 5 inches from the side of the block) and brace it from there to the engine. Means a long pulley run. mount in sideways, and you should have enough clearance, but you have to figure something out with the carb.

Good luck.

Slade
 
If I were to look into a Paxton, which model would I get. I have that issue of Mustang Illustrated where the guys is pullin 201 HP with the log intake and stock exhaust. It also appears that you can leave the Carb where it is with the paxton. Im glad Im askin all this now cause I want to be able to make a good decision when it comes time to get this thing goin.
Matt
 
Don't know if you've looked at this sight. Great information:

www.superchargersonline.com

There are a lot of articles there. Very well written, though a little base at times.

As far as what paxton, I'd say a 302 6psi kit would probably do well. You can run it through the carb in it's existing location, but the carb would have to have modications done to the power valve. Blow thru set ups (like paxton) are generally more advantagious then draw thru. They react better, though a little tougher to tune from what I've read.

Slade
 
so say around maybe $600 for the supercharger, $200 for a 500cfm Holly carb., am i missing something or the cost of a blow-through setup will run you about $1100??
thanks
 
Get a copy of Mustang Mmonthly April 02. On page 36-37 is 64 1/2 Mustang 200 with a Paxton! This mostly stock car puts out 201 HP at the Wheels and 222LBFT of torque! :shock: Russell
 
66mustang200":35z8kdjq said:
so say around maybe $600 for the supercharger, $200 for a 500cfm Holly carb., am i missing something or the cost of a blow-through setup will run you about $1100??
thanks
Click to expand...
You don't need the bigger carb on a blow-thru.
What you're missing is the mounting bracket and pulleys which are a custom proposition. You also need to do something about a boost referenced fuel supply and a boost retarded ignition. Get a copy of Mac Innes' book Turbochargers The means of driving the impeller is different but everything else is the same.
 
now I looked at the paxtons and saw alot of them claiming only like 7.5 psi, I read somewhere that the M90 was capable of like 12. Am I wrong??? Oh well, I want to be able to get ALOT out of it, get into the 200 HP range like the car in the Mustang Monthly. It doesnt appear that that white stang has an intercooler, and it has a stock exhasut, so how in the world is he getting 200 horses???? I want some of that!!! Any ideas?
Matt
 
Within reasonable limits, boost is NOT a function of the blower, it's a function of how fast you spin it and of the pressure controls you have put in place to run it. The reason that many street blowers are rated at 6-7 PSI is that you generally cannot put more boost into an otherwise stock engine without risking major damage. If you want to run 12-14 PSI or more, you need to build the bottom end to take it. An intercooler makes the blower more efficient but generally isn't needed for moderate boost levels
 
With a blow thru system (in my opinion a better set up in theory, I haven't tried building mine yet) you'll need a carb that references manifold pressure in relation to boost pressure. Two ways around this. Either build a metal box around your carb that the blower pushes air into (a lot of V-8 carbed chargers systems do this). Then you won't need a special carb. You need the pressure equalized or you run the risk of blowing you power valve out. The other option is a blowthru carb. Holley makes a 600 CFM blow thru supercharger carb that is a 4V.

If you are sticking with a stock head, I would consider making a box and adapting a 2V carb to your log intake with a pressure box built around that.

Intercoolers will always help you. How much and how noticable the help will be depends on your set up. Like Strange was saying, at low boost, an intercooler won't have a huge effect, but it will help detonation problems. Intercoolers generally aren't used until 10psi +.

Good luck.

Slade
 
Ok, another question, if I were to run the M90, reposition the carb through an intercooler at say 10psi of boost, would it be a good idea to have a blow off valve for when I let off the throttle real hard, say on the interstate or at the end of a run. I think I will try to mount the carb to the M90 somehow on the driver's side. I havnt looked into it very much but it seems like it will be more in my price range to go with the M90. I think I might rebuild my bottom end more to take more boost. What should I do, I dont have alot of money to throw around, but I would like to prepare the block for as much boost as I can get out of the little M90. Is it possible to actually get 10+ psi with an eaton off a SC tbird??? Again, my goal is around 200+ hp
Matt
 
What exactly are you trying to do here? I'm assuming that with an Eaton and a carb, you're looking at a draw-through system (i.e. the carb is connected to the inlet of the blower and the blower draws fuel/air mixture through itself and pumps it into the engine.) You cannot use an intercooler with a draw-through. There is far too much danger of fuel puddling out and creating an explosion hazard. Intercoolers aren't all that easy to implement with a positive displacement blower anyway.

200 HP isn't necessarily all that much for a boosted 200. How fast are you willing to spin it to get there?
 
Can't use an intercooler on a drawthru for the exact reason that Ranger said.

One advantage of the draw through especially with the log head, is that you can mount the M90 and the carb on teh driver's side and leave the log head as is. That way you can get a 2v or 4V carb without major mods to the head.

You can get 10 PSI out of a M90, but you'll get a lot of heat as well I would imagine.

Also, more info on the M90: http://www.automotive.eaton.com/product ... s/M90.html

Slade
 
Im lookin to get good boost and try to get my car safely, and driveably into the 200+ hp range. I didnt even think about the fuel goin through the charger deal dangit... I saw that the SC Tbirds had intercoolers on them, thats why I was wondering. I guess that rules out a blow off valve as well???? Would that mean I should inject water to keep detonation at a minimum???? Oh well, I wish I could find a good charger that would get me into the 200's easy with good boost, leave the carb where it is and run an intercooler and maybe blow off valve as well for as little money as an M90 would run. Oh well, any other suggestions???? Im out of ideas guys, so far Im gonna prolly stick to the M90, but if theres something better, Ide like to hear it
Matt
 
Superchargers aren't inherently blow-through or draw through although there frequently are some minor differences in the seal configurations. When used with EFI that is usually a dry system (equivalent of a blow-through.) When used with a carb, it is much simpler to set it up as a draw-through. There would be a ton of fabrication work to rig it up as a blow through
 
But I COULD make that M90 a blow thru? I saw in that Mustang Monthly, his car has the carb in the stock place on the intake. I would really like that set up alot!!!! It just seems like it would be better for me. I thought I could do it, but now I dunno anymore. Is there any way I can do it blow thru with the M90, put it on the driver's side. Basically I like the way that Mustang Monthly car has his set up and would like to duplicate with an Eaton M90, intercooler and leave the carb where it is. Guess Ill just have to give it a try huh, lol
Matt
 
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