Motor Oils with Zinc

I know this is a subject that has been discussed in the past, but I am not sure whether there has been any recent topics concerning whether or not there are still some motor oils that contain zinc?? I know that Shell's Rotella Oil (diesel motor oil) supposedly contained zinc at one time, but I do not know if that still holds true. I have a fairly new rebuilt 200cid engine with hardened valves, and am also wondering if there is any concern of whether or not a motor oil has zinc in it since the engine has hardened valves?? I guess my bigger question, is what oil are you using, and is there any further updates on which oils (if any?) have zinc in them??? Thanks!

James, oils which contain zinc are valvoline racing it comes in 10W-30, 20W-50 or 30 & 50.

Mike, also caries Brad Penn oil which contains the necessary additives.

I also thing royal purple racing contains the necessary additives for flat lifter camshafts.

Joe Gibbs also sells the good stuff.

Another option is use your own choice of regular oil & add comp cams or Schneider cams additive which contains all the necessary additives.

There are other options available but that will give you a place to start. Bill

I'm using Kendall GT-1 Conventional 10W-40 motor oil. It's what was recommended by the engine builder I used because he uses it in his race engines. Kendall10W-40 Specs

EDIT: The 10w-40 has zinc in it, the 20w-50 has more zinc in it.

Stephen

I have gone to some of the oil manufactures web sites to check oil analisis. they list the product analasis which show zinc and other additive levels.some have changed in the recent years and don't have enough anti scuff agents to support a flat tappet cam. zinc levels in motor oil seems to be a factor in the breakin and longevity of flat tappet cams. some have issues at breakin and others don't . I know brad penn and valvoline racing oil have higher levels of zinc. I asked a friend who owns a speed shop and races flat tappet engines and he recommends a premium conventional oil ( no synthetics or blends) with a bottle of crane cams or comp cams breakin additive at every oil change. he say it is what most of the nostalgia racers use. I run valvoline conventional 10w30 with a bottle of crane breakin additive. I only have about 600 miles on the new engine though.

There are oodles of oils analyzed over here, both used and virgin samples:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php
I also found this list over at Jalopy Journal.
I was surprised that there are oils that do not contain zinc:

I've done some research. Here is the zinc content of todays oils:

20W-50
AMSOIL (old) none
AMSOIL (new) none
Castrol GTX .12
Exxon High Performance .11
Havoline Formula 3 none
Kendall GT-1 .16
Pennzoil GT Perf. none
Quaker State Dlx. none
Red Line none
Shell Truck Guard .15
Spectro Golden 4 .15
Spectro Golden M.G. .13
Unocal .12
Valvoline All Climate .11
Valvoline Turbo .13
Valvoline Race .20
Valvoline Synthetic .12

20W-40
AMSOIL none
Castrol Multi-Grade .12
Quaker State none

15W-50
Chevron .11
Mobil 1 none
Mystic JT8 .15
Red Line none

5W-50
Castrol Syntec .10
Quaker State Synquest none
Pennzoil Performax none

5W-40
Havoline none

15W-40
AMSOIL (old) none
AMSOIL (new) none
Castrol .14
Chevron Delo 400 none
Exxon XD3 .14
Exxon XD3 Extra .13
Kendall GT-1 .16
Mystic JT8 .15
Red Line none
Shell Rotella w/XLA .13
Valvoline All Fleet .15
Valvoline Turbo .13

10W-30
AMSOIL (old) none
AMSOIL (new) none
Castrol GTX .12
Chevron Supreme .11
Exxon Superflo Hi Perf 135 .11
Exxon Superflo Supreme 133 .13
Havoline Formula 3 none
Kendall GT-1 .16
Mobil 1 none
Pennzoil PLZ Turbo none
Quaker State none
Red Line none
Shell Fire and Ice .12
Shell Super 2000 .13
Shell Truck Guard .15
Spectro Golden M.G. none
Unocal Super .12
Valvoline All Climate .11
Valvoline Turbo .13
Valvoline Race .20
Valvoline Synthetic .12

5W-30
AMSOIL (old) none
AMSOIL (new) none
Castrol GTX .12
Chevron Supreme .11
Chevron Supreme Synt. .12
Exxon Superflow HP .11
Havoline Formula 3 none
Mobil 1 none
Mystic JT8 .1
Quaker State none
Red Line none
Shell Fire and Ice .12
Unocal .12
Valvoline All Climate .11
Valvoline Turbo .13
Valvoline Synthetic .12

Click to expand...

Thanks to all of you for your replies. Jackfish, a special thanks for the list you provided; very interesting. James

Zinc in oil is going the way that lead in gasoline went....just like this:

"Report this postReply with quoteRe: lead substitute
by rbohm on Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:35 am

the only fuel additive i ever used was 104 octane boost, and that was to try and stop a detonation problem i had with an old plymouth. i have also used seafoam green as a fuel system cleaner. you dont need a lead substitute these days, you dont even need hardened valve seats either since modern fuels contain a lubricant for the valves that doesnt damage the emission systems of modern automobiles. dont waste your money on these things."

Given enough time, Zinc will no longer be an issue.

I have a small stash of Redline that I was going to put in the new engine after break-in, but now I am a bit concerned because it has NO Zinc according to this list. The same as a few other "boutique" synthetic oils.

After perusing a few analysis posts at bitog, I'm not sure of the validity of the list I found.
Redline certainly does contain zinc, according to this:
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/mesastoura ... 7_AN_(2=07).pdf

JackFish":37zat60g said:

After perusing a few analysis posts at bitog, I'm not sure of the validity of the list I found.
Redline certainly does contain zinc, according to this:
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/mesastoura ... 7_AN_(2=07).pdf

Click to expand...

Yep, I don't think that list you found was too accurate either. If you click on the link I put up from Kendall, Kendall has a different weight % listed on their sheet.

Maybe that's a really old list?

Even if it's old, the information seems to be incorrect, so sorry about the post, just take it with a grain of salt and do your own research to determine what's appropriate for your use.
Whatever's on sale is usually my primary consideration.

isnt Redline synthetic oil?

I would not expect synthetics to contain zinc.

Also I thought it was Zinc Phosphate that was needed, or more accurately, ZDDP aka Zinc Dialkyl Dithio Phosphate ? I keep seeing references to zinc but isnt it really zinc phosphate we need?

As in zinc and phosphate by themselves dont do much but add them together and they become the dynamic duo of scuff prevention.

I'm sure that they are using "zinc" as shorthand for ZDDP

On the Kendall site, they do not list a wt% for ZDDP. They've listed a wt% for Zinc, Phosphorous, and Sulfated Ash. Assuming that all of each component is actually ZDDP in the oil, one could calculate the wt% of ZDDP in the oil. I really don't feel like doing this though, not a big fan of chemistry or the legwork involved with figuring this out.

EDIT: You would also need the molecular formula for ZDDP.

ZDDP isn't being phased out. Actually, the phosphorus is the component of ZDDP that provides the anti-wear capability of an engine oil and phosphorus is what has been reduced to a maximum of 800 ppm in the latest API Starburst OIls (see ILSAC GF-4).

Everyone seems to be focusing on ZDDP content as if it is the only criteria of a good engine oil. While the anti-wear capability of an oil is important, the ability to fight sludge and other deposits is also important. Having very high amounts of ZDDP are only really important to flat tappet engines with aggressive aftermarket valve trains but excessive amounts can lead to camshaft spalling and engine deposits. Esso's Flat Tappet Engine Wear Bulletin suggests that 300-500 ppm of phosphorus is sufficient to protect flat tappet engines. Rather than using Starburst oils in older engines, I think we should be using Heavy Duty Engine Oils (HDEOs) instead. The Corvair Flat Tappet Engine Oil Article recommends that a CI-4/SL rated HDEO has sufficient ZDDP to protect any flat tappet valve train. It explains that a good CI-4 HDEO has 1000-1200 ppm of phosphorus. Even for the latest CJ-4 engine oil, the maximum limit is for phosphorus is 1200 ppm.

Rather than looking for the Zinc of Phosphorus contents of engine oils, you should be looking for the API certification. Any oil that has met the PERFORMANCE requirements of a CI-4/SL or CJ-4/SM oil should easily be able to protect the older flat tappet gasoline engines. There is no need to use a 40-weight oil (10W-40, 15W-40, etc) in an good-running engine that originally called for a 30-weight oil (30, 10W-30, etc). If you want to stick with a dino-oil, Shell Rotella T 10W-30 (CI-4/SL) and Brad Penn HDEO 10W-30 (CJ-4/SM) are readily available. Synthetic 30-weight HDEOs are available too but are available as 0W-30 and 5W-30 because they flow so well in cold temperatures by their nature.

Engine Oil Article

In case anyone is interested to try an HDEO other than 15W-40, I've compiled the following list:

Heavy Duty Engine Oil

You should be able to order a case (12 quarts) from a distributor if the oil you want to try isn't stocked on local store shelves.