Differences btwn Ford and Fordsix.com Valve Adjustment Proc.

Differences Between Official Ford Manual and ClassicInlines.com/FordSix.com Valve Adjustment Procedures:

Hello and to wherever it should be directed,

I've got a 1964 Ranchero (170ci) running relatively well, but with a couple of ticks seemingly coming from the valve train (typical clicks per revolution coming from around the back of the cover, around #4, #5, or #6).
(Funny thing is that the sounds don't exist when I pull the cover to do a valve adjust, and I've been thinking it's just a spring plate, rocker arm, or adjuster screw tapping the cover. But that's not the main point of the post.)

I wanted to get the valves adjusted as close to original spec as possible as a starting point, but I noticed that there are some considerable differences/discrepancies between the valve adjustment procedures listed at the classicinlines/fordsix link here, and the official Ford manual valve adjustment page for this vehicle (a copy of the manual can be found here - for a price); and I wanted to get a consensus from members and mods about what the best of the two (different) worlds might be for valve-adjustment for this engine.

The differences are as follows (important discrepancies from the Ford manual listed in bold red italics):

As found at http://classicinlines.com/ValveAdj.asp

How to adjust your valves properly.

First, you must determine if you have solid lifters, or hydraulic lifters. Solid lifters were commonly used on the early 144/170ci motors, while hydraulic lifters were used on the later 144/170ci and 200/250ci motors. However, this is only a rule of thumb.

Method for Hydraulic Lifters

Disconnect the coil wire first for safety, making sure the motor won't accidentally start. Some guys prefer to remove all the plugs too, so that the engine is easier to rotate during the procedure. Make sure to mark your plug wires before disconnecting, so you don't mix up the firing order when reinstalling them.

Next rotate the engine until the number one (#1) cylinder is on TDC just after the compression stroke (you can feel the compressed air by putting your finger over the spark plug hole).

Now you can adjust the following valves:

#1 intake - #1 exhaust - #2 intake - #3 exhaust - #4 intake - #5 exhaust

Next, rotate the engine until the number six (#6) cylinder is on TDC just after its compression stroke (one full revolution of the crank shaft). Now adjust the remainder of the valves:

#2 exhaust - #3 intake - #4 exhaust - #5 intake - #6 intake - #6 exhaust

Adjust the valves by backing off the adjuster so that the pushrod can be easily rotated between your thumb and forefinger. Then slowly tighten the adjuster until you can no longer rotate the pushrod. Tighten the adjuster an additional ¼ turn, for the proper preload on the hydraulic lifter.

Note: The valve adjustments should be done on an engine that has been warmed up. Make sure to let it cool off sufficiently so that you don't burn your fingers while rotating the pushrods. It is also a good idea to place a drop cloth or oil pan under the car/engine to prevent oil drips on the floor.

Method for Solid Lifters

While valve adjustments must be made as accurately as possible, it is better to have the valve adjustment slightly loose, rather than slightly tight, as a burned valve may result from overly tight adjustments. Look in your engine manual to determine the proper valve lash for your motor. If you can't find it, they were commonly set at .018 thousands, but this lash should only be used as a very last resort.

1. Start the engine and let it run until it has reached operating temperature.

2. Remove the valve cover and gasket.

3. With the engine idling, adjust the valve lash using a step-type feeler gauge. This type of feeler gauge is sometimes more commonly known as a "go-no go" type feeler gauge. The proper clearance is reached when the smaller step on the gauge blade will pass through the gap while the larger step on the same blade will not pass thought the gap. Pass the proper size gauge blade between the valve stem and the rocker arm. If the clearance is correct, move on to the next valve. If the clearance is in need of adjustment, turn the adjusting screw on the opposite end of the rocker arm with a wrench until the proper clearance is reached. Turn the screw clockwise to decrease the clearance and counterclockwise to increase the clearance. Use the procedure for all of the valves.

4. Re-install the valve cover after you finish adjusting the valves.

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As found in the official Ford manual for this model

ADJUSTMENTS
VALE CLEARANCE-
144, 170 AND 200 SIX
The valve clearance may be adjusted by either of the following methods.

Lifter Extended Method.
1. Make two chalk marks on the crankshaft pulley or damper (Fig. 12). Space the marks approximately 120 degrees apart so that with the timing mark, the pulley or damper is divided into three equal parts (120 degrees represents 1/3 of the distance around the pulley or damper circumference).

2. Using an auxiliary starter switch, rotate the crankshaft until No. 1 piston is approximately at T.D.C. at the end of the compression stroke. Adjust the No. 1 cylinder intake and exhaust valve lash. Back off the adjusting screw until there is definite clearance between the rocker arm and valve stem. Turn the rocker arm adjusting screw clockwise (tighten) to remove all the push rod to rocker arm end clearance. This may be determined by rotating and/or moving the push rod with the fingers as the adjusting screw is tightened.

3. When all the push rod end clearance has been eliminated, tighten the adjusting screw an additional 2-1/2 turns to place the hydraulic lifter plunger at the approximate center of its travel. If the torque required to turn the self-locking adjusting screw is less than 7 ft-lbs, install a new, oversized adjusting screw. If unable to obtain a minimum torque of 7 ft-lbs with the oversize adjusting screw, replace the rocker arm and adjusting screw assembly.

4. Repeat this procedure (steps 2 and 3) for the remaining sets of valves, positioning each piston at approximately T.D.C. in the firing order sequence by turning the crankshaft 1/3 turn at a time in the direction of rotation. The engine should not be cranked or rotated until the hydraulic lifters have had an opportunity to leak down to their normal operating positions or a bent valve may result. The leak-down rate may be accelerated by applying pressure on the push rod end of the rocker arm using Tool T58P-6565-A.

Lifter Collapsed Method
1. Follow steps 2 and 3 of the "Lifter Extended Method".

2. Using tool T58P-6565-A, apply pressure to the push rod end of the rocker arm to slowly bleed down the valve lifter until th eplunger is completely bottomed. Hold the lifter in this position and check the available clearance between the rocker arm and valve stem tip. If clearance is not within specifications, turn the adjusting screw clockwise to decrease or counterclockwise to increase the clearance. Normally, one turn of the adjusting screw will alter the clearance by 0.075 inch at the valve stem tip.

Specifications:
VALVE MECHANISM
VALVE CLEARANCE*
144, 170 and 200 .......... 0.066 - 0.216
*Clearance specified is obtained at the valve stem tip with the hydraulic valve lifter collapsed.

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As is obvious at the onset, there is no mention of a Solid Lifter technique in the particular Ford publication for this vehicle, as (I believe) the 64s all have hydraulic lifters.
As well, the rockers on this 64 train are non-adjustable, in and of themselves. But there is an adjustment screw on the rod-side of the arm, the tip of which contacts the rod after proper adjustment (and furthermore, "preload", addressed later, below).

The first alarming note in comparing the two approaches above is the difference between the described 1/4 turn vs. 2-1/2 turns for proper preload, which is a large difference. Is this because the classicinlines/fordsix article/technique is referring to adjustable rocker arms, and not rod-side adjustment screws?
As well, the fact that there is such a large discrepancy between the "last resort" clearance spec from the classicinlines/fordsix instructions and the recommended clearance range from the Manual.
0.018 vs 0.066-0.216 ???
That there is a difference is not what is alarming; the classicinlines/fordsix instructions plainly state that the spec should be used only as a last resort, inferring (within the given context) that it is a kind of "guess measurement".
I get that.
But that the range recommended in the Ford publication doesn't even come close to the spec listed on the classicinlines/fordsix site? That's a bit more confusing. Is this also some kind of reference to adjustable arms, and not rod-side adjustment screws? I suppose that would make sense, as (if I remember correctly) one "half" of the rocker arm is longer than the other (that is, relative to the pivot point - I can't remember which end is longer, the rod side or the valve side), which would mean a different spec if measuring a gap at the rod or the valve.

If the adjustable rocker arm capability is not what's referred to for an explanation of the difference in numbers, however, can anyone shed some light on these seemingly very different school's of thought in adjustment specs and technique?
I'm wondering, for example, where the 0.018 number might have come from? What does "commonly set" mean in the containing line? I can't imagine this would be some arbitrary figure that "everyone" used back in the day regardless of the original specs listed in the manual. Is it a performance spec for a race build? (But then, I'd think you'd want to go even more loose? Not tighter?)

Based on recommendations virtually everywhere, the maxim is (as always) to leave valve adjustment slightly loose as a preference over slightly tight - if in doubt; a logical, reasonable, and understandable approach. (And something I've always done, myself, if I couldn't quite get adjustments within spec., or find specs to begin with. And, of course, "loose" meaning only to a point.)
But based on this logic, if I were left to choose between the specs presented above, I certainly wouldn't go any tighter than the 0.066 listed from the range mentioned in the Manual.
And, either way, my goal here is to set things correctly; i.e. not too loose or too tight; so as to rid the engine of this one, last tick, and to do so well within spec.

Thanks in advance for any info/insight/explanation.

D.R.

P.S.: Sorry in advance if this is the wrong area of the Forum, or if this info has been previously posted elsewhere. I didn't find either after a search.

You're good, this is the right forum.

So what i'm getting is that you want to adjust your valvetrain, but have non-adjustable rockers. This isn't too surprising to me because, AFAIK, ford only 'intentionally' used adjustables on solid lifter engines. i've read that they would sometimes mix parts if one bin was out rather than stop the line, so you could have adjustables on a Hydraulic lifter engine, but not the other way around.

Could be your cork valve cover gasket is worn or too compressed, lowering the VC too close to the valve train. i'd try running the car, and see how high you had to lift it to make the click go away, probably only a hair.

Howdy D.R.:

And Welcome to the Forum.

FYI- You do have adjustable rocker arms. The nut on the pushrod side is the adjuster. It is an interference nut that doesn't require a set nut to hold it. Also a '64 170 will likely have a solid lifter cam. Some 200s from '64 had hydraulic lifters, but I've never heard of a '64 170 with a hyd lifters. However, With FoMoCo, I try hard to never say always.

On setting specs on a solid lifter engine I am at a loss to under stand the factory range of ".066 - .216"????? that makes no sense, unless they are referring to a collapsed lifter dimension????? Very confusing.

The setting of .016" - .018" on a solid cam is a good place to start adjusting. Every engine will be a little different. Each engine will differ slightly due to wear.

Adios, David

CZLN6":1c3ic64k said:

.......
On setting specs on a solid lifter engine I am at a loss to under stand the factory range of ".066 - .216"????? that makes no sense, unless they are referring to a collapsed lifter dimension????? Very confusing.
......
Adios, David

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I think the .066-.216 refers to lifter preload on a hyd only lifter.

First…. all hydraulic lifter engines came with non-adjustable rockers, so there was no adjustment, short of using different length pushrods. Adjustable rocker arms were only used on solid lifter cams, which only came in the early 144/170c engines. Therefore, I’m not quite sure why the Official Ford Manual is telling you how to adjust hydraulic lifters on a small six? The reason we cover it, is because we sell aftermarket rockers (high ratio, roller tipped, and/or full roller), which are adjustable. If you have hydraulic lifters and adjustable rockers, someone probably swapped them out at some point, which is pretty common now-days.

As for the different adjustment methods, that’s easy. The Ford Manual clearly states the adjustments are made on a COLD motor that has never been fired up. As such, the adjustments are made with the lifters fully clasped, or fully pumped up. On the other hand, Classic Inlines method clearly states that the adjustments are made on a WARMED UP motor, when the lifters are operating within their normal operating range. You can use the COLD method when you assemble the motor, but the WARMED UP method is the best way to achieve the final adjustment. NOTE: If you use the cold method, be very careful you don't over tighten the adjusters, as you can burn the valves. Better to be too loose, than too tight, as you can always tighten them up when your doing the final adjustments.

Hydraulic Flat Tappet and Hydraulic Roller Camshaft:
First turn the engine in the normal direction of rotation. Start with cylinder number one (1). When the exhaust valve begins to move, adjust the intake valve to zero lash plus an additional ½ turn more. Rotate the engine over again until the intake valve reaches maximum lift and is almost all the way back down. Then set the exhaust valve to zero lash plus ½ turn. Adjust the valves on each cylinder in this manner until all valves are adjusted. If the engine has nonadjustable rocker arms, a lifter preload of .020” to .040” must be maintained. See “Non-Adjustable Rocker Arms” section for proper preload instructions.

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These are the instructions I use. From COMPCAMS, and honestly from what I've gathered over the years, pretty much the standard. I've heard between 1/4-3/4 turns after zero, so this is right in the middle.

But as Mike said, difference may be cold assembled engines versus warm engine.

Great stuff here. Thanks for the quick replies.

Invectivus":3loazh1f said:

Could be your cork valve cover gasket is worn or too compressed, lowering the VC too close to the valve train. i'd try running the car, and see how high you had to lift it to make the click go away, probably only a hair.

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Yes, this could always be the case. I'll be messing with the cover a bit more post-adjustment to be sure, but, obviously, wanted to get in some good adjustment while apart. If it is, indeed, the cover it will be pretty obvious. Not seeing any hammer or tick marks in the build up inside and under the cover, though.

80broncoman":3loazh1f said:

CZLN6 wrote:
.......
On setting specs on a solid lifter engine I am at a loss to under stand the factory range of ".066 - .216"????? that makes no sense, unless they are referring to a collapsed lifter dimension????? Very confusing.
......
Adios, David

I think the .066-.216 refers to lifter preload on a hyd only lifter.

Click to expand...

I have to think this is right.

AzCoupe":3loazh1f said:

If you have hydraulic lifters and adjustable rockers, someone probably swapped them out at some point, which is pretty common now-days.

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Nope. Everything stock. Granddad got the Falcon right off the lot back in late '64 or early '65. Our family has been the only owner. (Been babied, too. In great shape. You should see the shiny 1100 on the thing. I've been inside a few times and not a spot of rust or residue other than the float. I see rusty, oxidized hunks on eBay and think, "Sucks to have to need one of those".)

AzCoupe":3loazh1f said:

First…. all hydraulic lifter engines came with non-adjustable rockers... Adjustable rocker arms were only used on solid lifter cams, which only came in the early 144/170c engines. Therefore, I’m not quite sure why the Official Ford Manual is telling you how to adjust hydraulic lifters on a small six?

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Interesting and curious.
I'd believe this as well, as everything about this block is consistent with all the other '64 170 specs I've found thus far.

From Classicinlines.com ident page:

Lifters: The 60-62 144/170ci engines have solid lifters, while the 63-UP 144/170ci engines have hydraulic lifters. All 200/250ci engines have hydraulic lifters.

Rockers: The 60-62 144/170ci engines have adjustable rocker arms, while the 144/170ci 63-UP engines have non-adjustable. All 200/250 engines have non-adjustable rocker arms.

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Then there's a statement like that and it has one wondering again.

And so, back to the rockers, "define 'adjustable'".
Prior to this engine, "adjustable" rocker arms have always meant this or this to me. Typical adjusting nut right in the center. (Maybe we'll call them "Type One".)
This inline six, however, has a valve train that looks much like this -> specifically with part no.s 6564 and 6549 hanging out loose in the top right corner of the diagram. (Maybe we'll call them "Type Two".)
[Update/Edit: Here we go - here and here are images of a six train identical to the 170 in question. That should make it easier.]
To me, that still makes this an "adjustable" rocker arm, but very likely within different clearance specs relative to those listed for a "standard adjustable" rocker arm assembly.
Thus, I'm still determining which instructions/specs to utilize of those previously mentioned.
Another clue: The images listed in the Ford Manual clearly illustrate the standard ("Type One") rocker arms, now that I look more closely. So I'm already ruling out the adjustments indicated in the Manual, and the idea that this engine could be a hydraulic lifter only setup.

To be certain I guess I could simply "pump" the push rods (as mentioned in "Lifter Collapsed Method" - step 2 of the Manual) to see if there is movement.
Movement = hydraulic; NoMovement = solid. ...it would stand to reason.

If solid, adjustments as indicated from the go-no-go instructions from classicinlines/fordsix.
Though, I've never adjusted valves like these on an idling engine before, myself. Seems strange.
With the rockers hammering away at a good clip these screws are moving quickly at the arm's end, and angled at that. Are there not concerns of the socket binding during the adjustment? (I have a flex extension I suppose I could use to keep the leverage off the screws, and rolling in a fluid motion with the screw heads.)
...Or am I misreading the Solid Lifter instructions, and the engine should be off during adjustment and back on to idle during feeler readings?

And finally, I'm back to square one for a clearance spec. Should I go with the 0.018, or is there something better available?
(Can't believe I paid good money for this Manual, and got nothing more than the listed procedures for valve clearance adjustment.)

Thanks, again, for all the input.

D.R.

[Update/Edit: Here we go - here and here are images of the 170 in question. That should make it easier.]
To me, that still makes this an "adjustable" rocker arm, but very likely within different clearance specs relative to those listed for a "standard adjustable" rocker arm assembly.

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Yes the rocker arms in those pictures are the adjustable type rockers and they are only adjustable's made by Ford for the early inline sixes.

To see if you have solids or hyd. why not just turn the eng over to TDC on #1 than see if you have clearance between the rocker arm and valve stem. If you can slip a .012 to .020 feeler gauge than most likely you have solids if its zero clearance you have hyd. If you have solids it's normal to have a slight tic tic sound, set them to 0.18 with the engine warmed up good. I set them running it's not hard with the engine at a slow idle. If its a hyd. with adjustable set of rockers I also set them with the engine running I back off the rocker until it clicks and than tighten until it stops (zero lash) than go 1/4 to 3/4 turns tighter. There will be some oil splash with it running though so if you don't want that use the C.I. directions

I've been doing a little digging and according to my Master Parts Catalog,
lifter type depends not only on the year, but the model as well. For example.....

The '64 Falcon 170ci came with hydraulic lifters and non-adjustable rockers,
while the '64 Ranchero 170ci came with solid lifters and adjustable rockers.

As such, I'm guessing he has solid lifters, not hydraulic. It would also explain
why he has adjustable rockers.

I, too, did some more digging re: the model in question...

Turns out, based on the VIN and door plate numbers, that this Ranchero was actually manufactured in July of '63!

So looks like we're not talking about a '64, really, but perhaps a transition time workup of the previous year.

Looking more and more like the Solid-adjustable specs fit the description.


Classics can be such a discovery-journey sometimes. Up until today the entire Family has always described the "Falcon" as a '64. Which, in model-year I guess could still be true.
The "tubes" sure do make for some interesting revelations.
(Bet if I'd purchased the correct manual before all this "discovery" I'd have a better outline of the right adjustments, too. Duh.)

D.R.

Turns out, based on the VIN and door plate numbers, that this Ranchero was actually manufactured in July of '63!

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The July 63 build date still makes it a 1964 model though it would be a very early unit build, the Vin’s unit number would give more clues on that. When I worked at the Ford Pico Rivera plant (Big Fords and Thunderbirds) we shut down for 2 weeks about the end of June when we started back up we were assembling the next year models in July. I assume other plants kept about the same schedule. It is also a fact that these early build cars could also have parts from the previous year model if they would fit and had them left, Ford used these parts used until the supply where gone.

bubba22349":25es8wwf said:

Turns out, based on the VIN and door plate numbers, that this Ranchero was actually manufactured in July of '63!

Click to expand...

The July 63 build date still makes it a 1964 model though it would be an early unit build, the Vin’s unit number would give more clues. When I worked at the Ford Pico Rivera plant (Big Fords and Thunderbirds) we shut down for 2 weeks about the end of June when we started back up we were assembling the next year models in July. I assume other plants kept about the same schedule. It is also a fact that early cars could have parts from the previous year model if they had some left they got used until gone.

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Not to highjack, but glad to know we have some one here who has worked at a ford plant.

about 10 years ago I ended up with a tempo that had a built date of May/94 . Other than sunroof and V6 it had EVERY option you could get. I was always thinking they were just getting rid of left over parts.

My mustang, build date March 1, 1965, came with a 200, hydraulic lifters and adjustible rockers. That is assuming engine components werent swapped out some time before I bought it. The engine was very tired and every indication I have says it was original to the car. If someone was to swap out for adjustible rockers, I think they would have made other modifications or repairs in the process. I am now running a different block, but the original one had a road draft tube, no PCV valve, and seven main bearings.

Sounds like someone swaped in an early engine and that was done quite often. To know if a ford has the right org. Parts takes some work you would need to find all the date codes of the parts not just the casting number. If they were within 2 weeks to a month before the build date of the car than generially theres a good chance it would be numbers matching or org to the car. I would think that it's only going to be important if you are showing the car as it was org. Built.

80broncoman wrote:

about 10 years ago I ended up with a tempo that had a built date of May/94 . Other than sunroof and V6 it had EVERY option you could get. I was always thinking they were just getting rid of left over parts.

Click to expand...

That would have been a late built unit so you might be right. For many years now Ford has been offering parts groups and trim levels where you if you wanted to find a specific item your going to get others along with it (packaging). Some of this started back in the 60's with the Mustangs like the 65 Sprint package, 66 & 67 High Country Special (built for the Denver region) and later the 68 California Special and many more.

Welp, seems we have a winner:

Started out with the classicinlines/fordsix instructions, but found it... unpleasant at best to adjust these particular rod-side adjustment screws while the engine was idling. I didn't say impossible, but it won't be me getting accuracy out of this method any time soon.

Decided to go down the line with engine off, starting with #1 at TDC and zeroing both the intake and exhaust. Wanted to start at zero lash and just see how much play I was working with, and maybe tighten in quarter turns from there. Got all the way through 6 (took out lots of play on 4 and 6 intakes, btw - suspect these were my original tickers) and went back through one last time to double check. That's when I realized (at 3) that at TDC both the rods were (duh) movable if pressure was applied to the rod-side of the rocker, and I had doubts about the way I was adjusting. (Lots of learning. Lots of learning.)
(Sigh) Well, less than half a turn either way so far, so let's try it anyway and see how it goes, I thought.

Fired it up and all were ticking, as expected. Still a starting place, I thought.
Shut it off and went down the line with 1/4 tightening turns. Back on idle, some quiet some still ticking. Could narrow the difference between which was which with a finger on the heads of each rocker shaft main bolt. Could even narrow it down to single valves if I put a finger on the very center, least moving portion of the rockers.
Got everything seemingly quiet. Cover back on. Just started to take it out the driveway and a couple started up again.
Cover back off. Listening. Couldn't now figure which were which.

Was feeling uneasy about the uncertainties, so decided to start from scratch and try the COMPCAMS instructions CobraSix provided:

Start with cylinder number one (1). When the exhaust valve begins to move, adjust the intake valve to zero lash plus an additional ½ turn more. Rotate the engine over again until the intake valve reaches maximum lift and is almost all the way back down. Then set the exhaust valve to zero lash plus ½ turn. Adjust the valves on each cylinder in this manner until all valves are adjusted.

Click to expand...

Some time later had all but two (a different two) completely quiet. Worried things might be a bit on the tight side, I tested by backing off a couple random silent rockers by 1/4 turn. Beyond just the standard rocker sounds they were now ticking too loudly. So, they were right there - perfect, really; and so I put them back where they were. Did 1/4 turns until the original loose ones from this session were good, too (neither required more than one 1/4 turn), and all were purring like well-fed cats.
Cover back on, no noise at idle, let's go for a drive.
Half way down the driveway a couple started in again.
K. Probably not quite as "perfect" as I thought. But I was dirty and late for dinner, would have to wait.

Def think the COMPCAMS approach is the best one, thus far, for this rocker lineup. Not the fastest, but just makes sense; and I'm not at all worried about over-tightening with this method.
More tomorrow when it's proper.

D.R.

Solid lifters have the engine hot.
Start with cylinder number one (1). When the exhaust valve begins to move, adjust the intake valve to The proper lash. Rotate the engine over again until the intake valve reaches maximum lift and is almost all the way back down. Then set the exhaust valve to the proper lash. Adjust the valves on each cylinder in this manner until all valves are adjusted.

Hydrualic lifters have the engine hot, follow the same as solid lifters, but to prevent lifter leakdown, loosen the adjuster till the lifter is not collapsed then when you have the rocker arm where the pushrod will turn, tighten the adjuster 1/4 turn. You want the adjustment real close to the top to prevent lifter pump up at high rpms.
If is a mild build & don't intend to race it adjust to 1/2 turn. Do this & you will be rewarded with proper performance & reliability.

If you have a better way i'm all ears. I use a P&G valve gapper i still have for the solid lifters which is a dial indicator reading of the clearance, can also be used for hydrualics to make sure the lifter plunger is at the top of its travel so proper preload can be adjusted. Bill

You would not want to set a solid lifter cam to zero lash it's going to do damage to parts and it won't run right. Hope you did'nt bend some push rods all ready. Setting for solids is 0.016" with engine warmed up good.

Well, runnin' smooth after a couple more turns.

Same approach, just double checked all adjustments, and - if anything - they were still on the loose side (as was the case with the previous method, so no threat of bent rods in either procedure, at least as previous steps taken would dictate).

Can report that at anything but zero lash and the COMPCAMS/EOIC method, nothing but crazy slap from every valve/rocker. Tried 0.020, 0.018, 0.016 and even 0.010 in conjunction with the additional 1/2 turn recommended in the method; all attempts inclusive of such lash produced the same result - just not enough to quiet the given valve to that smaller mechanical tick.

No, too tight with zero lash on this particular adjustment configuration was definitely not the case. In fact, where I landed to get all valves de-ticked (should say "de-slapped", as, again, a bit of tick is always good, of course, and still present in all valves - no worries) was zero lash on all, plus the 1/2 recommended turn to start, plus the following values:

(Yes, #4 Intake took a full turn past zero. Got there via two, final 1/8 turns just to be sure.)

On this particular configuration (adjustable screws on the rod-side of the rocker), and this particular engine (original, stock cam from the 60's - all original parts, in fact, running since original purchase in 64) I really just think it needed to be adjusted well in to lose the bigger noise. I guess it's just aged; could probably really use a rebuild, but I'm not prepared... this week/month/year.
I'm happy with the way the precautions of the adjustments progressed between the two methods attempted (ramping up from obviously-way-too-loose to still-slightly-loose to "the noise is just barely gone" - sometimes in increments as small as 1/8 turn), and can attest that, as adjusted, every rod still even spins in constant circles during idle - and smoothly, at that. (Not that that is any requirement or indicator, but I've seen rods with other standard adjustable rockers and solid lifters adjusted "properly" that wouldn't even move at all, much less fluidly like this.)

With all this said, I guess I would, ultimately, recommend the EOIC method for this rocker style over others, but with the obvious caveats and precautions. That is: Better to ramp up to a quieter train than start out with it.

Now, also with that having been said, and this adjustment seemingly finished, I do have some new news to report, and a question:
During progress, all adjustments went smoothly on good, solid rods until #3 Exhaust. When attempting to feel for zero on #3E the rod was movable (downward) ...a good centimeter, in fact.
There was a progressive resistance before it stopped - a sensation as if working against a spring or wet rag. But something definitely wasn't bottoming out immediately like the rest of the previous adjustments. ...What I could only call "slop".
Was still able to determine the difference between the lash gap and the movement of the rod (pretty distinct), and so adjusted accordingly.
Moving on, it would turn out that four more rods would be like this in positions where they should be solid in the stroke. Namely the starred in the following:

Like say, all seems to be running smoothly (very smoothly). But this "slop" situation has produced more wondering.
The Question: Does this indicate bad lifters? And/or perhaps a bad cam?

Pretty old stuff, so if this had happened along the way at some point over the years, and no one had figured it out, it wouldn't surprise.

D.R.

Just wanted to say thanks for all the suggestions and help in the old year, enabling continued successes in the new.

All running great, to the point I'm even starting work on the "next project" (1949 Plymouth Special Deluxe).

Still curious about what the "slop"py rod/lifter thing could be; but, like say, the engine performance seems great.

I re-read a couple of the posts in this thread today, and thought about this:

Invectivus":2qnsqzla said:

ford only 'intentionally' used adjustables on solid lifter engines. i've read that they would sometimes mix parts if one bin was out rather than stop the line, so you could have adjustables on a Hydraulic lifter engine, but not the other way around.

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Really? Is this true? To what degree would things like this take place?
Is it possible there could be a "mix" of parts in a build? Both solid and hydraulic lifters in this adjustable-rocker-screw engine?
Or is it more likely these might all be hydraulic lifters (based on the above idea), and some are simply sticking during adjustment, making for a seemingly solid lifter?

bubba22349, originally you had said this:

bubba22349":2qnsqzla said:

If its a hyd. with adjustable set of rockers I also set them with the engine running I back off the rocker until it clicks and than tighten until it stops (zero lash) than go 1/4 to 3/4 turns tighter.

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Based on what seems to be a successful adjustment thus far with 3/4 turns past zero, does this suggest that an "adjustable/hydraulic" situation might be the case, here?
And then some say "Adjustable rockers on early I6s means solid lifters only." ...So, then what?

Again, all I'll say about the Manual is that it is, indeed, talking about valve adjustment inclusive of hydraulic lifters, and that it is, indeed, including diagram pictures of center-bolt style rockers in that procedure ...not adjustment screw rockers like the ones stock on this VT. All this and the information I found here and elsewhere online pointed (to me) to mean "solid lifters".
Tried the test you suggested as well (bubba22349), but, like say, amount of give ("slop") differs greatly between rods - both at TDC and at EOIC. So, inconclusive.
Only other thing I can think of doing (short of pulling the head) is pulling the rods and looking down with a flashlight to try and determine, based on the (now newly updated since this thread) set of instructions/info posted at the original CI valve adjustment link, here. (New sections are inclusive of the first paragraph and picture, there, outlining lifter identification.)

But, as the setup seems to be running really well, I'm reluctant. (Note: Not lazy, and not lacking time; simply reluctant.)

I have the time and am willing to perform the inspection, but... is it worth it?
I like things to be adjusted properly; perfectly, in fact. Based on that I would normally say, "absolutely, get in there and start over". But based on the road that brought the current scenario, and with things seeming to be running pretty darn well, it's a toss up. The only thing that would really bug if I never touched it again would be, "what kind of lifters do I have?"

Thoughts, ideas, advice welcome as always.

D.R.