My mods on 200 Super Pursuit
- Thread starter xrwagon
- Start date
Go for it. We need to network more. The Ford side of things is the most exciting part.
Few Ford sixes are found there, since the little Ford log six fairly well held the door open for Holden and Hemi supremacy in Australia.
There are some that have planned to be at the 6 banger nats, like SNAIL ETR's solid Cammed corty on dyno 272rwhp who's engine blow up last September.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YP3EPlhrao
Hopefully his latest effort will have him there!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwOfiKcyUc8
But 6bangers is a Holden Hemi benefit match the meantime.
2010 Six banger Nats
http://www.warwickdragway.com/Galleries ... /index.htm
11 second Hemis
http://www.queenslandchryslers.com/foru ... =30&t=4134
12 second Holdens
http://www.gmh-torana.com.au/forums/top ... nats-2012/
General info
http://www.ozrodders.com/forum/viewtopi ... =4&t=39242
Few Ford sixes are found there, since the little Ford log six fairly well held the door open for Holden and Hemi supremacy in Australia.
There are some that have planned to be at the 6 banger nats, like SNAIL ETR's solid Cammed corty on dyno 272rwhp who's engine blow up last September.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YP3EPlhrao
Hopefully his latest effort will have him there!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwOfiKcyUc8
But 6bangers is a Holden Hemi benefit match the meantime.
2010 Six banger Nats
http://www.warwickdragway.com/Galleries ... /index.htm
11 second Hemis
http://www.queenslandchryslers.com/foru ... =30&t=4134
12 second Holdens
http://www.gmh-torana.com.au/forums/top ... nats-2012/
General info
http://www.ozrodders.com/forum/viewtopi ... =4&t=39242
wow, whole different world!
I had heard (late '60s/70s) Oz went wild on the 6 while USA did the 8, this shows it (the OZ side I missed).
Thanks so much, esp the pic.
I think they asr still developing the 6 while we go to the v6 and 4s, may B...
8 seems dead cept for some exotics & priced-outta-reach others.
Love the old stuff tho. Must B nostalgia for me. But, damn, basic, simple & raw power.
Some beach towns in heu hes hay have ocean front races w/the ol stuff. Bikes and jalopies. It's a way to bring people (money that is) into the towns after the tourists head back to wrk @ end of summer. They race where the waves end but before the loose sand starts so it's firm for tire grabbin.
I had heard (late '60s/70s) Oz went wild on the 6 while USA did the 8, this shows it (the OZ side I missed).
Thanks so much, esp the pic.
I think they asr still developing the 6 while we go to the v6 and 4s, may B...
8 seems dead cept for some exotics & priced-outta-reach others.
Love the old stuff tho. Must B nostalgia for me. But, damn, basic, simple & raw power.
Some beach towns in heu hes hay have ocean front races w/the ol stuff. Bikes and jalopies. It's a way to bring people (money that is) into the towns after the tourists head back to wrk @ end of summer. They race where the waves end but before the loose sand starts so it's firm for tire grabbin.
xrwagon
Well-known member
Few Cortina’s run there, there is a six based yellow escort there today, later model 4.0 X and E series, i expect to see plenty of crossflows, maybe some 2V headed cars and some ford FED’s, plus checking out some vintage parts, car is ready, washed and packed to go first thing Sunday morning. Another mob is building a Anglia with angry crossflow at the moment as well, not sure when that will be finished, i will be doing it for the log’s tomorrow and my cat Bubbles who lost his life this week while i was working on the car, he loved my wagon. He got hit while crossing the road, one of the last things he did was jump on the bloody roof of my wagon.
xrwagon
Well-known member
Thanks GB500 for correct info, yeah us Aussies have been spoilt for sixes, we had yankee six’s and our own home made designs, i have a friend that does FG Turbo Falcon six’s, his base tune is 800 at treads, thats a inline Falcon six, one turbo. Last weekend a guy ran a 8 in with a old Holden Red Motor with turbo, thats a sixties engine that ran through to mid eighties.
X if you don`t quit posting up all that yummy ENGINE PORN,I just might have another heart attack. :rolflmao: :rolflmao: :rolflmao: Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo
xrwagon
Well-known member
Successful Six Banger Nats for me, i won my class of stick shift, got a fantastic trophy, had eight runs all up, car was reasonably consistent first time out and surprised a few as to what a stock 200 with exhaust can do and sound, it was sick.
Now for the times
1st run as i drove through the gate, straight to scrutineering and to lane 4 for my class.
Street trim pass
13.403 at 50.27
dropped pipe, bolted on side exhaust, small 14” rims on, air cleaner removed.
13.063 at 52.54
12.858 at 53.05 (broke into 12’s which was the goal)
dial in at 12.90 and ran 12.854 at 52.64
dial in at 12.78 and ran 12.758 at 53.18 won on double breakout
rounds went
12.920 at 48.52, slowed to not break out
13.034 at 47.57 same again
i raced a guy who nailed a perfect reaction but i still won as he broke out
my winning run the 13.034
won my class of stick shift
then raced off for the cup, 6 class’s and who ever went closest to dial in won the weekend.
i changed my dial in to a 12.80 as car hadn’t cooled all that much, it was around 30 degree’s
ran my pb but broke out
12.668 at 53.65
Great day out
Now for the times
1st run as i drove through the gate, straight to scrutineering and to lane 4 for my class.
Street trim pass
13.403 at 50.27
dropped pipe, bolted on side exhaust, small 14” rims on, air cleaner removed.
13.063 at 52.54
12.858 at 53.05 (broke into 12’s which was the goal)
dial in at 12.90 and ran 12.854 at 52.64
dial in at 12.78 and ran 12.758 at 53.18 won on double breakout
rounds went
12.920 at 48.52, slowed to not break out
13.034 at 47.57 same again
i raced a guy who nailed a perfect reaction but i still won as he broke out
my winning run the 13.034
won my class of stick shift
then raced off for the cup, 6 class’s and who ever went closest to dial in won the weekend.
i changed my dial in to a 12.80 as car hadn’t cooled all that much, it was around 30 degree’s
ran my pb but broke out
12.668 at 53.65
Great day out
xrwagon
Well-known member
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/ ... 2488_n.jpg
Here is the pic after presentation. The time is like a 19.66 over qtr when converted from the eighth mile, but on dial in and consistency i won. Car can go much faster.
Here is the pic after presentation. The time is like a 19.66 over qtr when converted from the eighth mile, but on dial in and consistency i won. Car can go much faster.
gb500":2tew6bwl said:chad":2tew6bwl said:the story goes chrysler australia sent a ute (ranchero) with the engine over to weber in italy for weber to tune/specify the carbs for the production run.
alledgedly 302hp (gross) (at 265ci)for the hot factory race specificartion (E49 charger). the reason for the ute was so the opposiotion didnt get prior knowledge of the fast back charger shape body(in pic below) they were planning to releases in 1971
There were two ute's used in testing, a VF and a VG, both shortened to the Charger wheelbase and overhang.
Both are still in existence, both are being restored, and both are owned by the same person.
The vehicle sent to Weber in Italy was a VG Pacer sedan. It was not freighted back allegedly.
Aussies.
Three things.
One Don't mess with Aussies and joke about if they can do a job. They can.
Second. Never, ever underestimate any thing associated with the Mopar Pentestar.
Third. An Aussie with a Mopar is therefore a three faceted risk on David slaying Golioth proportions.
Engieer Mike Stacey said inthe late 80's that the 6 Pack Hemi was tuned with a Blue VG Hardtop, using Webers help, 12000 miles and European alps roads. They used the 4 liter 314 and 325 hp Aston Martin DB6 and DBS carbs, with jetting to suit the 4.3 265Hemi. And got 295 flywheel hp net when blueprinted, but the rating was fudged down to 302 hp at 5300rpm, but was actually more further up the curve. The Hemi 6 pack was designed to cope with over reving, despite its factory 5500 rpm redline. When a car witha 3.5:1 diff can do 131 mph 1000 rpm into the redline, you know its got some serious power.
Despite what small minded Kiwis may say, you Aussies are the best DIY blokes in the world. From Phil Irvings Land Spees Record 195 mph Vincent Black Shadow and the 1966 F1 Braham V8 to Larry Perkins taking out AVESCO in the 90's with a Holden V8 win at Bathurst when everyone else used a Ford or 302 Chev. You guys do more with less. And Definately No suprises there!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uw6qPQOIPRk
Getting back to what you can do with a few tubes and some knowledge, Paul Knott is getting an E38 style 280 hp at as low as 6500 rpm from just 170 cubes in his 62XK Falcon.
Then Supercharge it http://www.posiesrodsandcustoms.com/pos ... leetliner/
Three things.
One Don't mess with Aussies and joke about if they can do a job. They can.
Second. Never, ever underestimate any thing associated with the Mopar Pentestar.
Third. An Aussie with a Mopar is therefore a three faceted risk on David slaying Golioth proportions.
Engieer Mike Stacey said inthe late 80's that the 6 Pack Hemi was tuned with a Blue VG Hardtop, using Webers help, 12000 miles and European alps roads. They used the 4 liter 314 and 325 hp Aston Martin DB6 and DBS carbs, with jetting to suit the 4.3 265Hemi. And got 295 flywheel hp net when blueprinted, but the rating was fudged down to 302 hp at 5300rpm, but was actually more further up the curve. The Hemi 6 pack was designed to cope with over reving, despite its factory 5500 rpm redline. When a car witha 3.5:1 diff can do 131 mph 1000 rpm into the redline, you know its got some serious power.
Despite what small minded Kiwis may say, you Aussies are the best DIY blokes in the world. From Phil Irvings Land Spees Record 195 mph Vincent Black Shadow and the 1966 F1 Braham V8 to Larry Perkins taking out AVESCO in the 90's with a Holden V8 win at Bathurst when everyone else used a Ford or 302 Chev. You guys do more with less. And Definately No suprises there!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uw6qPQOIPRk
Getting back to what you can do with a few tubes and some knowledge, Paul Knott is getting an E38 style 280 hp at as low as 6500 rpm from just 170 cubes in his 62XK Falcon.
Then Supercharge it http://www.posiesrodsandcustoms.com/pos ... leetliner/
xrwagon
Well-known member
i finally got my stall converter today, was told its a 2500 but is actually a 2800 11” series 3 red diamond, less than 500 k’s on it before mate decided to go turbo FG in his old wagon. Also got a bell housing for cleveland C4 to go behind my six or a crossflow if i decide, the stall is a 26 spline. Another friend has a hot crossflow, big solid cam, lots of headwork and fresh bottom end, may end up buying this to put in car while i work on my 200/injected little monster, that way i can still contest the eighth series and have some fun while i accumulate more bits and get this log head cut and shut. Going to see the head machinist in my city on Monday and see what he reckons. Stall be a bit big for the cam i was going to throw in my 200 for now?
n regards to your 200 cubic inch Falcon engine, we recommend a camshaft with our 409C profile.
Adv. Valve Timing: 75° - 45° 43° - 77° Duration 306°
Duration at .050” 238°
Lobe Lift .320”
Cost of the camshaft is $215.00 + GST plus freight.
This is from Clive cams in australia and would be a solid cam, not sure of lobe centres, may be 109 or total lift.
n regards to your 200 cubic inch Falcon engine, we recommend a camshaft with our 409C profile.
Adv. Valve Timing: 75° - 45° 43° - 77° Duration 306°
Duration at .050” 238°
Lobe Lift .320”
Cost of the camshaft is $215.00 + GST plus freight.
This is from Clive cams in australia and would be a solid cam, not sure of lobe centres, may be 109 or total lift.
It doesn't matter, since the only difference in the early Super Pursuit 200 and the later ones is the six on 2.75" PCD imperial bolt crank spigot flange. The X-flow is just six on 3.00" PCD imperial till 86DA, then metric bolt. So if you've got a Aussie Wide Bellhousing that suits the Clevelands C10 split bell, you have any pushrod I6 ngine from 1966 to 1992 as an option.
2800 sounds great. The looser the better.
Cam, well unless I can decode it, it looks 300 duration to me, and it is low load stress with moderate duration at 50 thou and depending on valve gear rocker ratio, moderate lift at 480 with 1.5:1 rockers, or pretty darn good at 528 with 1.65:1. I'll let someone else comment on lob center and cam advance.
You will need enough space on your valves and springs to cope with that kind of lift,with everything needing carefull pushrod selection to ensure the rocker angularity and rub point on the valve is in the ideal position. Information I have is that valve quality, and not so much valve size,is the key with an iron headed in line six with wedge head. The Gatts at Superflow said in 1987 even XU1 engines can run just 1.625 to 1.675" valves and certainly don't need the 1.75", almost 253/308 V8 sized valves Yella Terra ran. Same applies to the Ford six, big valves unless its in a canted valve engine, or a Classic Inlines head where there is great intake motion, can't be supported without shrouding. Those heads can make use of bigger valves, log heads can't. so valve lift, transmission setup and any sort of good intake manifolding govern your peak power. The improvement to port shape, valve guide profile and finding a good compression ratio hike will pay off. Going for the earlier valve guide sizes should help air flow.
I'm quite sure the ideal cam won't be that one, as even in 2013, we don't have the insights into what difference there needs to be between a radical cross flow and a small log head, but you can adjust the engine combination to make that came work as best as it can. Most performance comes from cfm gains via pocket blending and shaping and getting exhast to flow 80% of the intake. On restricted flow engines, the cam choice and induction tuning becomes much more important.
2800 sounds great. The looser the better.
Cam, well unless I can decode it, it looks 300 duration to me, and it is low load stress with moderate duration at 50 thou and depending on valve gear rocker ratio, moderate lift at 480 with 1.5:1 rockers, or pretty darn good at 528 with 1.65:1. I'll let someone else comment on lob center and cam advance.
You will need enough space on your valves and springs to cope with that kind of lift,with everything needing carefull pushrod selection to ensure the rocker angularity and rub point on the valve is in the ideal position. Information I have is that valve quality, and not so much valve size,is the key with an iron headed in line six with wedge head. The Gatts at Superflow said in 1987 even XU1 engines can run just 1.625 to 1.675" valves and certainly don't need the 1.75", almost 253/308 V8 sized valves Yella Terra ran. Same applies to the Ford six, big valves unless its in a canted valve engine, or a Classic Inlines head where there is great intake motion, can't be supported without shrouding. Those heads can make use of bigger valves, log heads can't. so valve lift, transmission setup and any sort of good intake manifolding govern your peak power. The improvement to port shape, valve guide profile and finding a good compression ratio hike will pay off. Going for the earlier valve guide sizes should help air flow.
I'm quite sure the ideal cam won't be that one, as even in 2013, we don't have the insights into what difference there needs to be between a radical cross flow and a small log head, but you can adjust the engine combination to make that came work as best as it can. Most performance comes from cfm gains via pocket blending and shaping and getting exhast to flow 80% of the intake. On restricted flow engines, the cam choice and induction tuning becomes much more important.
Gene Fiore
Famous Member
x2 on the converter
xrwagon
Well-known member
xrwagon
Well-known member
I am trying to, i have another deal pending so will have to play the waiting game, this little 170 is a a serious bit of gear, here is what the seller wrote to me.
The head has had the cast manifold machined off it and adaptors for the Algon injection put in place. It is a solid lifter cam and the engine was built by a California Marine race engine builder named Red Reeder.
I believe the head fits both 170 and 200.
marlo
he can crate it and send it on to me, if it all works out i should have a fair amount of gear shortly, and all vintage, now to see how much of it is actually any good.
The head has had the cast manifold machined off it and adaptors for the Algon injection put in place. It is a solid lifter cam and the engine was built by a California Marine race engine builder named Red Reeder.
I believe the head fits both 170 and 200.
marlo
he can crate it and send it on to me, if it all works out i should have a fair amount of gear shortly, and all vintage, now to see how much of it is actually any good.