Is an Autolite 2100 worth it on a stock 200ci?

T

tom_66

Well-known member
This is my dilemma:
I have an Autolite 1101 (sent it out to KP carbs for rebuild). According to the Falcon 6 performance manual (great source of info), this is a performance upgrade for a 200ci.
On the other hand, I have 250 head from a 1980 granada (large log, 1.75" intake valves) sitting at home.
My '66 mustang has a stock 200ci engine, small log head, with single header and duraspark distributor (and t-5 transmission). Should I install the autolite 1101 and call it a day, or should I get the 250 head rebuilt and converted for an autolite 2100?

Things to keep in mind:
- fuel economy
- I'm keeping the stock cam
- carb adjustment (I don't want to be doing trial and error with the carb jetting)
- I don't have a problem installing a throttle cable

I wanna hear your opinions, thoughts, criticism, whatever you want....

Tom
 
Sounds like a nice up-grade…

"...I wanna hear…"
1st need more info.
what are you looking for - what end results do you want, are you satisfied with what you have now? track or auto cross? mall crawl?
Glad you've seen the Handbook. What is of interest there (in terms of end goals)?
 
i put 2100 on a stock 66 falcon 170, and i felt the effort was worth the investment. no change in fuel economy either.
 
chad":39bbgsg9 said:
Sounds like a nice up-grade…

"...I wanna hear…"
1st need more info.
what are you looking for - what end results do you want, are you satisfied with what you have now? track or auto cross? mall crawl?
Glad you've seen the Handbook. What is of interest there (in terms of end goals)?
Click to expand...

Chad,

My car will be used as a daily driver (as long as the New England weather allows it). I try to keep the car off the Boston roads during winter months due to salty roads.
In terms of end results, I'm not looking for a race car. Just more power than stock (maybe 10-20% increase) while keeping the engine reliable. BTW, the T5 conversion makes the car super-fun to drive.

Tom
 
rbohm":2dz3jz7p said:
i put 2100 on a stock 66 falcon 170, and i felt the effort was worth the investment. no change in fuel economy either.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. Did you use a 2v-1v adapter or you modified the head to install the 2100?


Tom
 
Howdy Tom and All:

Here's my thoughts. I choose both. I'd use the 1101 for a mild increase in performance but may decrease MPG slightly depending on your driving. It is an easy bolt-on with flaring out the carb adaptor top to clear the larger butterfly valve of the 1101.

And, I'd start planning and building the '80 head so that when the stock head is due for a valve job, all that will be needed is the gaskets and elbow grease to make the swap with minimal down time. With the head rebuild, in addition to modifying for the two barrel consider a multi-angle valve job, back-cutting the intakes, shim the stock valve spring .030", milling to goal CR and mild pocket porting as part of the head build.

If you were to choose an Autolite 2100 in the smaller cfm range tuning would be minimal, mileage at least as good as stock, but a bigger smile when you want to go. A 2100 from early 1960s 221 or 260 V8s would be ideal for a relatively stock 200.

Keep us posted on what you do and how it turns out.

Adios, David
 
tom_66":3aed6ghf said:
rbohm":3aed6ghf said:
i put 2100 on a stock 66 falcon 170, and i felt the effort was worth the investment. no change in fuel economy either.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. Did you use a 2v-1v adapter or you modified the head to install the 2100?


Tom
Click to expand...

i used a two into one adapter from transadapt.
 
"…I choose both…"
Can U drive 1 & slowly prep the other to optimal "stop light to stop light" performance (I used to drive cab, livery, and truck in Boston)?

You may want to prep a cam shaft for that as well. I know a neighbor who put the cam in w/o pulling the motor -
 
David,

Thanks for your advice. Right know the engine has an autolite 1100 installed and working perfectly. I'll keep it like that until I get the 1101 from kp carbs. I will start making plans to get the 250ci head rebuilt, including a valve job and 2100 conversion. I can still drive the car while I get all that done. I will install the 1101 as soon as I get it. I read about the spacer modification to accept the larger buttlerfly on the 1101.


Chad,

I though you had to remove the engine to install a cam. That's why I wasn't planning on changing the stock cam. You got me thinking now..... In the mean time I'll play around with the 1101 to see how the car runs with it. BTW, do you know any machine shop in this area that has some sort of experience doing the 2V conversion?

Tom
 
If you pull the radiator and some of the front sheet metal you can get the cam in and out with the engine still in the car.
 
CZLN6 has good advise as usual as well as others. We are fortunate to have a place to chat about our inlines. Yep you get to keep driving it and then put that nice head and 2100 on. With all the other mods you have I'll bet it will be a good performer.
 
"...Chad,
I though you had to remove the engine to install a cam. That's why I wasn't planning on changing the stock cam. You got me thinking now..... In the mean time I'll play around with the 1101 to see how the car runs with it. BTW, do you know any machine shop in this area that has some sort of experience doing the 2V conversion?…"

I knew that wuz the case so posted the 'pointer'. It's possible, as others have said, to remove the radiator, judiciously cut out some grill or other sheet metal w/a 4" grinder etc…
mig that metale back in, etc…

Yes, David has good info, get what U have running WELL, drive it & stay tuned here to make a rig that'll surprise U months down the road.
 
The carb requires room to atomise fuel. If you crowd the area below the fuel and don't increase the stock hole size, the gains of any 2-bbl carb become minuses after a venturi area of 1.3" daimeter on a 1-bbl, and two 1.14" holes on a 2-bbl with a 1.3" hole of the C1 to c5 heads. Just draw two two barrel ventir holes at 1.81825" spacings and see it collide with the single hole wall. That kills air fuel flow.

The 1.5" hole on the C6 to C9 heads can take more venturi area. abou 1.1875" or 1.21 on the 2-bbl carbs. With the 1.6875" hole on the C9 to E2 head will take a 1.33" 2-bbl 2100 carb. The annular area cannot impinge on the normal venturi roosters tail. If you route it out to 1.83 to 2", you can use the 1.375" 500 cfm 2bbl, or even the 1.4375" venturi 650 cfm 2-bbl. The edges just have enough room to bend the fuel air mix.


A direct mount will allow any carb to fit and work.


Common venturi sizes are what govern flow. 350 and 500 2-bbl Holleys are 1.1875 and 1.375 respectively. All US 2-bbl carbs have the same 1.8125" bore spacing (Well, Autolite 2110s, Motorcraft 2150s's, Holley 2300's and Rochjesters 2CG carbs. Biggest Ford 2-bbl was the 64 to 66 1.33. After the advent of the 2150 Motorcraft, they all dropped back to 1.08 and 1.21.


Power and fuel economy drops with bigger carbs are a result of unfavorable geometry, and the carbs require area under them to be able to recalibrate them to be of uses. This happesn when you go to big for the log intakes area of plenumb below the carb. You have to resort to stacking spacers and splitting the manifold to push fuel past the short turn raduis. Normally, dividing an intake hurts air fuel ratio and kills everything, but when you open the foward and back leg by slowly bend air fuel mixture by 15 degree lengths, you allow it to turn, and then reach the chambers for buring. , you are helping the air fuel reach 1,2 and 3, and 4,5 and 6.


Other engine builders learned all these tricks back in the 60's. For us Log head Ford guys, we've been told "its usless to try an put more fuel air mix through the standadrd size hole". If you enlarge the hole, or elongate it like the direct mount, you then can go for bigger carbs easily. If a 1.33 Autolite or 500 cfm Holley doesn't give you better power, then you have to space the carb up another half an inch, and test it again. If your bigger carb fails to yield results, its a gas flow problem, and you need to fix gas flow from the carb first, then tuen the carb to suit. If we decide that carburattor recalibration isn't something we want to do, then we are stuck with the sizes of carb the Ford Six Pefromance manual sugests. That is a result of air flow impinging on carb operation. Not that bigger carbs cannot work. Big carbs can do just fine, but you have to look after the area under the carb venturis by opening it up.
 
Great info, X.

I found two autolite 1101 carbs on ebay, but these carbs are meant to be used with a load-o-matic distributor.

I recently bought an autolite 1101 on ebay (see picture):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/FORD-AUTOLITE-1 ... -s&vxp=mtr

My engine (stock 200cid with autolite 1100) has a DSII distributor hooked up to manifold vacuum. Can I used the 1101 on the picture with my DSII distributor, even though that carb has SCV?


Tom
 
If you want to get rid of the loadamatic, I will convert it to ported vacuum for $50.00 plus gaskets if necessary.
 
Bill,

I already have a DSII on the car (bought it from you back in november).
It works great with the autolite 1100(w/SCV), hooked up to manifold vacuum. I was just wondering if the autolite 1101(w/SCV) would work well with the DSII connected to manifold vacuum.


Tom
 
Tom, give it a try, the worse you can do is go to ported vacuum. I will have to pull up your specs.
I only use manifold vacuum if the mechanical advance it perfectly set up for your combination.
Usually an engine with a non stock camshaft manifold vacuum if it gives a cleaner idle.
Never use manifold vacuum to cover up an improperly set up distributor.
 
Update:

Yesterday I started installing the Autolite 1101 on the 200ci small log head. I quickly realized that I had an issue with the stock linkage. On the autolite 1100 the throttle arm moves up/down. On the autolite 1101 the throttle arm seems to move side to side, from passenger to driver side. In addition, the carb sits further back towards the firewall.
I have two options: to fabricate and attach a bracket to the 1101 throttle arm so I can convert the up/down movement of the stock linkage to right/left pattern. The other option is to install a cable setup. This option involves a pedal assembly, a cable, and a home-made bracket attached to the valve cover.
I was under the impression that the autolite 1101 would work with the stock linkage. I will post some pictures to illustrate the issue.


Tom
 
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