Duraspark II issue

Econoline

Econoline

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I got my engine running no problem last weekend. But after wards I noticed that the coil will fire one spark when the key is turn on and another single spark when the key is turned off. It doesn't always do it and sometimes the spark will last longer than other times. I've gone through the wiring and everything looks right. The engine will fire right off no problem. I noticed it b/c when I turned the key to on I heard a buzz sound come from the distributor...

I've searched online and found other's that have had this problem but not found a definite reason or solution. Yesterday I swapped out the module and it's still doing it. Module is grounded, distributor is grounded. wtf is going on here?
 
honestly I cant imagine where to get a good ds2 magnetic pick up coil and the six point metal part,

we are probably into the unknown with old refurbished magnets, and oil hall sensors or the new china parts stores junk sensors(pick up coil).

ive had successful ds2 distributors on 400 fords, 1978 and on 302 and 351w engines but this six cylinder set up has been giving me issues as well.

not sure what else the msd box may be the only real performance ignition solution unless you go with the motocraft ford module is probably my next try. with the ds2 but again I question if those are really viable parts to be running these days.

Im almost about to go back to the pertronix ignitor or ignitor 2 and stock distributor.....I never heard much about the mallory billet unit which is 400 alone.
 
I do want to give the Hei another go as well but I think aftermark 4 pins must be the way to go since you can get msd units or pertronix with great support.

Ive had great luck with pertronix HV 65k volt coils mounted off the engine.

coils-
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000J ... em_1p_5_ti
pertronix hei coil 50k volt low resistance.

out of six amazon reviews half of the reviews are five start and the three others had issues after a month.

https://www.amazon.com/MSD-8225-HEI-Ign ... CSPGDPV869

this mSd coil has better reviews

Modules 4 pin:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0035 ... em_1p_1_ti

seems to have excellent reviews on summit.....digital rev limit control + multiple spark. (sounds ages above a used gm 4 pin an I cant say im a firm believer in the ac delco unit.

Or msd has a 4 pin module as well.



I believe with their live tech support and product backing its my next viable solution So tomorrow I plan to give mSd and pertronix a call but I wouldnt totally count out accel either.

see what one you feel comfortable with. Im leaning toward the gm 4 pin ignitor 3 and a pertronix coil hopefully the hi voltage or what ever they recommend.

they duraspark is kind of a big flimsy multi piece unit so the cap and rotor plus cap mount can all have algnment problems an are ages of an old system. probably the best option we have though. I honestly like the non gm in distributor mounted module as that garantees a quality hall pick up and Ive never had any problems with those modules in over ten years experience with them. Plus if you use the right special order size resitor they do work with the 65k volt hi voltage military grade pertronix HV coil series....those are the best coils hands down.


https://www.amazon.com/PerTronix-1261-I ... B000N2WAMQ
again the well know pertronix ignitor for the stock distributor which i feel is a tighter unit and in a better designed distributor one piece and the caps are actually quality on those. and excellent reviews much more 5 star reviews then any other ignition module for this engine and really all one of the inlines will ever need unless running power adders. and again the best and newest guarantied hall sensor vs duraspark used units or china modules they usually dont read proper voltage or resistance values after proper testing.

PerTronix's Ignitor® solid-state ignition systems deliver more energy with greater timing accuracy. The secret lies in the trigger magnets, which spin with the rotor and operate a switching module that requires no external control box. The systems are immune to heat, oil, and debris and install in about 15 minutes with only two wires to connect. They come with a switching module, hardware, and instructions. They're an ideal choice for collector car restoration because they fit entirely under the distributor cap.

https://www.amazon.com/PerTronix-91261- ... B001GQQT4I
THis is the ignitor 2 for the ford load o matic type early model distributor.
I would imgine this is what you want for anything above a stock small log inline six. any performance mods probably go with this.

(106 reviews on summit of the ignitor 2 and 4.5 star adverage.


Not ones to leave well enough alone, the people at PerTronix set out to better their highly successful Ignitor® ignition conversion systems. These new Ignitor II® conversion systems have all of the same quality features as the original Ignitor®, plus a powerful microprocessor controller to deliver three to five times more available energy between 3,000 and 5,000 rpm. They're an ideal choice for collector car restoration because they fit entirely under the distributor cap.

If they had a ignitor 3 for the early inline six ford that would be great so I do like the fact the pertronix HEI flame thrower 3 is multi spark and rev control limiter is probably key.

Im leaning toward going back to the igniter 2 and the High voltage pertronix coil with proper resistor.
 
it always come back to pick two of three. REliable, CHeap, Fast

the gm 4 pin is cheap and supposedly reliable(more like available)

we want reliable and Fast ignition(spark). You especially being you got a flat top in there even though its got a recess(couldnt call 8cubic centimeters a dish) Just saying the 250 is very prone to piston damages since it has that huge piston to deck of block gap.

Ive seen stock ones have issues with 10 on the rebuild as soon as there is a little build up in there the carbon soaks up gas and when it gets hot enough damages pistons, rods, and blocks so just make sure you get a real efficient ignition and lean it out lots of the fuel side and youll have to use cleaning additives regularly to the gas and air induction. bigger ring gaps and hi end oil additives with detergents to fight oil and carbon build up in the chamber. I think it may be even more prone with a flat top to try to push the flame front out to the side of the cylinders getting the rings dirty as well so they are not hard to work on engines but id recommend regular additives and whenever you can at least get the head off and clean the pistons and combustion chamber.
 
I called pertronix and all they will recommend is the stock ignitor and ignitor two

they said their gm 4 pin flamethrower 3 will not work with six cylinder application
 
"Myth 2: Internal coils (in-the-cap) are prone to overheat.
This is probably the oldest HEI myth of all. Actually, an HEI draws only 2- to 3-amps, compared to the approximate 6-amps an external oil-filled coil draws. The lower amperage draw results in a much cooler running HEI coil. HEI Coils also run cooler because they are encapsulated in thermal epoxy, which dissipates heat more efficiently than oil-filled coils. The solid epoxy, in comparison to oil-filled coils also eliminates the possibility of leaks. You can also lose some spark intensity when you run a coil wire to an external oil-filled coil as the voltage has to travel a longer path, creating more resistance."
-http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/engines-drivetrain/sucp-0606-hei-distributors/

http://cyberdave.org/HEICoilInfo.html

Those two articles really bring the whole HEI ignition and coil theory into real world testing of combinations bewteen different stock modules and aftermarked vs mix matched coils from.

I think the msd style 8207 seems to be within correct limits from what cyberdave recommends.

or the 8227 msd is the E core design probably dissipates heat better from the coil and like superchevy article above make sure that oil coil is not requiring more amps then your module can handle.
 
Guys, lets not get sidetracked with pros-cons of coils...the OP is noticing 'extra' sparks when switching the ignition on and off - I don't see where swapping coils is going to change much...

I can see an extra spark when shutting the ignition off, since the coil may well be energized, and I don't think this would be an issue since it's just one more spark as the engine shuts down.

But the extra spark as the ignition is powered up? You've got me there, unless you've got some sort of capacitive-discharge setup. ???
 
Econoline":1jkjy91n said:
I got my engine running no problem last weekend. But after wards I noticed that the coil will fire one spark when the key is turn on and another single spark when the key is turned off. It doesn't always do it and sometimes the spark will last longer than other times. I've gone through the wiring and everything looks right. The engine will fire right off no problem. I noticed it b/c when I turned the key to on I heard a buzz sound come from the distributor...

I've searched online and found other's that have had this problem but not found a definite reason or solution. Yesterday I swapped out the module and it's still doing it. Module is grounded, distributor is grounded. wtf is going on here?
Click to expand...

Econoline so how did you wire your DuraSpark II system?
 
It's wired with a stock dsii harness and I ran new wires for start and run from the ign switch. I have an .8 ohm ballast resistor wired in the run circuit. It's basically wired oem. I was out of town this weekend so I didn't get time to do anymore trouble shooting with it.
 
Ok that should be real simple then with using an OEM harness all plugging togeather. That only leaves the Red and White wires from the Control Module. Red wire needs to have a switched full 12 volts to it, and the White wire goes to the starter solinod I terminal, some people don't hook this up but it helps with starting by retarding ignistion timing. The run wire from ignistion switch goes to one side of the ballast resistor or you could also use the stock pink restor wire and the other end of ballast resistor goes on the + coil post. Post a picture of it if you can. If you need it I post a wiring diagram. Good luck :nod:
 
I am so far from an expert... but the first thing I thought is a grounding issue. I remember a buddy years ago having weird electrical issues on his new motor and it was because his ground wires were not getting a good connection to the block and frame due to the new thick paint. Had to scrape off the paint at the connection points to fix the issues. Never assume!!
 
So I did another test on this to try and narrow down the cause. I unplugged the distributor and turned the key to on then off, nothing. Then I grounded the ground wire that goes to the distributor from the module and turned the key on and off and sure enough, it did it. So I think this tells me at least one thing, and that is that it isn't the pickup in the distributor. But then again I'm not sure how that thing works exactly either. Would open circuit tell is to fire? I'm going to get a Motorcraft module and see what happens. It seems strange that this would happen with two modules but they were the same 'premium' BWD brand modules from the local parts store.

Williboy I did test continuity to all grounds in the system, all is good. Or so it appears.
 
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