Which weber is best weber?

So while doing some searching around cause I was bored and what better to do I stumbled across an article written by redline stating when would be best to put a weber 38dgas vs the standard weber 32/36 obviously one is progressive and the other is not which makes changes to fuel economy and idle quality and what not but my question is could the weber 38dgas realistically be used on of the our ford sixes like a 200 or smaller after adding a cam and headers and your general performance products or would it still be too much carb for the motor? also would that make a better boosted carb than a 32/36? I did read that the 32/36 flows 300-320 CFM and the 38dgas 380-390 CFMs

Here is the article i read
http://www.redlineweber.com/html/applic ... ice_32.htm

I may have already answered my own question doing some number crunching with the help of some CFM calculators and the ever so bright minds at the hamb. It looks like if i kept my 170 the peak cfm needed at 5500 rpm would be 280 and 310 cfm if it was a 200 which puts the 32/36 weber right in the area i would want to be cfm wise for either of these engines, now boost is slightly different, the calculations show that @6lbs of boost I should be running 380 cfm on the 170 and 448 cfm on the 200, so if i want to go boosted the 38dgas wouldnt be a bad idea cfm wise however i dont know how easy it would be to boost reference either of these carbs but it looks like until I decide to add boost that the 32/36 would be the right one for me

Equations i got off the hamb
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/thr ... fm.497417/
CFM calculator
http://www.carburetion.com/calc.asp

it really depends on the combination, including the jetting, what cam you will use, what rpm range you are looking to operate in, etc. it also depends on what oyu expect from this engine. a while back i contacted stovebolt engine co about possibly buying a 32/36 or a 38/38 weber, they suggested using two 32/36 carter/weber carbs, because the ones they sold were set up for smaller four cylinder engines, and i might just do that at some point, if i dont go with EFI.

That does appear to be a big thing is having the correct jetting for the motor, thats why i plan on having an AFR gauge in the car to help tune the system and rejet if needed.

Any time cast iron gets in the way of good air fuel flow to the six cylinders, size, cfm and jetting become largely irrellvent, and people then have to look at major surgery to remove the "ghosting area" under the carb to ensure cylinders 1 to 6 get even air flow, and even fuel delivery.

Direct mounting is best, then you find the 38 DGES/DGAS are just sensational.

Using Adaptors, well use a smaller carb. You'll never get air flow and air fuel ratio right.

Ever consider a Holley 7448-350 carb. Another consideration is the 2100 Autolite.
Easier to tune & parts are readily available.

Don't deliver the wine in a small chalice, or the kings smokes in a small challice.


You can make a Weber get up and beg, but its not as easy as a direct mount Holley


1. Best Holley is the 4412 500 cfm with SMI modifications if direct mount. Bills the man
2. Best Autolite is the 1.33 390 FE carb if direct mount. Personal experience with this carb has been very rewarding


3. Best Weber is the 38 DG series if direct mount. All my 3 liter Capri GXL mates love this little carb, it always gives a great account of itself, although I'm Sure a 4-bbl 390 cfm would eat it, they don't fit log heads.


Anything else that bolts on to a stock log head with an adaptor, then its time to go to a small carb that has no more carb area than the area of the hole.

4. Then the best Weber is the Escort Carter Weber, a really nice, well sorted carb. But its a small fry carb

5. The 32/36's and all the Ford made Holley Weber clones can work fine too, but they just need a little more attention to ignition and PCV.

Jetting is the very last thing you ever do to a carb.


The 350 cfm 7448 can do a nice job if direct mounted, but it tops out at about 155 hp. The 500 is a really good carb, and can be made to work well.


On an I6, the 350 has poor mixture distrubtion, and opening up the 500 cfm carb seams to help everywhere through the rev range. It can be calibrated well.




Proper 2-bbl in line six carburation is about making the sure the power peak rpm has the carb venturis flowing no more than 265 feet per second.

The jetting and ignition and intake manifold and the carb arrangments help you meet this aim.

If air speed is too low, the carb is too big. If the air speed is too high, the carb won't function properly through its idle , transition and wide open throttle stages.


Putting two 1.08 venturis through a 1.3, 1.5 or 1-3/4" hole with an adaptor makes fuel air go through a second venturi, and it screws up the air fuel ratio from 650 rpm to 6500 rpm. Direct mounts open the carb area up to the way it is on the donar vehicile.


The best swap is the 500 cfm Holley with anular venturis and Bills modifications, with a direct mounting to the log head. Anything else, you might as well go back to a tiny suck a$$ 2-bbl 32/36 if you don't direct mount.


Adaptors with 1.3/1.5, 1.75" holes to the log always mean "use a smaller carb".

Holleys are designed to go big, they are proper 100% reliable performance pieces, and need direct mounts. Everything else is inferior to the good old 4412 500 cfm 2-bbl 2300 series Holley. Period.

You've got plenty of options, but they have belts and braces.

1957-1972 Autolites 2100's (0.98 to 1.33"venturi) and 1973 to 1985 Motorcraft 2150's (1.08 to 1.23) are size constrained because they are designed by Ford as econo carbs in V6's and V8'S, and they leave power on the table compared to the 1.19/1.38 Holley 350/500.

Net hp ranges from 109 to 230 hp in the 1.08 to 1.33 Autolite 2100 range, the 1.23 Motorcraft 2150 found in the 5.0 2V GT Mustangs and the last 351/ 400 F150's and Broncos, 157 to 165 hp.

The 38 Webers have 27 (1.06") or 29 mm (1.14")venturis, and are very good atomisers of fuel, but need a direct mount.
In Fords, the 38 gave 135 to 138 factory net horspower in 2.8 and 3.0 V6's

32/36's and Holley Weber 52xx/62xx/65xx carbs are econo carbs that suit adaptors. They have 23/26 or 26/27 venturis (0.90/1.02 or 1.02/1.06" venturis), and are staged mechancialy In Fords, 88 to 132 hp net.

Don't be confused with the 5740 series Carter Weber used in Escorts...its an even smaller carb (0.90/1.02" IIRC), although it works a lot better because it doesn't get sh!+ in the idle screws and jets, and has a nice float bowl.

6. Boost referencing.


A direct mount 38DGAS Weber will take it from 138 hp to 230 hp PLUS with just 9 pounds boost and no intercooling, just like the old Broadspeed TVR 3000 Turbo.




Basically like the AMA Banned Supercharged Mercury and Ford F code 340hp superchardged 312's below.




For fuel control, there is a potential membrane system like the French Solex 2-bbls used in the front drive Le Car R5 Turbo and the non EFI Solex 2-bbl carbed JDM and 1983-1984 NZ/United Kingom Colt Mirage/Cordia/Tredia Turbo.




Only thing is the membrane seals, if they are in gasoline, can rupture due to the amount of benzine and alcohol base in the fuel. Kind of like the old CDS 175 Zenith Strombergs. .

I turbocharged my Cologne V6 Cortina with a propane Impco CA 300A5 and a Ford Probe IHI RB6 turbocharger, and the viton seal kept blowing.


I can manage the carb side of thngs, that's easy. Its making a boost referenced Carter M4891 Super Strip pump for 350 Chev reworked to suit. Its got a cast in line to boost reference.

The 138 HP 3.0 British Essex 60 degree V6 was also turboed to 230 hp claimed, but 265 hp actual. Because of the best electronic ignition (British Bosch conversion to the stock carb 3.0 V6 ) and blow through 2-bbl (or CIS Bosch K Jetronic systems in the world at the time), each were standout engines, which were very successful in the Capri 2.8 v6 Turbo, Tickford Capri Turbo and the Broadspeed TVR 3000M Turbo

I'm pretty sure good ole Henry Ford II decided that the 5.0 Windsor should be THE Mustang/Capri engine.

He signed the death warrant on the 4.9 and 5.8 Clevelands in 1978, and gave only a skwiff of support to the overseas 230 hp Turbo 2994 cc Essex, and the 188 hp Turbo 2793 cc.

Both cars had stock 2-bbl Weber or Solex 38 carbs, and 9 or 6 pounds of boost to make those crazy low 230 or 188 hp numbers. They were a good 35 hp up on that; on an exceptional example chassis dynoed recently, a Capri 2.8 Turbo Zakspeed made 197 rwhp, which requires 249 hp net to make that.

The preview of the emissions legal 3.0 V6 in the 1976 TVR 300M, and then the insane turbo version at the 1977 New York Motor show should have been enough to make it the engine for the hot ticked to go Corvette hunting. Even in stock 138 hp form, it ate up the SCAA compition.



When released in 1976, the TVR 3000M Turbo and later Taimar and 3000S and SE Turbo's created deTomaso Pantera style performance for a fraction of the cost.





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jg0UFwvaJY&nohtml5=False

0-60 in 6.0 sec, 14.5 second 1/4 mile, 140 mph.

With the Capri 2.8 Turbo of 1980, it was an easy 7.6 sec 0-60 and 15.5 secomd, 134 mph car.



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xctasy":2ozcfii2 said:

This is an old post, but a goodie

One of the best conversions I can think of is a factory 1981-1983 Turbo conversion on the Capri 2.8 to the straight Solex/Pierburg 2-bbl 38 EEI carb, used on all the European 2.8 Capris and Granadas. It was something like 135 hp stock, but with just a 5.5 psi TO4 turbo, you could make 188 hp at the flyhwheel. It used just a plastic carb hat, and very few other tricks.

Since the 2.0 and 2.3 have a 2-bbl Factory manifold around off the shelf from the Fairmont and Mustang 2-bbls, that kit would be a no brainer. I think the Solex had an early Pinto Holley Weber 5200 style return line, but there was really nothing to the kit. The TVR 3000 Turbo by Broadspeed was similar to it, just a simultanoeus opening 2-bbl carb, turbo it, and your away. 138 hp becomes 265.



The 200 special build of ballistic 134 mph German Capri 2.8 Turbos, had 188 hp at 5500 rpm and 206 lb-ft with a Garret T04B50 turbo at 5.5 psi. (It was the birth of the SVO Motorsport homolgation for the Maclaren Capri, the Group A Mustang 5.0, and the IMSA GTP and SVO Mustang).

It had a simple 38 Solex 2-bbl turbo carb engine which was made Fords Mustang 2.3 carb Turbo an amature effort.




The problem with Fords only bad carb turbo, the 79 to 81 carb gasoline turbo 2.3 (not the 81-83 LPG turbo 2.3, which was an Ak Miller update) was just the intake manifold really, the rest was sound enough. A blow through carb is superior if done right.

If Ford had turboed the 3.3 instead of the 2.3, and done it the Janspeed way like the 2.8 Capri Turbo, with a 2-bbl carb, and good internals, little doubt the little six wouls have put paid to any small block Ford.

History showed that EFI and EECIV were the little 2.3's soultion set, and after 1984, Ford only ever offered one carb turbo again, and that was the 1984 Ford Laser Turbo in Australia, (KB-series Hatch Turbo version) and the Geelong and Broadmedows boys farmed out the turbo work to a third party, and foolishly downgraded the factory Mazda Familla/323/GLC EGi Turbo 91 RON system from feedback EFI to a leaded 97 octane Stromberg CDS175, and got similar problems to the 2.3 US effort a draw through turbo with poor mixture and carb problems. And that's what happens when really good engineers around the Ford empire don't share there development experiences. As a result, the aftermarket Mike Vine and AIT carb and EFI Turbo I6 Falcons were put on ice by Fords warranty engineers. The planned Aussie turbo SVO Falcon then became a non turbo SVO, and the planned 1987 EA Turbo was aborted and replaced by an aftermarket non turbo SVO Falcon, and, after AIT went bust, the Factory Turbo I6 didn't arrive untill 2003.



Another case of simple bad turbo design, and a lack of input from Ford engineers. Third party engineering could work in Europe and England, where the Turbo 2.8 carb and MFI and EFI Tickford Capris were astounding performers.

Its time for us to do the research, and see the only carb pit falls are poor carb and poor intake and exhast manifold design. Eliminate those pit falls, and you'll control detonation and get a good coversion.

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