Wrong cam?

Has anyone had any experience with the 93-3031-k clifford cam? I think it might be the wrong cam for my set up as im not getting any low end power. it either pings if i run the timing up or spits though the intake if i retard it. The only specs clifford provide are 270 .214@.05 .478 lift. Ive tried richer jetting as well and the plugs are reading like its running fine. The motor is a 66 200 with the block zero decked and 60 thousands cut off the head. It has oversize valves in it as well. Also the head has been modified to accept a 2 barrel weber 38. I put a compression guage on it and it almost read 120 psi cranking with all the plugs out and floored. Any ideas? This is all on 92 octane

what color are the plugs with the richer jetting? i dont think cam timing is your issue here, but rather your fuel curve. you might also have a localized overheating issue that you have to solve as well.

find out what your a/f ratio is, especially when the engine under load and pinging, i think you will find it is still too lean.

i would pull the thermostat and drill it with a 1/8" drill bit in a few places so that coolant and air can bleed out of the block under all conditions to remove the air from the system, usually a cause for localized overheating.

Might try richer jets still (i jumped 2 sizes 145 main to 155 main) and i got a hole in a 160 thermostat. It stays cool just fine. I think it might just have too much compression. I heard cam overlap or duration or something can help cylinder pressure to reduce pinging. Yall know alot more than i do when it comes to this kinda stuff.

I would post a picture of the plug but im not sure how. It has a good turn of soot around the base ring and the electrode is about halfway brown. It looks good according to some charts i read online.

The Blue Box":2kr0gv87 said:

Might try richer jets still (i jumped 2 sizes 145 main to 155 main) and i got a hole in a 160 thermostat. It stays cool just fine. I think it might just have too much compression. I heard cam overlap or duration or something can help cylinder pressure to reduce pinging. Yall know alot more than i do when it comes to this kinda stuff.

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i am not talking about overall overheating, but rather a localized overheating. the engine can run cool overall, but might have a localized hot spot that can cause pinging on one or two cylinders.

and yes cam overlap can reduce dynamic compression, which does reduce detonation. but then you have the issue of a lumpy idle, and soggy low end power. you have to be careful with cam selection just for this reason.

Was the cam degreed when it was installed?

I had a similar problem with my 250 and a new carb fixed it. It's going lean in the transition and pinging and maybe rich everywhere else and killing your power. Check the throttle geometry and jet up. Throttle geometry can make a HUGE difference in power response. I had great power but would ping in transition under load. And if I pushed harder there still wasn't enough fuel and it would ping harder. With a new larger carb it wouldn't ping but was low on power and that turned out to be the metering rod adjustment on the new YFA and a throttle geometry issue. It's all good now. I'm running 9.5:1+ with a 250 at sea level, but I'm still running 92 octane. Assuming you did the math right when the engine was built I'll bet it's an issue with the carb and/or the ignition. I had some ignition issues as well with my chinese parts store dsII module and I'm not sure how that played into it b/c it bit the dust the same time I swapped the carb. I swapped the module for an HEI with a TFI coil. Btw, all that also fixed my idle in gear issue. If you modified the head for 2v it shouldn't be hard to swap to an Autolite 1.08. I have a new adapter I'm not going to use I got from classic inlines I want to sell if you're interested.

What I read(rEEd) you saying is that if you set the timing lower than say 10-12 btdc it runs on or belches at shut down, and if you set it higher than 10 it pings? That was my exact scenario.

So yall think over carbed? Hmmm. Makes sense. You talk about "throttle geometry" what does that mean? The weber 38 opens both barrels at the same time, it isnt progressive. Dont they make choke plates for the webers that make em act like a smaller carb?

Oh never mind you said bigger carb

Throttle geometry is the throw at the pedal to the the opening @ the carb rate. If it is off enough the car will take more throttle to go, and depending on the arc and pivot point you can have a pedal that is pushed 1/2 @ 1/4 throttle then ramp up the other 3/4 over the last half. I don't know what your problem is, but I do suspect your carb is a big part of it. I could be totally wrong. I could ask what the chamber volume was, where you ended up degreeing the cam, but I assume you did your due diligence and it's probably something else.

I'd go back to Gene's question about whether or not the cam was degree'd when installed. I swore up and down that I installed mine correctly the first time, but went and degree'd it anyway. Lo and behold, it was off by a tooth. If I remember right, 1 tooth is about 13 degrees.

What year head is on the engine???
As Gene said, did you degree in the cam?? I would advance it 4 degrees.
What kind of ignition system are you running???
Need more info to pin point your problem.

cr_bobcat":34x5w1ly said:

I'd go back to Gene's question about whether or not the cam was degree'd when installed. I swore up and down that I installed mine correctly the first time, but went and degree'd it anyway. Lo and behold, it was off by a tooth. If I remember right, 1 tooth is about 13 degrees.

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X3

cr_bobcat":1802qccr said:

I'd go back to Gene's question about whether or not the cam was degree'd when installed. I swore up and down that I installed mine correctly the first time, but went and degree'd it anyway. Lo and behold, it was off by a tooth. If I remember right, 1 tooth is about 13 degrees.

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Yeah...back in the day many moons ago I installed a sig erson cam in a 250 and had trouble degreeing it...so I gave up and just installed it straight up. :nono: Ran like a dog and slower than when stock...and I had a 500 Holly 2 barrel on it. Turns out it was retarded something like 13 degrees...that will ruin your day! Once I got it 4 degrees advanced it was a beast.

This all sounds like it makes alot of sense about the cam maybe being off, I'm not sure of the condition of the short block but if it's new-ish 120psi is pretty low. I kind of overlooked that part. But the way you stated it, it sounds like maybe you haven't done a compression test before? Generally it's all plugs out, throttle wide open and three compression cranks on each cylinder to get the reading(s). And I'll echo the words about degreeing the cam, I too had an Erson cam that couldn't be degreed properly w/o an offset crank key. Due to another problem with the damned thing I didn't use it though.

Hey it's my lucky post!

"... I didn't use it..."
seems like just yesterday

I will check with the previous owner of the motor to see about how he installed the cam. This motor is that one that was on ebay. Yall might of saw it. It was in the for sale section of fordsix for a while

The Blue Box":g3mj7y5m said:

I will check with the previous owner of the motor to see about how he installed the cam. This motor is that one that was on ebay. Yall might of saw it. It was in the for sale section of fordsix for a while

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Was it the one that was designed to make 360 torque and 260 HP then yes .

to add, the cylinder head is a 66 small log head with oversize valves installed and a plate brazed on to accept a weber 38, not an adapter, so a true 2bbl. Running a stock exhaust manifold

drag-200stang":1q7urv8f said:

The Blue Box":1q7urv8f said:

I will check with the previous owner of the motor to see about how he installed the cam. This motor is that one that was on ebay. Yall might of saw it. It was in the for sale section of fordsix for a while

Click to expand...

Was it the one that was designed to make 360 torque and 260 HP then yes .

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Yes, thats my motor and so far the hp numbers are bs. But i didnt expect it anyways as the one hotrod did an article on had the aluminum cylinder head, headers and a 4bbl carb only made 235 hp at like a gazillion rpms