Spotting a 144, 170 and 200cui six?

Odmark91

New member
Hey guys!

Im soon going to look at an engine that i might buy, it is a straight six out of a 1968 Ford Falcon (US).

The seller tells me its a 250cui engine, but since the biggest six avalible in that generation falcon is 200 im not buying that.

Is there a way to tell what kind of engine it is? 144, 170 or 200?

Also, its complete with a manual transmission, what kinds of manuals where offered in this year? both 3 and 4 speed toploaders?

Victor
 
Hi, the quick way to tell a 200 from a 144 or 170 is the freeze out plugs. A 200 has 5 plugs on the passenger side and the others have 3. The 200, 170, and 144 have 3 bolts for the water pump, and the 250 has 4. You could easily check the casting number on the block and head to see what you got. It probably has a 3 speed, with 2 shift arms on the tranny. A 4 speed has 3 shift arms. Get the Falcon Performance Handbook for all this information. Good luck
 
B RON CO":3kqjmq14 said:
Hi, the quick way to tell a 200 from a 144 or 170 is the freeze out plugs. A 200 has 5 plugs on the passenger side and the others have 3. The 200, 170, and 144 have 3 bolts for the water pump, and the 250 has 4. You could easily check the casting number on the block and head to see what you got. It probably has a 3 speed, with 2 shift arms on the tranny. A 4 speed has 3 shift arms. Get the Falcon Performance Handbook for all this information. Good luck

Another way to tell the 144, 170, and 200 from a 250 is the starter location.
The 144, 170, and 200 (up to 1981) have the starter located above the oil pan bolt flange.
The 250 has the starter located below the oil pan bolt flange, like the SBF 260/289/302 V8.
In fact the 250 can use the same bellhousing as the 302, and the flywheel if it is zero balanced.

The engine in the 68 Falcon you're looking at could have a 250 in it. Someone could have swapped out the original engine for a 250.
A lot can happen to a vehicle in 50 years. That year Falcon could even have come with a 289 V8 and converted to a 250, but conversions are usually the other way around.

The 250 uses the 3.03 V8 transmission. The 2.77 transmission used behind a 200 can't handle the torque of a 250.

Hope this helps.
 
A low mounted starter would indicate 250 but doubtful it's a 250 because of clearance issues make for a considerable mod' involved swap. The 3 vs 5 freeze plug should reveal 170 vs 200 if the casting numbers appear correct for the '68. The casting numbers that count are next to the starter not the intake/head.

250 is @ 2" taller and is considerably longer interfering with radiator and 250 starter interferes with steering making for an 'involved' swap in early cars.

have fun
( 61 Comet with D7DE 250)
 
This is off the CI website. I believe that this information is posted here too. I hope this helps.

Aaron
 

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More general info not listed in the CI chart,

The '71 Maverick 170 is C8DE block with 3 freeze plugs, DODE closed chamber head and used a C7ZA bellhouse with 3OTT 3.03 'toploader'. Other later 170 #s unknown . ..

haev fun
 
# of H2O pump bolts too.
I've read the 'Handbook' & 'Tech Archive' so much I have them confused but I think under "Sm Six" (clk on "TA" above @ big blue box crossed screwdriver/wrench) there's a bit on IDing (250 is the wider taller longer 1 unless U look @ 240/300. 144, 170, 200 R just 'stroked'.

I'm glad you spoke about the "swapability issues" - anything can B in that car.
"... in that generation falcon is..."
well the 250 DID come out the next yr (1st 250 - 1969) but '60 -'63, 64/5, & 66-70 were the "Generations" changes - only 3 in USA...
 
Thank you for all the posts! Now i just have to wait until the snow melts so i can get to where the engine is stored.

Yes it is possible that it is swapped out but i very much doubt it. I am located in sweden and when people here put the effort to swap the engine in a straight six falcon they usually install a V8.

As for the transmission, how much abuse will a 3speed toploader take on the street? Will it stand up to V8 torque? The plan is to swap this inline out for a small block ford later down the road.
 
thanks for naming ur country of origin (location?). Nothing in the sig.

Round here some friends use the "3.03" in their tube chassy circle track racers.
The venerable 3 speed can handle 500 HP from what I understand.

W/the engine swap (or not) I'd suggest a T5, the 3 leaves a lill 2B desired for modern driving...

Send us back the i6 if U don't want it.
:eek:

/OR/
w/the 'earth changes' goin on now mount it on the floor (stationary power) to crush the grapes you'll soon be out producing France, Italy'n Greece!
:(
 
Howdy Back Odmark:

Which three speed are you asking about? The 2.77 non-syncro was used til sometime in 1967. the much stronger all syncro 3.03 also first appeared in 1967. THe 3.03 tranny will handle V8 power.

As for the identification, the starter location is the obvious one. Next is the number of bolts holding on the water pump. 3 = 170 200. 4 = 250.

Good luck on your search.

Adios, David
 
Chad:
I just noticed that, i have now added my location to my profile :)

Yes i have also thought about a T5, but from what i read it doesent seem to hold power very well?

The car im putting this in is a 1960 Vauxhall Cresta that will be built hotrod/gasser style, so modern driving capabilitys is not really a priority :D

Haha yeah sure you can have the i6, if i not decide to keep it and turbo it instead :eek:

CZLN:
I dont know yet what three speed is in it, the seller claims the engine is out of a 1968 falcon so i hope it is the 3.03!
 
Howdy Again:

THe T5 transmission has been used behind many engines from Ford- 4cylinders, V6s as well as mega HP V8s. You don't need to worry about a T5 handling the power of small block Ford six. THe extra gears an gear spacing options can be ideal for a 200/250 engine. THe T5 weighs only slightly more than a 3.03 trans.

GIven a choice, I would opt for a T5 from a V8 donor, for better gear spacing.

Adios, David
 
also known as the 'world class' model (frm the bent8, not other models). Even the Vauxhall hot rod will benefit frm this.
The i6 is not a real 'rever' (well, the 200 is). Get ur rear end gears/tire diameter of the correct ratio to the motor/transmish. when finalized...
Keep in touch, wanna hear how it goes as U progress !
(y)
 
CZLN6:
Im not worried about the T5 handling small six power, but how will it do when i replace the six for a v8?

Chad:
Yeah i will also swap the front and rear axles out to from a volvo (Or 2 volvos really, front axle from 140 series and rear axle from 240 series) so i will have many gear and rim options :D
Of course i will keep you posted! Right now i have just gotten started, i have tore the front and rear axles of the car and is currently grinding off on the underside of the car :D

This is the car in question, but before i switched garages:
80104-a635b4988d777d1b4ec44cc95296f836.jpg
 
"...worried about the T5 handling small six power, but how will it do when i replace the six for a v8?..."
again, the "World Class" T5 is from the bent8...
(not the other T5 models)
 
chad":gi7qdshr said:
"...worried about the T5 handling small six power, but how will it do when i replace the six for a v8?..."
again, the "World Class" T5 is from the bent8...
(not the other T5 models)

Oh okay! and bent8 means? :oops:
 
sorry, some Straight sixers see the "V" eight as a lill bent (45*, 60* & 90*)...
8^0
 
chad":1s5on5sp said:
sorry, some Straight sixers see the "V" eight as a lill bent (45*, 60* & 90*)...
8^0

Oh okay, i understand :mrgreen:

Well i would certanly like a 5 speed when time comes for the v8 swap, but the six will have to do with the 3 speed toploader.

Sadly T5 boxes are quite hard to find here, and quite expensive. I could get one off ebay or someting but with shipping costs added it costs about the same or more anyways.

I think it almost might be cheaper to get an adapter plate for a BMW ZF box and one of those transmissions if i want 5 or 6 speeds. :eek:
 
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