t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Mach1Mark

Well-known member
I posted this in the transmission swap section, but thought is might get more reception in this area...Quick question, i hope has a simple answer. I have an opportunity to purchase a T5 out of a 95 mustang GT.... Will it bolt up to my 66 200 block. I will need an adapter plate and I have the bell housing off a [manual] 3 speed 6cyl trans . however I'm under the impression that I need a new, or different input shaft? are these easily obtainable, and easy to replace. Or should I just continue to look for a 93 and older trans. Thanks for your help
 
Some of the info you might need in IDing your bell housing and flywheel combo plus which of the T 5 adapter plates available can maybe found in the above post on small block six differences see below link. I don't know that there is a difference on the input shaft lengths until 1997 and after but I could be wrong. Good luck (y) :nod:

Block and Bell Housing Differences
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=80022
 
yes, I read all that info, unfortunately it was quite confusing to me. I spoke to MDL some time ago and did look at the web site, and the way I understood, an early 3 speed bell with adapter (from MDL of course) would fit from like 82 up to 93, but read further is some of these post,..that I would need a new input shaft for 94 and 95 T5. Just wanted some clarification. Thanks for Ur and help, maybe others will chime in.
 
Mach1Mark":2lrak24u said:
yes, I read all that info, unfortunately it was quite confusing to me. I spoke to MDL some time ago and did look at the web site, and the way I understood, an early 3 speed bell with adapter (from MDL of course) would fit from like 82 up to 93, but read further is some of these post,..that I would need a new input shaft for 94 and 95 T5. Just wanted some clarification. Thanks for Ur and help, maybe others will chime in.
I think you're right on the longer input shaft for the 94,95. The input shafts should be available online and I'm sure there are videos on YouTube for swapping the input shafts. There are plenty of T5 videos on there.

On your bell, some 66 engines have a small bell and some have a large bell. This will determine what adapter plate you need. You can probably tell by putting your hand behind the engine. If it is about flush to where the head bolts, its a big bell. If its about 2 inches below, its a small bell.

Good luck
Ryan
 
Okay in checking into this further, so yes You are correct in that the dividing line on the shorter input shaft lengths is end of production of the Fox chassis cars. Then when the SN95 Mustang chassis came out in 1994 the input shaft was indeed 3/4 inch longer and these last two years (1994 1995) of using the 5.0 engines in the Mustangs, a different and longer bell housing to fit those T5's into the SN95 chassis cars. Good luck (y) :nod:
 
Sn 95 mustangs are 5/8 deaper in the bell housing and the input shaft is longer to match. The front bearing retainer is different to match as well. Buy a kit and swap everything over. I just finished doing this to my 94 unit.
There is a large pattern small trans Bell out there, I had one and had to source a different bell.
Look at the starter and bell housing suface to identify what you have. Look the the trans as well, since it's possible to have the small trans with a large bell.

Clutch is the same as the large trans, standard 10 spline, small uses a different clutch and not sure which one is needed.
Check the new input shaft vs clutch, first one I had did not fit splines due to machining error. I had the company send out a second one and it fit.
 
thanks for help guys. ill look at some u tube videos how to change the input shaft. As far as the big bell? is that what people on the forum are talking about 8 1/4 clutch and 9 inch clutch, or is that something different?. I understand any bell housing beyond year 64 is a "big" bell housing. meaning that the bell housing will fit 200 cu. and small bell fit 140 and 170cu. Am I confused?
 
Actually it's real easy and all this info in the link in my above post about block differences. But to simply it even more see below then check your block casting number to ID what your Mustang has.

The Small Inline Six Blocks

1. All the early small six blocks built from July 1959 (for the first year 1960 Falcon / Comet production run) to end of 1965 model run with block numbers C0DE to C5DE. These early 144, 170 or 200 blocks will only have the bolt pattern for the small six bell housings that were only used with the 8 1/2 inch clutch and dog dish flywheel in the cars, along with a 2.77 trans.

2.In 1966 the C6DE block was the first to have a duel bolt bell housing pattern these engines got the bigger 9 inch clutch and flat type flywheel, or the Duel Range C4 Cruise o Matic that still used the smaller bell housing bolt pattern. Though I can't prove it at this time I think that all the high mount starter 170 and 200 blocks made in 1966 to end of production will likely be the duel bolt pattern blocks. So they can use eigher the larger pattern bell housing for the 9 inch flywheel clutch combo or the small patern bell housing. So far I have not worked on, found, or seen any pictures of a single bell housing pattern D series block or one that was not drilled and tapped with both patterns.

Now if you find that your 1966 Mustang still has it's original engin block than it will be a duel patern block (check the block cast numbers to verify). It should also have the better larger bell housing and 9 inch clutch. Count your starters number of mounting bolts or look for the bell housings casting number to verify this. Good luck (y) :nod:
 
So I have sourced a bellhousing from 66 3speed manual trans, I have the t5 transmission, I'm just a little confused, the bellhousing (66 3speed) came with the transmission, a new disc, a flywheel and pressure plate also the throwout bearing. So can I reuse those items or do I have to get a new pressure plate and other parts for a v8..also do I need to get a new starter, the current starter on the c4 trans, on the car, I know won't fit a 289 v8 flywheel, the teeth are different. So is the 66 3speed flywheel the same as a v8 flywheel? . Enlighten me I'm a little confused. Thank you guys for your time
 
Mach1Mark":13irg9sr said:
So I have sourced a bellhousing from 66 3speed manual trans, I have the t5 transmission, I'm just a little confused, the bellhousing (66 3speed) came with the transmission, a new disc, a flywheel and pressure plate also the throwout bearing. So can I reuse those items or do I have to get a new pressure plate and other parts for a v8..also do I need to get a new starter, the current starter on the c4 trans, on the car, I know won't fit a 289 v8 flywheel, the teeth are different. So is the 66 3speed flywheel the same as a v8 flywheel? . Enlighten me I'm a little confused. Thank you guys for your time

Hi Mach1Mark, yes you can use all the stock 1966 200 six bell housing, 136 tooth flat flywheel, 9 inch pressure plate & clutch disk, release bearing arm & stock throw out bearing. Just add the correct T5 adapter plate and 1982 to 1993 T5 trans (or a 1994 / 95 T5 trans with a swapped earlier 1993 down shorter T5,input shaft). No you wouldn't want a 289 V8 flywheel it's a larger diameter, the ring gear tooth count is more (157), plus the they are 28 oz. imbalance this won't work on a 200 six or fit in a six cyclinder bell housing anyway. You need a starter with a 2 bolt mounting if your C4 auto trans starter is the three bolt type your choices are to swap out the nose cone for a 2 bolt one, replace the starter with a stock 1966 manual trans starter, or replace it with one of the smaller and lighter mini starters which could give you some extra clearance for a set of headers. Good luck on your T5 swap. (y) :nod:
 
Well, I decided to take the new clutch disc (new old stock from 67), and the throw out bearing and test fit it on the input shaft of the T5. it wouldn't fit, so I need a clutch disc and throwout bearing from a 289 or 302 66 Mustang or 67. Am I correct? Can I use my Fork? And use my 136 tooth flywheel, it takes a 9-inch clutch disk, , I understand the v8 flywheel is weighted so I miss spoke, but I can use my old flywheel...assume I cannot use my "clutch pressure plate assembly"? please tell me what I'm missing. do I have to buy all this from MDL or can I buy like a 289 67 pressure plate assembly with 10 spline pattern from let's rockauto?
 
Thanks Bubba for responding I am going to test the bearing and the clutch plate again.

I have a 94 t5, I checked it against the original input shaft and also a new shorter shaft for a 93 T5. I test fitted the throwout bearing and the disk against both of these shafts and they did not fit either one. Thanks for your help but I must be missing something..I'm going to test fit them again and see if I did something wrong, I'm also going to measure them.
 
I am reading a section Ford I6 performance handbook page 87. On that page it says the clutch plate needs to Simply measure plate diameter of 9inch and the spline count on the input shaft of your T5 (10 spline I guess) the pressure plate will need to be diaphragm style plate..it also says the Borg & Beck three-finger style will not have clearance in the bellhousing.

So I assume a v8 clutch and pressure plate?
 
Mach1Mark":3eqhh26p said:
I am reading a section Ford I6 performance handbook page 87. On that page it says the clutch plate needs to Simply measure plate diameter of 9inch and the spline count on the input shaft of your T5 (10 spline I guess) the pressure plate will need to be diaphragm style plate..it also says the Borg & Beck three-finger style will not have clearance in the bellhousing.

So I assume a v8 clutch and pressure plate?

There are lots of posts on the site for T5 swaps yes many will use the Diafram type clutches but some of them have used the 3 finger Borg and Beck. Check posts by Rick Wrench, Powerband, Stardeigo, ect. Also note if your have a 4 cylinder or V8 T5 they take a different size pilot bearing on a 4 cylinder. The clutch disk for the 1966 parts will need to be a 9 inch diameter size the V8 clutch disk and pressure plate is 10 inch. Is your bell housing for a 3.03 trans? Can you post some pictures of the parts you have?Good luck (y) :nod:
 
Well back to more research. I was thinking it was buy A part and B part and put it on C. I guess not. Thanks for ur help.

The 3 speed 66 bell housing has the 2 bolt starter with 9inch 136 toothe flywheel.

The t5 is a 94 v8 mustang , with a 93 shorter shaft 10spline..
 
Mach1Mark:2vbdbdp4 said:
Well back to more research. I was thinking it was buy A part and B part and put it on C. I guess not. Thanks for ur help.

The 3 speed 66 bell housing has the 2 bolt starter with 9inch 136 toothe flywheel.

The t5 is a 94 v8 mustang , with a 93 shorter shaft 10spline..

Ok the bad thing is the 1966 bell housing was a one year only parts combo that requires a little different handeling then the 1967 up 200's parts combos.

So here's your customized parts list of what's needed to do your a T5 swap! First all these stock 1966 three speed trans parts can be used for a T5 swap.

1. You can use that 1966 bell housing you just need to be sure to use the right T5 adapter plate to fit a 66 bell. This is the narrow trans pateren adapter plate.

2. You can also use the stock 1966 clutch linkage (Z bar, linkage rods, clutch pedal, return spring, ect.) or optionally you could change it over to a cable type pedel kit if you want.

3. Two bolt starter for a 200 manual trans car. Example this is stock starter for a 1966 Mustang with a three speed standard / manual trans. If you have or can find the nose cone parts (rear of starter) your C4 starter can be converted.

4. The 1966 tin block plate for a manual trans bell housing should be used between the block and bell housing it is installed first before the flywheel goes on.

5. The flywheel is the correct 9 inch flat style use it. Check the surface and if need be have it surfaced so it is flat and true and get the correct lenght bolts (stock Ford or ARP) to install the flywheel (they are longer then the C4 flex plate bolts) put some sealer on the threads and torque to spec.

6. The 3 finger pressure Plate could be used or optionally it could be changed out to a Diafram type clutch kit they have a little easier pedel feel / pushing it in compared to the three finger pressure plate. Make sure you have the correct pressure plate bolts they have a shoulder that fits into the flywheel (stock Ford or ARP) torque to spec.

7. The 1966 throwout bearing arm / release arm can be used with the correct 1967 throwout bearing.

8. Your 1994 T5 with the installed shorter (earlier 1993 down) input shaft is also correct for this swap.

These are all the Parts you will need to acquire and use in place of the 1966 Parts

9. The 1966 clutch disk can't be used, it was for a 2.77 trans it's the wrong spline count as you noted above. You will need to get and use a 1967 up Mustang 200 disk for a 3.03 trans (that has the 10 spines).

10. The 1966 throw out bearing can't be used you need to get and use the 1967 up Mustang 200 throwout bearing for a 3.03 trans.

11. The crankshaft pilot bearing you need to use with a V8 T5 trans needs to be the one for a 1967 up Mustang 200 with a 3.03 trans. This is the first item to be installed before the flywheel is installed.

12. You will need a T5 conversion type crossmember or be able to build your own.

13. You will need to get a T5 trans yoke, and may possibly need to shorten your driveshaft though some have been able to use their current C4 driveshaft.

Best of luck on your T5 swap. (y) :nod: Edited
 
Thanks for your response that actually helped a lot. Cleared a few things up for me.

however I do have a new clutch disc that is stamped c67, the splines will fit the 3-speed and will not fit the t5. So I guess I will have to buy a new clutch disc anyway. Thank you for your help... I will try to put this thing together, and of course if I have questions I will certainly ask
.. again, thanks
 
Mach1Mark":222dor42 said:
Thanks for your response that actually helped a lot. Cleared a few things up for me.

however I do have a new clutch disc that is stamped c67, the splines will fit the 3-speed and will not fit the t5. So I guess I will have to buy a new clutch disc anyway. Thank you for your help... I will try to put this thing together, and of course if I have questions I will certainly ask
.. again, thanks

Your are very welcome and am glad I was able to be of help and if you need more info let me know. You might pick up a V8 T5 clutch input shaft alignment tool to use to check the clutch disk (or you could haul your T5 in) when your hunting for your new disk. Also if you got the stock clutch linage (Z Bar ect.) you should be able to use that too unless you are planing to use a Cable Clutch Conversion Kit. (y) :nod:
 
Thanks again,.. very helpful. I thought about it,.. my clutch disc, although its new old stock is stamped C 6 7, so it is not actually a 67 it's a 66. I don't know what the 7 is for,.. very confusing. That may explain why my new clutch disc does not fit the 10 spline T5. I have an extra shaft that I purchased to change my 94 to a 93 shorter shaft on the T5,..so that helps when I'm shopping for the clutch plate. Although I never thought of an alignment tool, very smart! Thanks
 
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