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1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

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paul25g
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1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

Post #1 by paul25g » Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:30 am

Hi there,

I purchased a '66 Mustang that came with a 2.77 3 speed manual transmission and a 1966 200ci, 6 cylinder engine (I confirmed the engine date from the engine ID tag) but the bell housing was missing.

I had a spare 200ci, 6 cylinder engine from another Mustang project that had the bell housing. This engine ID tag identified it as a 1965 engine.

I wanted to keep the 1966 engine in the Mustang so that the numbers would match so I figured I'd just take the bell housing from the 1965 engine and put it on the 1966 engine. Unfortunately, the bell housing from the '65 engine wouldn't fit on the '66 engine.

The part number on the '65 bell housing is C3DA-6394-B. The other difference I noticed is that the starter for the '65 motor and bellhousing is a 3 bolt......the starter for the '66 motor is a two bolt.

Were the bell housings designed differently for these two years or is my problem somewhere else? Thanks!!

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rocklord
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Re: 1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

Post #2 by rocklord » Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:26 am

The 65 bellhousing is similar to the ones found in the earlier falcons and uses bolt holes lower on the block. The 66 bellhousing is unique to that year and uses bolt holes higher up on the engine block. Your 66 block should have two sets of bolt holes on it, the upper ones for the standard bellhousing, and the other pair for the C4 bellhousing. The earlier 65 bellhousing uses the same bolt holes as the C4 bell.

The only reason the 65 bellhousing wouldn't work is if you're trying to use the backing plate from the 66 bell. The 65 bell will fit on the 66 block, but the 66 bell won't fit on a 65 or earlier block.

If you ever decide to upgrade to a T-5 transmission, the adapter plate is different between the 65 and 66 bell.

Hope this helps.
Dan

Currently Own
1965 Mustang, 200CID, 3Spd
1964 Corvair Coupe, 164CID, 140HP, 4Spd
1961 Corvair Lakewood wagon, 145CID, 80HP, 2Spd Powerglide Auto.
2020 BMW X3 M, 3.0L Dual Turbo, 473HP, 8-Spd Auto

paul25g
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Posts: 54
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 11:39 am
Location: Mid-west Ohio

Re: 1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

Post #3 by paul25g » Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:38 am

Thanks Dan.

The other problem is that the '65 bellhousing won't fit over the '66 flywheel. I wonder if I can take the '65 flywheel and then move everything over to the '66.

Would the clutch, pressure plate, clutch fork and throwout bearing be the same?

Thanks!

Paul

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FalconSedanDelivery
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Re: 1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

Post #4 by FalconSedanDelivery » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:20 am

It should all fit ( can't mix the parts ) but why go backwards?
Falcon 6's, FE's I Like them both , Sold all My 6 cyl stuff ( for now at least ) glad to pass along some tips though

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rocklord
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Re: 1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

Post #5 by rocklord » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:29 pm

The 65 uses the 8.5-inch recessed flywheel, the 66 uses the 9-inch flat flywheel. Pressure plates are different, and the TO bearing may also be.

As FalconSedanDelivery stated, can't mix parts. Ford switched to a 9-inch clutch/flywheel/pressure plate for increased power transfer.

If you want to go with the 8.5-inch setup, look into purchasing a 215mm pressure plate for an Alfa Romeo or Mercedes 190. Just need to cut down the step to around 0.87-inch. Check it out here: viewtopic.php?f=76&t=42556
You can find these brand new, as opposed to rebuilt Ford units with possible weak springs.
Dan

Currently Own
1965 Mustang, 200CID, 3Spd
1964 Corvair Coupe, 164CID, 140HP, 4Spd
1961 Corvair Lakewood wagon, 145CID, 80HP, 2Spd Powerglide Auto.
2020 BMW X3 M, 3.0L Dual Turbo, 473HP, 8-Spd Auto

paul25g
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Posts: 54
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 11:39 am
Location: Mid-west Ohio

Re: 1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

Post #6 by paul25g » Mon Jun 27, 2011 2:43 pm

I've been using the '65 motor with the 2.77 three speed in the car for the last several years. I was interested in the info for the '66 motor because I'd like to rebuild it one day and put it back in the car since it was the original motor.

For now, the '65 will stay in.

I've had a terrible time with clutches in this thing, specifically a lot of clutch chatter. One time several years ago the pressure plate blew up inside the bell housing....I understand that may not be too uncommon given the 3-finger pressure plates have generally been rebuilt way past their useful lives.

That makes the info you gave about the Alpha pressure plates very interesting.

If I understand correctly, all I would need to do is get my 8.5" flywheel on the '65 motor turned down an extra .15" off of the lip face (where the plate mounts)?

Would my existing clutch plate, clutch fork and throwout bearing be reusable with the Alpha pressure plate?

Any part number for the Alpha pressure plate or know exactly where to find one?

Looks like this is a very useful upgrade that doesn't sound too difficult. Thanks guys!

Paul

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rocklord
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Re: 1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

Post #7 by rocklord » Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:37 pm

I'd say your clutch chatter is caused by not taking the same amount off the step when the flywheel surface was milled. The 8.5-inch flywheel has a 1-inch step where the pressure plate attaches. When the surface of the flywheel is machined to remove any hot spots, the step has to be milled the same amount. If you don't, the pressure plate won't clamp the clutch disc enough and it will chatter. Found that out myself the hard way back in 76 when I replaced the clutch in my first 65 Mustang; it would always chatter when starting off.

Don't just take 0.15" off the lip face of the 8.5-inch flywheel if you use the 215mm PP, make sure the lip face measures 0.85"-0.87" from the flywheel surface (See first paragraph).

As for the Alfa pressure plate, you should be able to use you existing clutch fork, TO bearing, and clutch plate. The Alfa and MB uses a diaphram pressure plate, whereas the Ford uses three fingers that the TO rides on. The diaphram plate is easier to release so it's not as hard on your knee as the three finger.

I don't remember the part numbers, but the link for richwrench's post viewtopic.php?f=76&t=42556 gives you what model years to look for. As to where, look at http://www.rockauto.com , they have decent prices but may only have clutch kits.
Dan

Currently Own
1965 Mustang, 200CID, 3Spd
1964 Corvair Coupe, 164CID, 140HP, 4Spd
1961 Corvair Lakewood wagon, 145CID, 80HP, 2Spd Powerglide Auto.
2020 BMW X3 M, 3.0L Dual Turbo, 473HP, 8-Spd Auto

paul25g
Registered User
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 11:39 am
Location: Mid-west Ohio

Re: 1965-1966 200ci 6 cylinder bell housing differences???

Post #8 by paul25g » Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:42 pm

Thanks a ton Dan, that's been a lot of help!

Paul

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