200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

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200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #1 by sixty6 » Fri Oct 02, 2015 11:05 am

Just purchased 66 coupe and have few questions. It drives fine but when all warmed up at idle there's either misfire or something else that doesn't feel smooth. Just wondering where should I start checking things and what to look for. I'll try to upload some photos since i don't know what ignition and carburetor is there and if it's original or not. Thank you for your time and advice!
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #2 by CoupeBoy » Fri Oct 02, 2015 2:39 pm

Number one thing to always verify is that you have a carb and distributor that match/work together.
There was this article published a few years back.
Six-Cylinder Tuning & Performance -- mustangandfords.com

After step 1 is verified, then you can start looking at other sources.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #3 by JackFish » Fri Oct 02, 2015 2:54 pm

I start by checking and replacing the spark plugs.
At idle you can pull each plug lead and listen to see if any one in particular effects the engine.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #4 by CZLN6 » Sun Oct 04, 2015 5:04 pm

Howdy Sixty6:

And welcome to The Forum. Your engine and you are in good company here. In addition to the spark plugs, assess the condition of the spark plug wires and the distributor cap. And add a thorough check for any vacuum leaks somewhere at the base of the carb, on the gasket line, and on all vacuum hoses both at the carb and at the distributor. And at the transmission if this is on an automatic trans car. Listen closely. If you hear hissing sounds eliminate them. The common source of leaks is where the rubber vacuum hoses fit over a nipple. Time and engine heat cause them to crack and split.

You are right to identify what carb and distributor you are working with as California had different emission requirements in '66 and '67 model years. So, was your car a Calif Emissions equiped car? FYI- Specifically, the 1100 Autolite carb was changed to a ported vacuum source for the distributors vacuum advance. The carb was also downsized in cfm from 187 to 150. The '66 & '67distributor had both centrifugal and vacuum advance. the vacuum advance is married to the ported vacuum source on the carb.

Quick and dirty visual clues for a CalifEm engine are, no Spark Control Valve on the carb, two nipples on the vacuum canister on the distributor- one on the inside (distributor side) and one on the outside.

Others- how long since a tune-up? How many miles on the engine? Engine condition?

That should get you started. Keep us updated on your progress.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #5 by sixty6 » Sun Oct 04, 2015 5:58 pm

Thank you for all replies. I was instructed to wait until my post is approved and never got email that my question was posted, just checked today to see if my post is there and I found all your replies. Glad that i will not be left alone to work on my Stang. Here some photos.
Image
Image

Image
Image
Image

Image

Image

Also I checked compression and it's around 175 across all of them. Just bought this Mustang, so not sure about last tune up or history of the engine. It also has T5 from 1992 Mustang, originally it came with 3 speed manual. Please check photos in the link. I tried to insert images but there's size restriction.
Last edited by sixty6 on Mon Oct 26, 2015 1:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #6 by bubba22349 » Sun Oct 04, 2015 8:59 pm

Your Mustang has a replacement Holley 1940 carb, and it also looks like it also has the 1966 Calif. emissions with the better centrifugal advance distributor. Your plugs look to be the correct number, you might check that they are gapped to .034, that the points are in good condition, i.e. Not pitted and adjusted to (.025 gap) or better still set to the correct dwel of 37 to 42 degrees. Timing is set stock to 6 degrees BTDC you could go to 8 or 10 BTDC if you want a little more performance. Idle RPM should be 575 to 600 after you have set the idle mixture screw to the lean the best idle. Be sure to Also test the plug wires with a volt ohm meter Leave them hooked up to distributor cap to test each one for proper resistance readings or replace them I can't tell their condition in the pictures. The distributor cap and rotor look to be in good condition in the picture. If the miss is at idle RPM or low speeds and seam to clear up as speed or RPM goes up this usually indicates an ignition problem such as fouled or worn out plugs, points that need adjustment or replaced, deteriorated plug wires, a cap that has carbon tracking, or a weak coil. Good luck :nod:

Edited
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #7 by sixty6 » Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:03 pm

Plugs 2 and 3 are black, others are normal. I changed all plugs. Checked resistance on spark plug wires and they all consistent with each other, numbers were increasing by 1 as they got longer, just don't remember the Ohm settings. Timing set at 6. I'm still figuring out where to buy dwell/tach meter. Local stores don't have them and there plenty of used ones on ebay, just not sure which one to get. Seems like plenty of cheap ones that are old style, and some newer ones that are electronic. Any advice?

EDIT:
Also this afternoon something happened to my electrical system 3 gauges (fuel, oil pressure and temperature) went to the max, but i was able to drive home without problems.
Last edited by sixty6 on Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #8 by bubba22349 » Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:00 pm

On testing the plug wires there is some good basics for readings in this link. https://www.ngk.de/en/technology-in-det ... on-cables/

Most all of them that I had used as a Mechanic where the Analog (dial type) I do like those that have a bigger scale so it's much easier to read and make your settings. SnapOn is a very good one I still have one of their older engine Analyzers (Scope) that also has the tach dwel unit in it, there are number of others that are good too. Sears still sells a budget meter made by Acton, there is nothing wrong with getting a used one if you can try it out first, I think a Digital is probably going to be the most accurate today but if you find a good deal on a used Analog once you get used to how it works its pretty fast to use them. Good luck :nod: If you want you can show me some of the used ones that your intested in on the brands and might be able to help you.

That sounds like you might have either a short or else your gauge "voltage regulator" (small rectangle unit) located on the back side of dash cluster is sticking and needs to be replaced.
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #9 by sixty6 » Tue Oct 06, 2015 5:49 pm

Thank you for taking your time and guide me. When ignition is off gauges going back to zero, when it's on they go to max. Should I disconnect the battery while I'm figuring this out or ignition off is enough? I'm still using cheap HF voltmeter, this might be a good time to upgrade.
Any of these good choices? Both have dwell feature also.
http://www.vellemanusa.com/products/view/?id=522311
https://actron.com/content/auto-trouble-shooter
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #10 by JackFish » Tue Oct 06, 2015 6:23 pm

sixty6 wrote:Plugs 2 and 3 are black, others are normal. I changed all plugs. Checked resistance on spark plug wires and they all consistent with each other, numbers were increasing by 1 as they got longer, just don't remember the Ohm settings. Timing set at 6. I'm still figuring out where to buy dwell/tach meter. Local stores don't have them and there plenty of used ones on ebay, just not sure which one to get. Seems like plenty of cheap ones that are old style, and some newer ones that are electronic. Any advice?

EDIT:
Also this afternoon something happened to my electrical system 3 gauges (fuel, oil pressure and temperature) went to the max, but i was able to drive home without problems.

Timing is at 6° BTDC? You can bump that up.
I'm sure most of us are running 10 or more.
I think I'm at 12 or 14.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #11 by bubba22349 » Tue Oct 06, 2015 7:30 pm

Yes they both of those meters look like they will support a 6 cylinder so they would do the job. It's usually best to disconnect the battery when you are testing unless you need to do a power on test. I am fairly certain that the gauge "voltage regulaor" is the likely cause since all three gauges max out with the key on. To test that theory find the V.R. That is located on the back of the dash then tag the two wire positions and remove them. Next use your meter to test for continuity i.e. This would show the points inside the VR are stuck together, if their not stuck then the meter will read that it's an open and you will need to test the wires going to the sender units for shorts to ground. If your testing proves that the V.R. Is the cause then in the below link it shows what the V.R. looks like on a 1965 to 66 Ford Mustang other Fords also use these too. Most good Auto parts stores will also still carry them like NAPA etc. Good luck :nod:

http://www.laurelmountainmustang.com/pr ... aQodRFcMBA
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #12 by sixty6 » Tue Oct 06, 2015 9:44 pm

I have a hard time locating VR. I saw video of 1965 and it shows that it's mounted on the back of instrument cluster. What about 1966? From this diagram ot looks like it's on the back of cluster also. I tried to remove cluster but that 5T speed cable is short and no room to get to it. Should i try to remove it from transmission so it gives me more room to get instrument cluster out?

http://averagejoerestoration.com/resources/mustang-wiring-and-vacuum-diagrams/1966-wiring-diagrams/66instr.jpg
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #13 by bubba22349 » Wed Oct 07, 2015 1:37 am

Yes it's also mounted to back of instrument cluster, on that 66 illustration it's the one called the "Constant Voltage Unit". On the Speed O Cable usually you can reach you hand into the back side the speedometer and take it off. If you not able too yes you can remove cable from the trans so there is enough slack to pull the cluster out and unhook the cable. I have also removed and replaced the VR units using a short stubby screw driver without the need to pull out the cluster it's not easy but you can put the seat back all the way so you can get under the dash to see it with a flash light. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #14 by sixty6 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 12:41 am

Was able to remove speed o cable without problems, thanks for instructions. Had to lay down on the floor and stick my hand in a right place. It turned out that points in VR stuck together. I bought same VR (#39532) as you provided in the link from local store and my gauges work properly again.
I was able to get old Sears dwell/tach meter locally and it shows RPM 700 and dwell 46. I'll have to go tomorrow and pick up some feeler gauges and check gap.


Image
Last edited by sixty6 on Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #15 by bubba22349 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 3:32 am

Congrats on getting the gauges fixed. By your readings it sounds like the point gap has closed up some so open gap a little until you show 37 degrees at idle RPM. This should make a very noticeable difference it how it runs and some fine tuning on the carb will bring it all back into spec!

The fastest way to do a basic tune up is in this order

1. Gap and install plugs
2. Set point dwel
3. Set base timing (with Vacuum line disconnected and plugged)
4. Set the carb mixture screw to lean best idle
5. Set the curb idle RPM

Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #16 by bmbm40 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 2:24 pm

I was noticing that I have not missed having points in my ignition system. Have you considered a Pertronix device?
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #17 by sixty6 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 6:00 pm

Just checked gap and its .010, I could wedge .012 half way with little difficulty. Here's link to photo inside Image
Last edited by sixty6 on Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #18 by bubba22349 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 6:04 pm

:hmmm: no wonder it's not running right. Readjust it to .025 and see what it reads you might pickup some distributor cam lube if you don't already have some. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #19 by sixty6 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 7:29 pm

bmbm40 wrote:I was noticing that I have not missed having points in my ignition system. Have you considered a Pertronix device?

I was thinking about Pertronix too but the more time I spend figuring points out the more I like it.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #20 by sixty6 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 8:36 pm

I don't have any lube for distributor, will Echlin ML-1 work?Can get that at NAPA. Also I don't have any recent experience adjusting carburetor. Any speciality tools and instructions available? Was searching for Holley 1940 adjustment instructions and found this one, is that what I should follow?
http://forums.holley.com/entry.php?429-How-To-Adjust-The-Idle-Mixture-On-Holley-Carbs
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #21 by bubba22349 » Fri Oct 09, 2015 1:07 am

:thumbup: Yes the Echlin ML-1 will work excellent it's what I have used for many years. :hmmm: Yes you can use that method to adjust the mixture on your carb if you have a Vacuum gauge to use. There is also another way you can set it that is like the factory setting its called the Lean best Idle, the instructions are below, but either way will workout fine. With either method you need to lower your idle to spec first and the engine should be at its normal operating temp. I.E. Warmed up good.

Using a Tach & Dwel meter to set the Carb mixture screw to the Lean Best Idle RPM
1. The engine is warmed up good.
2. To do this first set it to the highest Idle RPM reading, then turn mixture screw in by 1/4 turn to Lean it out this will give you the Lean Best Idle.
3. Now set your Curb Idle RPM to spec.
4. If the carb has been fooled with before or you are just unsure you should probably repeat the above steps at least a second time. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #22 by sixty6 » Fri Oct 09, 2015 6:31 pm

I don't have vacuum gauge and if it's possible to do without one I would prefer that. Do I need to disconnect or plug vacuum for this procedure? Remove air filter? Also I want to make sure I'm adjusting right screws in this carburetor. I found old manual with some visual explanations, are those are right screws?

Image
Last edited by sixty6 on Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #23 by bubba22349 » Fri Oct 09, 2015 7:59 pm

Yes you can defiantly adjust the carb without a vacuum gauge. You will always want the engine accessory parts installed just as it would be when your actually driving the car. So yes have the air cleaner on with its filter (make sure it is air filter element is clean or is a new one) and all vacuum lines are in good condition and installed correctly including PCV line and power brake unit if it has one, you don't want to have any vacuum leaks anywhere. Engine should be warmed up good and choke is fully open. Those instruction are correct however the carb illustration may not be so check the link below if there are differences. The screw to adjust the curb idle RPM will always be located on the throdle linkage so that it can open the throdle blade. The mixture screw is on the carb base below the throdle blade it is usually at a slight angel off of the centerline of the carb base. Good luck :nod:

See this link for Holley 1940 pictures the last one shows a good shot of both the mixture screw and idle RPM screw. They are both on the same side of the carb. http://www.carburetor-parts.com/Ford-Ho ... _2859.html

Edited
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #24 by sixty6 » Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:06 pm

Here's what happened when I tried to adjust things.
1. When i got points set at 0.025 I got Dwell of 20. With points at .018-.020 Dwell is 40. Is something wrong with my meter?
2. When turning mixing screw for about several full turns idle stays about the same. My understanding that turning it clockwise 1/4 turn past that high idle is where I leave it, right?
3. When I checked timing it was at 9 for some reason. I also tried to accelerate slightly and it went higher past 10 and came back to 9 at idle, is that normal?
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #25 by bubba22349 » Sun Oct 11, 2015 2:27 pm

1. Setting the points by a feeler gauge will only get the engine running and in the Ball Park. Your trying out the different settings is good so it looks like you might need to try in the range of .021 to .023 gap opening to get it to a 37 degree dwel. I actually don't bother with feeler gauges much after a beginning setting and just adjust the points until I get the reading I am looking for. Your experiments with different gaps also shows how as the points wear with use, and the gap closes up the dwel increases until at a certain point the engine just quits running. Nothing Is wrong with your meter and it's the most accurate way of correctly setting points, as you continue in fine tuning your settings the engine will reach the sweat spot when everything is right.

2. No if you have turned the mixture screw more than a couple turns out (2 1/2) then you have likely went way to far and its going to be too rich at idle. You need to use a very light touch and very slowly turn the screw when adjusting the mixture. First you will need to turn the mixture screw in (clockwise) until you see the RPM start to drop a little then turn it out (counterclockwise) just enough until you see the RPM stop climbing, when it's just at its this highest RPM setting then stop, and turn it back in (clockwise) exactly a 1/4 turn.

3. Yes this is normal operation the timing is going to change as the RPM goes up due to the distributors centrivical advance system and it will also change with higher vacuum signals too with the distributors Vacuum advance system being hooked up to the ported vacuum, that is if both systems working correctly and it sounds like they probably are. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #26 by bubba22349 » Tue Oct 13, 2015 11:19 pm

:hmmm: so how you doing on your tuning?
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #27 by sixty6 » Tue Oct 13, 2015 11:24 pm

Didn't have a chance to drive it and check mixture and dwell yet. Still waiting for air filter in the mail, might as well do adjusting when everything is correct. Rechecked spark plug gap to make sure they are set at 0.034 (from box they were 0.042 or larger). I checked resistance on cables and at 20k setting on a voltmeter values were ranging from 5 to 11 for the longest wire. Is that within the range for these wires? They are NAPA Milage Plus. Is there is a way to check coil? I'm also thinking to change old fuel filter with clear one (Wix 33002) so I can see if any crud going from tank. Any any advice on that? Thank you for your help and guidance, your advice has been of enormous help :thumbup:
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #28 by bubba22349 » Tue Oct 13, 2015 11:48 pm

Yes those are good resistance readings on the plug wires. Sure if you want to change the fuel filter a clear one makes it a little easier to help check for anything that might plug it up. I my OPINION :thumbup: Wix, NAPA brand (they are also made by Wix) and Motorcraft filters are about the very best there is! Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #29 by sixty6 » Wed Oct 14, 2015 4:27 pm

While waiting for filters I had little time to adjust things. Dwell now about 38.5 (will try to get it to 37), rpm 600. When checking volts on coil it shows around 5.4v. I'm attaching video below while engine is at idle and all warmed up (running for 15 min), timing is at 9. Since I had it it always wanted to die when engine is cold. When it is warm it's fine just shakes at idle. https://youtu.be/_gBhyHTby-Q
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #30 by bubba22349 » Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:24 pm

:thumbup: Looks like your getting close. :hmmm: Dying when it's cold, have you checked the carb choke setting and linkage yet? This needs to be done when it's cold. The shaking at idle could be several things have you did a compression test on it yet? The coil might be bit weak the voltage should be a little higher (6 to 8 volts) try cleaning all the wire termanel ends at each of the connections and also all engine and body grounds from the battery back. A small stainless wire brush works great for this kind of like a toothbrush size. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #31 by sixty6 » Wed Oct 14, 2015 7:21 pm

Haven't checked carb choke or linkage yet, will have to google that one :) . That shaking also present when engine is all warmed up as in video posted above, unless it's normal. Maybe it's not so much engine but fuel lines that go to carb, they always shake at idle. Compression was done, was around 170-175 on all cylinders.

I noticed that my ignition condenser is BWD G111 (Capacitance (Uf): 0.21 - 0.25 Uf) and when i do cross refence it shows that it is not correct for my application with correct one showing BWD G125 (Capacitance (Uf): 0.18 - 0.23 Uf). Not sure if that's a problem or not.

I checked resistance on coil and on primary scale (ohms set at 200) is 1.4-1.8 (This is real numbers after subtracting for wires). On secondary scale (ohms set at 200k) is 8.2k. Will have to get that metal brush to clean ground connections.
Here is photos of my coil, looks old, maybe original?

Image
Image
Edit:

Here is photo of carb, looks like that plastic seal is not tight...

Image
Last edited by sixty6 on Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #32 by bubba22349 » Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:36 pm

Here is a link to a video showing all the Choke linkage on a Holley 1940 for a 170 and 200 in a 1964 1/2 to 1969 Mustang application. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tjBe45ujbuI.

This is an instruction sheet showing all the critical settings used when rebuilding a Holley 1940 including the choke linkage settings. You might also need to check your float level height sometime. http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/a ... 201940.pdf

Yes that's an original Ford coil, it looks like it could sure use a good wire brushing on those two terminal connections. On the test readings it needs to be done without the ignition power and distributor wires hooked up. The test of the primary is done on the low scale and first you need to check your meter by touching the leads together if yours is a dial type you then zero the meter (by the dial screw) or if digital remember to subtract that amount from the primary reading. If that's how you did the test then the primary and the secondary are both good.

Since your car has the replacement Holley 1940 carb installed (Originally it would have been an Autolite 1101) There is no problem with the plastic bushing being a little loose fitting it's really just used as an adapter for the air cleaner base because of the carb change. See if you can find or make a carb top gasket (paper type) that its suppose to have one, it fits under the plastic adapter to help seal it to the carb top and keep the dirt from being pulled into the engine.

That's really good compression so no problems there. Then that leaves the shaking to be caused by ignition or carburetor. The use of the wrong condenser may or may not be a problem, to find out you would need to know about how long it had been installed. Or Check the condition of the point contacts for signs of metal transfer from one contact to the other side if there is some transfer then the condesor should be replaced along with the install of a new set of points.

I think you need to recheck those plug wires once again this time take them off of the cap, they should all read really close too the same resistance from the longest to shortest. Then test the cap terminals they should all read the same, also test the coil wire too. The NAPA Milage Plus wire set has a 5 year or 50,000 mile warrantee you could try and see if they will replace them for you if they test bad. Good luck :nod:

Edited
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #33 by CZLN6 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 1:43 pm

Howdy Back All:

FYI- "(Originally it would have been an Autolite 1101)". A '66 200, with or without Calif Em would be an Autolite 1100. With CalifEm- at 150 cfm and ported vacuum (no SCV). No CalifEm- 185 cfm and a scv.

Other than that, Bubba's got you well lined out on the electronic details. Keep up the good work.

From the photo down the carb throat, I'd suggest a good down the throat cleaning with a spray carb cleaner. That's not a bad idea prior to going to work on the choke mechanism and adjusting. A good spray down, inside and out will make it run better as well as cleaner to work on. Keep it coming.

Adios, David
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #34 by bubba22349 » Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:06 pm

Did you do any more parts testing yet?
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #35 by sixty6 » Sat Oct 17, 2015 11:37 pm

I checked around the carb and found out that vacuum connection coming from distributor was loose. Didn't have a chance to clean electrical contacts yet so will need to do that before I put everything together. As far as carb cleaning, should it be done while engine running?
I did the tests on coil and spark plug wires while it was off, so the above values are the correct ones.
I have no original receipt for those Napa wires but quick online search showed that they are not that great to begin with. At local NAPA parts store I checked resistance on the new ones and it's from 3 to 6.8 ohms. My short cable is at 5k ohms and it's less than 1 foot long, probably exceeding what max should be, but local NAPA didn't know what values are acceptable. They could order premium set for $26 which is only $3 more than economy version that I have, so if I would go with new set I would definitely go with premium one. For about the same amount I can get Motorcraft online. What wires are you normally running?
It's kinda cool that this car has old ignition coil on it. I'm thinking to get a spare one to keep in a trunk if this one gives out. Was looking in the ones that is made in the USA and found couple. One is NAPA IC10 and for little less money BWD E70. Any opinions on those or other suggestions?
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #36 by bubba22349 » Sun Oct 18, 2015 1:15 am

The carb throat or interior its usually better to clean it when it's running, the exterior it doesn't matter. Your wire set is suppose to be like OEM type quality most any wire set now days is somewhat better then the originals were. On the NAPA wire sets if I can my preference is to use the very best Belden sets (Lifetime warrantee), along with the best distributor cap (these will have brass contacts) and rotor, Echlend points and Condesor, Autolite or Motorcraft plugs (Copper Core). The stock coils were very good and they last. Both of those coils are decent ones I have used many of the Napa IC10's over the years, there are some other coils made like the Pertronix Flamethrowers that give a bit hotter spark too. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #37 by CZLN6 » Sun Oct 18, 2015 2:18 am

Howdy:

On the plug wires I'd recommend a custom set that advertises Spiro-core.

On the carb cleaning, I'd spray it down good, let it set, then start it up and spray again. Use the straw on the aerosol spray can and spray into any opening or orifice you can see. Don't be surprised that it runs a little rough on start up. Also add a can of Techron or like fuel system cleaner to your gas tank to clean up the innards also.

Keep it coming.

Adios, David
Last edited by CZLN6 on Sun Oct 18, 2015 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #38 by sixty6 » Sun Oct 18, 2015 2:31 am

Thank you for all the advice! Since I just put a new set of spark plugs should I install old ones back while cleaning carb or just keep new ones in?
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #39 by bubba22349 » Sun Oct 18, 2015 2:37 am

If you want you can put in your old plugs, but it won't hurt the new plugs! :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #40 by sixty6 » Tue Oct 20, 2015 12:42 pm

Here's update.
Was able to set dwell at 37. Timing now around 9.5. Cleaned up battery connections and ground to the engine block, coil terminals but voltage to distributor from coil is still low at 5.1v. My carb cleaner nozzle was broken so I didn't clean carburetor yet. Still running little rough at idle. Will update once carb is cleaned. Not sure if I should put anything in a gas tank, it doesn't look original, not sure how old is it and if this will cause any problems.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #41 by bubba22349 » Sat Oct 24, 2015 2:28 am

What kind of voltage do you have right at the two battery posts with the battery cables off? A fully charged battery should read 13.4 to 13.8 volts! Next check battery voltage at cable terminal end on the solenoid. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #42 by CZLN6 » Sat Oct 24, 2015 12:48 pm

HOwdy:

"Not sure if I should put anything in a gas tank, it doesn't look original, not sure how old is it and if this will cause any problems."

A fuel system cleaner is not likely to cause any major problems. It has a minor effect in the gas tank. It will have a mild cleaning effect on fuel lines, through the fuel pump and into the carb. It works best where it can be most concentrated- that's not the tank. Worst case scenario might be a need to change out any inline fuel filters. If you are afraid of rust scaling inside the tank breaking loose and plugging the tank outlet, that's another problem. Rust inside the tank breaking loose will most likely be caused by driving on rough roads and fuel sloshing.

A fuel system cleaner works slowly over the time it takes to run the gas with cleaner through and then adding fresh gas. The engine is likely to run rough for a while, depending on how much varnish and crud is removed from inside the lines. It is something that should be done periodically. I added a can to my gas every spring because winter driving, choke and slow warm up seem to add to crud build-up. Oh, and time also. If a car has been sitting/not run for long periods, that would warrant an internal cleaner.

That's my two cents, for what it's worth.

Adios, David
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #43 by sixty6 » Sat Oct 24, 2015 11:14 pm

bubba22349 wrote:What kind of voltage do you have right at the two battery posts with the battery cables off? A fully charged battery should read 13.4 to 13.8 volts! Next check battery voltage at cable terminal end on the solenoid. Good luck :nod:


After disconnecting battery I got 12.7v. On solenoid I get the same with engine off.
I was able to clean carburetor from inside and outside. Outside was dirty, took almost a can to clean everything. Engine was running different afterwards, so I had to readjust mixture/idle. Will have to drive more to see how engine feels and check idle after cold start. I'll try to get some Techron and add to gas tank and see how that works.

On the side note, I changed oil/filter (fl-1A) and after pouring in 4.3 qrts I get about 1/4 inch above max fill line. Is that a problem? I left it to drain for several hours so it should of drain everything possible.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #44 by bubba22349 » Sun Oct 25, 2015 4:18 am

That's a bit low on battery voltage if you have a battery charger trickle type or battery tender try to see if the voltage will come back up to spec. It's not good to over fill the oil level, since the amount of oil you put in is about right by chance is the oil pan sump dented in? Did you run the engine after you changed oil? You should check it in morning before starting and see if it's still over full. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #45 by sixty6 » Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:14 pm

Image
Image
I removed about 16 oz which leaves about 3.7qt inside with dipstick level right at the max. No dents in oil pan either and I checked level after engine was running and then next day to make sure oil is in the pan. From the bottom of the bell to max level is abot 10 1/4 inches on the dipstick. Anyone can check theirs? Thank you for all your help.


Edit.
Battery was charged but afterwards shows 13.0V. It's a group 35, almost 8 years old, probably on its last leg. Is that the right battery? Tray looks about 1 inch longer. It looks like it was wedged in without any bolt on attachment. Where bracket supposed to go it was rusted out, will have to tie it down for safety some other way for now.
Last edited by sixty6 on Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #46 by sixty6 » Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:18 pm

Thank you so much for all guidance and instructions. :thumbup: I have printed posts from this thread and keep it with me till the next tune up or whenever adjustments needed. It runs great and whenever engine cold it doesn't die on me.
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #47 by bubba22349 » Fri Oct 30, 2015 3:32 pm

Stock your car would have had a Group 24F you might not be able to find one very easy but a regular Group 24 will also fit if you use the right length Posative battery cable to the Solenoid. Make sure you have the battery secured good, have seen a few cars catch on fire from an unsecured battery that shorted out. A reproduction battery tray and hold down is not much work to replace. :beer: Glad you got it running better, good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #48 by sixty6 » Sun Nov 01, 2015 1:48 am

Thanks on your advice on battery. Should I go with a tray for my year with short clamp or conversion tray that works with 1967 hold down?
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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #49 by bubba22349 » Sun Nov 01, 2015 12:00 pm

If you are going for an all stock look then I would use the 1966 parts. Otherwise for customized vintage Hot Rod the later model tray looks a little cleaner, and for even more of a Hi Performance use / Restromod often I will move the battery into the trunk for a bit less weight on the front end. Good luck :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: 200ci Mustang 66 ignition/carb question

Post #50 by sixty6 » Sun Nov 01, 2015 3:32 pm

Checked local store and they have Interstate 24F but it looks like for original tray clamp to work battery needs to have a lip at the base otherwise I don't see how it will hold unless I missing something. Batteries they got they are flash at the base.
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