Click Here -> Please Consider Making a PayPal Contribution to the FordSix Forum!
2019 Contributors:
NJwpod, 1strodeo, mightynorseman, maxtrux, 6d7coupe, broncr, Phase3, 68Flareside240, bmbm40,
mustang6, WorldChampGramp, justintendo, BigBlue94, ags290, motorsickle1130, Rooster, ousooner919, ethanperry
rzcrisis, DoctorC, jamyers, Motorboy, fastpat, Silverback280, chad


<<< New Site Update >>>

swapping a 235 up to a 292

Moderator: Mod Squad

User avatar
CoupeBoy
VIP Member
Posts: 3424
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 12:17 am
Location: Fargo, ND
Contact:

swapping a 235 up to a 292

Post #1 by CoupeBoy » Fri Nov 21, 2003 10:39 am

What types of unexpected surprises should I plan to encounter?
Motor Mounts different?
Bellhousing? (shouldnt be, its a GM, arent they all the same?)
starter location?
radiator connection locations?
flywheel (mounting locations, balance)


This is for an old grain truck ('51-54). It really wasnt a grain truck the door says something about "mosquito spray service" and it has a non-hydraulic flat bed on it. But the truck is sitting behind dad's barn and there are 2 292's sitting in a building next to it, and it sure would be nice if those kids could get together.

And would I need to convert it to 12v or did GM already have that in it?

thanks in advance
-ron
1968 Mustang Daily Driver Rebuild (on hold for the Season 3/1/2015)
1963.5 Falcon Convertible Build (just getting started 3/15/2015)
Case 1830 Skidsteer FordSix Repower Thread (started 4/4/2015)
1970 170/C4
1967 200/C4
1965 240/bellhousing/flywheel/clutch/3.03 bell pattern
1975 250/flexplate
1975 300/flywheel

User avatar
addo
VIP Member
Posts: 10611
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 3:06 am
Location: Sydney, Australia

Post #2 by addo » Fri Nov 21, 2003 4:59 pm

:shock: Mosquito sprayer? Hope it's not full of those old-fangled pesticides.

User avatar
CoupeBoy
VIP Member
Posts: 3424
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 12:17 am
Location: Fargo, ND
Contact:

Post #3 by CoupeBoy » Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:01 pm

oh, there's nothing new fangled about this particular truck, I still need to check to be positive if it has a hydraulic bed or not, maybe next weekend (over thanksgiving) I will try to snap some pictures.

-ron
1968 Mustang Daily Driver Rebuild (on hold for the Season 3/1/2015)
1963.5 Falcon Convertible Build (just getting started 3/15/2015)
Case 1830 Skidsteer FordSix Repower Thread (started 4/4/2015)
1970 170/C4
1967 200/C4
1965 240/bellhousing/flywheel/clutch/3.03 bell pattern
1975 250/flexplate
1975 300/flywheel

weeds
Registered User
Posts: 136
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 11:42 am
Location: St Marys, GA

Post #4 by weeds » Tue Nov 25, 2003 11:07 am

Other than 6 holes, the 235 and the 292 are nothing alike.

235 mounts at the front on either side of the Harmonic Balancer and has its own unique bellhousing, which has the rear motor mounts.

The 292 has side mounts and uses a standard SBC bellhousing (I think). Chevy had the SBC option in the trucks in the late 50's, so there is a SBC bell available for at least the late 50's chassis (I have one in the garage) and I think that the rear mounts are the same, so the SBC bell could serve as the rear mount. This would put the front & rear mounts close together, and leave the tranny hanging (literally) out the back. I have a heavy 4 speed hangin in my '57, and it has been there for 45 years w/o a problem.

I think that the 292 is on the long side for this chassis too. Take careful measurements.

http://www.stovebolt.com

User avatar
CoupeBoy
VIP Member
Posts: 3424
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 12:17 am
Location: Fargo, ND
Contact:

235 to 292 swap (on hold?)

Post #5 by CoupeBoy » Tue Nov 25, 2003 1:59 pm

So maybe I should check to see what the scoop is with the original motor before I go trying to re-invent the motor mounting situation. Honestly aside from opening the hood and seeing 6 spark plugs I have no idea what is wrong with the motor, or even that it is a 235 I think this weekend I will have to do some more investigation.

Are you sure the 292 is longer? I have the chev inline 6 performance handbook at home (stantucci) and it shows an image of a '64 motor (194) overlayed over a '63 motor (235) and it says 14% decrease (I think) in size. Now I know the 292 is taller then a 194 but it is the same length.

More measureing and toying, then I will get real info to put in here.

thanks
-ron
1968 Mustang Daily Driver Rebuild (on hold for the Season 3/1/2015)
1963.5 Falcon Convertible Build (just getting started 3/15/2015)
Case 1830 Skidsteer FordSix Repower Thread (started 4/4/2015)
1970 170/C4
1967 200/C4
1965 240/bellhousing/flywheel/clutch/3.03 bell pattern
1975 250/flexplate
1975 300/flywheel

weeds
Registered User
Posts: 136
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 11:42 am
Location: St Marys, GA

Post #6 by weeds » Tue Nov 25, 2003 3:38 pm

In my opinion, the 235 is a weak motor. 4 main bearing design, where the 292 is a 7 bearing design. The 235 is also not a filtered oil system. It can be converted to a full flow oiler, the instructions are over at http://www.inliners.org.

I searched over at stovebolt and inliners about engine lengths, but could not find it again. I remember reading that it was longer, so take it for what it is worth, go measure, and then let me know.

I have though of dropping a 230/250/292 into my truck, and probably will instead of rebuilding mine again, if it comes to that. Or build a new frame and put a corvette drive train under it.

User avatar
CoupeBoy
VIP Member
Posts: 3424
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 12:17 am
Location: Fargo, ND
Contact:

pictures

Post #7 by CoupeBoy » Mon Dec 01, 2003 12:36 pm

I got a chance to take some digpics this weekend
SlideShow
When you go through them (if you chose to) you will see a couple pics of my '66 malibu 230 with its orange valve and side covers, and some pics of the truck itself. I still dont know what year it is, maybe one of you chevy efficianados can help me identify it. But I remember now why I thought that replacing the engine was the way to go. The current engine is missing some parts like the valvetrain and radiator. Also in the slideshow is this image

Image
showing a 194/250 vs 235/261 (santucci's 194-292 chev I6 performance book) It looks like everything should be OK as far as engine dimensions, I should only need to fabricate some motor mounts.

But it did raise another question, the truck itself is rated for 11,000 GVW do you think that would be high enough to make it into a car hauler (let me guess I would have to weigh the truck and then make sure the auto weight plus truck weight is under 11k?) And can I assume that the 8 bolt wheels on it are "standard" 3/4 or 1ton pattern? I think the 18x7.00 tires might be a bit hard to find to replace.

thanks in advance (again)
-ron
1968 Mustang Daily Driver Rebuild (on hold for the Season 3/1/2015)
1963.5 Falcon Convertible Build (just getting started 3/15/2015)
Case 1830 Skidsteer FordSix Repower Thread (started 4/4/2015)
1970 170/C4
1967 200/C4
1965 240/bellhousing/flywheel/clutch/3.03 bell pattern
1975 250/flexplate
1975 300/flywheel

User avatar
CoupeBoy
VIP Member
Posts: 3424
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 12:17 am
Location: Fargo, ND
Contact:

Post #8 by CoupeBoy » Fri Dec 05, 2003 10:46 am

Does anybody know if the flywheel is interchangeable? Counter weight? center bolt pattern?

-ron
1968 Mustang Daily Driver Rebuild (on hold for the Season 3/1/2015)
1963.5 Falcon Convertible Build (just getting started 3/15/2015)
Case 1830 Skidsteer FordSix Repower Thread (started 4/4/2015)
1970 170/C4
1967 200/C4
1965 240/bellhousing/flywheel/clutch/3.03 bell pattern
1975 250/flexplate
1975 300/flywheel

Agent Double O Six.

Neat Stuff!

Post #9 by Agent Double O Six. » Fri Dec 05, 2003 7:05 pm

I like the fact that nearly all of the chrome(even the chrome on the turn singnals.....)survived in pretty good shape. I also like the 'Patina' on that truck.......imagine pulling into the local cruise with that thing!! As for that '66 Chevelle's 230,I'm pretty used to seeing 'That Orange' paint. I have my share of Chevy Orange sixes around my place 8) . Good Stuff 8) ! OO6.

no_its_a_secret

Post #10 by no_its_a_secret » Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:00 am

I have a 194 250 and 292. All three seem to be identicle in length. However the motor mounts on my 292 are stagered. On the 194 and 250 the passenger side motor mount boss is behind the Fuel pump, on the 292 the motor mount boss is ahead of the Fuel pump. The driverside boss is in the same location. My 292 also has the rear motor mounts attached behind the bellhousing. We always called them elephant ears. The 292 is taller and lower than the smallblock 6's with it's sheetmetal.

I just took a closer look and the 292 has a larger Harmonic balancer on the front. So this would make it slightly longer.

User avatar
CoupeBoy
VIP Member
Posts: 3424
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 12:17 am
Location: Fargo, ND
Contact:

Post #11 by CoupeBoy » Wed Jun 22, 2005 9:52 am

whoa, this is an old one.. Since I have been in school for the last two years and working part time and this vehicle is 100miles away I havent gotten to it yet.

I think the 'elephant' ears were common on some of the older vehicles. My '54 F100 has a single mount at the front of the engine and the bellhousing has a mount on each side of it.

The book from Santucci is really good at covering the 'new' inline 6 family 194/230/250/292 but does not say much about the six family from before it (236/261) It's a good read if you ahve time and want to learn about hopping up the cheb sixes.

I should really get back out to the farm and make some progress on this, thanks for bringing it back up.

-ron
1968 Mustang Daily Driver Rebuild (on hold for the Season 3/1/2015)
1963.5 Falcon Convertible Build (just getting started 3/15/2015)
Case 1830 Skidsteer FordSix Repower Thread (started 4/4/2015)
1970 170/C4
1967 200/C4
1965 240/bellhousing/flywheel/clutch/3.03 bell pattern
1975 250/flexplate
1975 300/flywheel

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests