Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #151 by 300FOREVER » Fri Sep 16, 2016 9:44 pm

Drivers side intake....

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #152 by guhfluh » Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:57 pm

chessterd5 wrote:All this engine needs is a head with big enough ports & bowls to feed the cfm that a 50 cid. cylinder needs to breath. It doesn't have to be crossflow.
With water cooling, the right carburation, & a big cam this engine will make 500 hp. on the street easy!
True. My first thought is a direct replacement head that actually flows and is efficient in the chamber would be the best place to start, then work towards a crossflow. Thing is, I feel the U flow and intake and exhaust sharing the same space is the biggest thing I don't like about the engine.

With a crossflow head, I could finally make a nice turbo header, customers EFI intake, etc. The hardest thing for me might be getting clearance for the distributor, or making an oil pump drive/cam sensor to do away with it.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #153 by guhfluh » Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:00 pm

CNC-Dude wrote:While we are just dreaming here, and if everyone wants a crossflow head, which side does everyone want the intake on? I may start 3D modeling it up.

I was hoping you would get something going with the Chevy 6 patterns you were going to change up.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #154 by Goldysgarage » Fri Dec 30, 2016 1:42 pm

Any updates on this topic? Once designed a foundry either in North America or offshore could complete this quite quickly.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #155 by Goldysgarage » Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:34 pm

Any progress here? I would love to assist if I could - yes I am new - but I might be able to assist.


:)
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #156 by Goldysgarage » Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:36 pm

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #157 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:34 am

I wonder how fast that Falcon ran with the old production head?
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #158 by Goldysgarage » Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:29 pm

THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER wrote:I wonder how fast that Falcon ran with the old production head?


That would be a good question - but we all know the 300 six head does not flow very well - casting a modern head to offer flow (and cross flow) would not be that expensive.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #159 by Haywood » Sat May 20, 2017 2:16 pm

"casting a modern head to offer flow (and cross flow) would not be that expensive."
That is my thought, as well. Why not go all the way and go overhead cam and avoid all the push rod issues. With the cost of mass production being what is offshore, lots of possibilities arise. Edelbrock is making aftermarket 348/409 Chevy heads, our market surely is nearly as big as that. https://www.google.com/#safe=off&q=edel ... +409+heads

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #160 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Sat May 20, 2017 3:27 pm

Haywood wrote:"casting a modern head to offer flow (and cross flow) would not be that expensive."
That is my thought, as well. Why not go all the way and go overhead cam and avoid all the push rod issues. With the cost of mass production being what is offshore, lots of possibilities arise. Edelbrock is making aftermarket 348/409 Chevy heads, our market surely is nearly as big as that. https://www.google.com/#safe=off&q=edel ... +409+heads

An overhead cam would add several inches to an already tall engine, presenting hood clearance and manifolding issues for many types of vehicles.

What would an overhead design offer? With a stroke of four inches this engine is not intended to be a high revving engine, where OHC engines have an advantage. Pushrods can easily take this engine to 7000 RPM, likely the useful range for most applications.

Eliminating the pushrods still leaves the cam drive design to be engineered. That is a much bigger task than sizing pushrods.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #161 by Haywood » Sat May 20, 2017 4:17 pm

I guess dreaming a little large. Still the thing I see in the overhead cam design is less about RPMs, and more about wasted real estate. The part of the head the push rods pass through could be a port. The cross flow design, with the intake on the left side, would be ripe for 4 valve configurations. Since the head seems to be the limiting factor on this engine, if you are doing a redesign, go for the gusto.
All that said, I'm not a customer anyhow. I'm fairly contented to just have a peppy ride, one that isn't insulted by being ask to pull a trailer. So warmed over stock works fine for me.

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #162 by CNC-Dude » Sat May 20, 2017 4:37 pm

Gary Isbell ran low 11 second quarter mile times in his Modified Production Maverick back in the mid-1970's with a 300 engine in it. Using modern porting and cylinder head techniques we have now in the 21st century, a stock production cylinder head still offers more than enough potential for what people are seeking to build, and a crossflow or even an aluminum head for that matter is going to have so much untapped potential because maybe only 2 or 3 people would build something that can go fast anyway in a doorslammer.

Also, don't fool yourself on how large the inline parts demand really is, Edelbrock and other companies only tool up and makes products for markets that have large demand for them. Even though those markets may not appear large to an inline guy, they are really huge when you look at the market on a worldwide scale, while the inline market is not except for the sport compact inlines which is much larger that the ones here. Even back in the 1960's and 70's when a really large number of inlines were built and raced, even though big companies did make certain products for them back then, many other basic products still had to be made or adapted from V8 type parts. So in a nutshell, if the demand was truly there, someone would make what it is that is being sought after. And the simple fact that those items are not being made tells the reason why.

That LS hybrid head has been around for a long time, but all we have ever seen is pics of it, and nothing about it actually ever running under its own power. The fact that no video of it running says a lot in itself, seeing its been around for many years now. Either it was a dud or not much to brag about even though it is pretty exotic looking. I have several brand new LS heads myself I could cut up and create a pattern to cast a good modern 300 race head from, but there so far hasn't been a waiting list for people wanting them or needing them. There are quite a few 8 and 9 second quarter mile Chevy inline doorslammers, lets see some Fords start pushing that envelope and maybe the demand for better things will start to interest those that can make that happen. Just thoughts.....
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #163 by Fordman75 » Sat May 20, 2017 6:48 pm

If I buy an aftermarket head I don't want anything dealing with a ls. I either want something designed from the ground up for the 300. Or if it has to be based off something then I want it based off a modified ( with correct valve order for 300 cam ) 351C aftermarket head .

But I wouldn't mind an aftermarket U-flow head either. Make the ports slightly wider and also taller and the flow will be there. Add more beef to the port and bowl walls so they can be ported more too.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #164 by Galaxie 300i6 » Sat May 20, 2017 9:39 pm

At the Summit Autorama this year in Atlanta. I was talking with one of the Edelbrock Guys about the Jeep 4.0-4.2 Head they have started making. Somewhere in the conversation it Came up that they were in process of R&D on more inline six heads. Ford was one of the brands mentioned. I came away form that conversation quite surprised.

I would take it with a grain of salt, but man o man if that comes to pass it will be cool.

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #165 by Dr Neal » Tue May 23, 2017 12:16 am

What we need is U flow cylinder head with enough port volume to support these cylinder volumes.

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #166 by Haywood » Tue May 23, 2017 10:06 am

Chrysler 413 Max Wedge heads, the scale of these really need to be seen in person, photos don't do them justice.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #167 by xctasy » Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:16 am

THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER wrote:...and with a couple of port face adapter plates then whambiddybingbang - you can bolt up existing aftermarket U-flow manifolds if you are trying to save money, although why you would restrict a beautiful X-flow design by using (now) restrictive U-flow manifolds is beyond me.

Does anybody have dyno numbers for the 4.5 NASCAR V6 engine?
500 - 600 hp would not surprise me.


The M-6010-F380 SVO block was often 272 cubic inches. With one 1050 4bbl and four square 98 jets with the early odd fire crank, there was enough hp for 9.47 seconds at 147 mph with 1.25 sec 60 feet and 2235 pounds at the line. Revs to 8800 rpm, with power at 7700 rpm.

As development continued, it did less time with less mph.

http://www.yellowbullet.com/forum/showt ... 715&page=2
81mullet wrote:Back in the day those little monsters were putting out 600 horses....badass for sure. Don't know where they all went. Probably some dirt track guys


http://imgur.com/pA1YI
http://imgur.com/1vWt4

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As noted, SVO downgraded from the earlier Canted valve Cleveland style heads made by Cosworth Engineering under part number Canted E8 ZM 6049 E380 to a totally new non canted valve Brodix cast head under part number E9 ZM 6049 J380 head in 1989

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Early Cosworth heads...E8 ZM 6049 E380. Ported NOS canted valve heads (298 in, 227 ex flow @ 600. 2.125/1.710 valves)

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After chamber work
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Before chamber work....as cast
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #168 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:35 pm

Jimmy and I worked at Ford Engineering and both ran our cars out of K & D Performance in Allen Park. His T-Bird (Ken Baksa was owner - Jimmy drove it) is the ex-Collier Steel IHRA Pro Stock car. Hard to believe that full size T-Bird weighs under 2300 lb. It was one of the first pro stockers to use a double-tube frame backbone, common on todays Pro Stockers. He is still working at Ford in the race group but races a different car now. Ken Baksa passed away several years ago. RIP Kenny
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #169 by arse_sidewards » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:09 pm

http://newatlas.com/desktop-metal-3d-printing/50654/

I'm crossing my fingers for this technology coming into our price point in the next decade. It'll happen....eventually.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #170 by xctasy » Thu Aug 03, 2017 6:42 am

arse_sidewards wrote:http://newatlas.com/desktop-metal-3d-printing/50654/

I'm crossing my fingers for this technology coming into our price point in the next decade. It'll happen....eventually.



Yes, but everything else comes down too, its all relative to the normal, time honoured Ford V8. For most people, Henry Ford invented the V8 engine.

CNC-Dude wrote:......
Also, don't fool yourself on how large the inline parts demand really is, Edelbrock and other companies only tool up and makes products for markets that have large demand for them. Even though those markets may not appear large to an inline guy, they are really huge when you look at the market on a worldwide scale, while the inline market is not except for the sport compact inlines which is much larger that the ones here. Even back in the 1960's and 70's when a really large number of inlines were built and raced, even though big companies did make certain products for them back then, many other basic products still had to be made or adapted from V8 type parts. So in a nutshell, if the demand was truly there, someone would make what it is that is being sought after. And the simple fact that those items are not being made tells the reason why.

.......Just thoughts.....


The truth is that the F-100/150/250 and Ecconoline 240/300/4.9 EFi market exists, but all Six cylinder guys want to go fast, but don't want to pay V8 prices to do so. In practice, due to the loss in capacity compared to the same weight 302/351 Windsor EFi or 4-bbl engine that can just as sooner become a World 363, Boss 392 or 408 or even 427 or a 454 cubic inch engine with an aftermarket block, a modified alloy head 4.9 is going to have to have a cutting edge OHV head like the E8 ZM "E"380 or E9 ZM "J"380. That is still cutting edge today, and the best you can do ecconomically without going into even more space inefficient OHC or DOHC multivlae heads.

There are short cuts, though.Chev, Boss 351 and other heads eliminate blind alley development.

I love this quote from http://www.enginelabs.com/engine-tech/h ... rns-heads/

Jeff Pitman · University of Windsor
I was on Bruce Sizemores crew when we won the US Natonals. We were a volunteer crew mostly from Canada. Bruce had not won the nationals before and it was a tough race. Bruce was the world champion the year before but do to reindexing we hadnt won a race going into Indy. We had trouble every round and met Sam Giaano from Detroit in a Monza that was more Pro Stock than Comp eliminator! Our cinderella struggle was overshadowed by the Prudhomme/McEwen fc final. Just a couple of Mod Prod geeks!! The hidden hero of the project was Bruces father in law a wizzard machinist with a shop in his backyard.The was tricky but the valvetrain actually moved 1" left with an intricate rocker that Bruces Father in law devised Bruce was an engineer at Ford He was responsile for the Perfomance heads(boss,clevland 429cj ) Ford did not do the head but we knew where to cut
Like · Reply · 2 · Jan 3, 2015 6:09pm



Knowing Where to cut!!!!!! :nod: :wow:


The baseline back in 2009 was 25 K U$, Mike W spent 20 K U$ on the Australian tooling and casting just to front 130 Aluminum Classic Inlines heads.

The technology won't drive the price down, it'll drive the quality up, and will work through the huge time spent on aluminum castings getting rid of porosity problems, the bane of any aluminum head pre production. One shrinkage or air pocket errror, and that's it, a whole new set of runner boxes, and an other production trial run. With 3D, kind of like Toyotas Lexus 3D imaging for door shut lines or GM's LS-1 1994-1995 gelitine 346 engine block pre-production design, you can do all that stuff without having to do too much pilot production. That won't reduce the cost, it'll force people to leverage the program to do more non invesment casting tests before Job 1 is sold to the public.

I've always felt that the F100/150 truck 4.9 is the only engine I'd ever do an investment cast aluminum head for, because they are like Model T's, everywhere!

In terms of roller caming, its the easiest I6 block to do, in terms of 300 cfm flow heads, the easiest to do. In terms of keeping the cam parts stock, and its ablity to take 6000 to 7000 rpm, well, it won't split its a$$ assunder like a production thinwall 5.0 or 5.8 does.

The EFI intake runners could be anything...the M-6010-F380 SVO block and its head used a truncated NASCAR Winton Cup Cleveland Windsor intake like this....

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When tilted 45 degrees back to the normal postion, you get this

Image


The cross flow machine above packges a funnel ram intake under the hood, really well!

The DOHC blocked I6 engines from Chevrolets GM 4200,

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and Ford Australias Falcon are punny little 4.045 or 4.08" bore center engines, lacking in capacity, block strength and with too much port veloicty from very small ports.

There is little evidence of increased BMEP with DOHC in line six cylinder engines, For dAustralia found that in 1992 when Tickford did the DOHC Jag head to Falcon 250 swap. For every horspower, you have to be turning more rpm for every cube. The gains in DOHC are specfic torque, where a good DOHC engine might make 1.65 lb-ft per cubic inch, where as a 2V per cylinder engine might only make 1.4 lb-ft per cubic inch. Peak power, a two valve per cylinder engine cna match a Cammer 4 valve, its not as clean burning, or as detonation resistant, but every NASCAR engine outdoes a F1 engine on the basis of hp per cube for every 1000 rpm. I don't care if some engineer starts talking BMEP, that sort of stuff doesn't make peak power gains at 7000 rpm. That's hy Ford turbo'd 4 liter sixes and Supercharged Coyote V8's, because they already have better otoeque on the road, but were missing peak hp compared to a really good 2 valve per cylinder EFI engine.

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No contest, a production 240/300/4.9 block is a Jeep 232/245/258 style bore spacing, only better built and with more parts around.


CNC-Dude's Sissel style Down Flow heads on a 202 cubic inch 4.08" bore spacing engine makes 370 hp at 7500 rpm with perfect ease.

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Adding some decent bore spacings would make it just like the old 9 second 292 Triple Carb Chevrolet Chevy II engines.

The Ford 4.5 liter ZME380 or ZMJ380 heads are around, even the LS or Chevy NASCAR R07, if you must afront Stirrets beautiful early 60's Big Six design. If it can rev to 7000 with 300 cfm of port flow, you have a 500 hp street pounder with just a 2 valve per cylinder head. And a 4.9 can, without block loss. Unlike a 302 or 351.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #171 by xctasy » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:33 pm

Plenty of those 4.5 SVO's in the wild.

This is a Coil over plug and the old 034Motorsport Port EFI and it lookes to me like the Brodix cast post 1989 "E9 ZM 6049 J380" alloy heads

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAWrQWOLzlY


Head hunting time, fellows.

TFTF said it first...4.47" bore spacing, 2004. We need to re-read his posts.


/viewtopic.php?p=114871&highlight=
THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER wrote:The 4.5 was a purpose-built stock car racing engine, loosely based on the 3.8 V6, with all the FORD NASCAR technology rolled into it. A drag racing buddy and co-worker got a hold of one and put it in his Thunderbird and ran 9.40 quartrer mile times. I know there out there and I know they will fly on a 300. Since the bore spacing is only .010" smaller you could center up cylinders #2 and #5 and the others would be offset only 0.010", with only one weld needed to accomplish the inline conversion.
Last edited by xctasy on Sat Oct 21, 2017 6:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #172 by 6 Shooter » Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:52 am

Any one ever hear of Joe Morgan and his 10.75 Poisonous Pinto? There is an article in the April 1999 Hot Rod magazine about his ride. It uses a turbo 2.3 with NOS. What Joe did after the write up on his ride is the best part. How many of you have heard of Esslinger Engineering? They manufacture a lot of Ford 2.3 speed parts. Joe approached EE about manufacturing an aluminum 2.3 head the same as the cast iron D-port open chamber head that was becoming scarce. EE seems to have the resources to tackle a project like the i6 head. Whether or not they would want to expand into the i6 frontier is another question. I would imagine it would have to make sense from a business point of view but they are already doing i4's. Maybe someone should approach them about doing a head or two? If someone already hasn't.

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #173 by arse_sidewards » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:53 am

Did anyone run a FEA or even some napkin math to see how much rigidity was lost going from the "ugly brick head" to a more production like casting?
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #174 by xctasy » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:55 pm

6 Shooter wrote:....EE seems to have the resources to tackle a project like the i6 head. Whether or not they would want to expand into the i6 frontier is another question. I would imagine it would have to make sense from a business point of view but they are already doing i4's. Maybe someone should approach them about doing a head or two? If someone already hasn't.


That's a great idea!

Esslinger Engineering moved from the 2 liter Ford European Corporate EAO 102mm bore spacing (4.0157", the SHO, Duratech and Yamaha bore spacing also used in the V12 DB7/9 Aston Martins and the interim 1988-2016 1.8/2.0/2.3 European DOHC 8 and 16 valve non Cosworth engine) to the Lima 2300 4.17" bore spacing, which is similar to the Volvo B series 4 and 6 cylinder engines.


I don't think the prodction tooling will be helpfull for a 4.48" bore engine, but you never know, and it doesn't hurt to ask.

arse_sidewards wrote:Did anyone run a FEA or even some napkin math to see how much rigidity was lost going from the "ugly brick head" to a more production like casting?


Heat treated alloy can be made stiffer in bending than cast iron, BUT its not in a straight aluminum head because aluminum allows the designers take every last dollip of metal out, making alloy castings with a lot more void space.

The example is the D series 245 Hemi in line six designed in the USA by Pete Hagenbuch at Highland Park Chrysler. The Aussies then thinwall cast the engine block to be very light for a 4.46"spacing bore block. They then wanted to ovebore it 150 thou to take 318 pistons, and make a 265 out of it. Pete Hagenbuch said it wasn't a good move. Hagenbuch's reason for not wanting to go to 318 and 360 bore sizes of 3.91 or 4.03, which are often used with the 265 blocks in competition, was that the block was too light, and the iron head holds the 245 block together. That has been proven when the alloy CHI Hemi head is added, it looses its ablity to resist bending in supercharged and turbo or very high rpm instillations. Although used in Australia’s fastest normally aspirated Hemi 6 drag car (10.4 sec @ 126 MPH), it won't tie together the engine as well as an iron head will.

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It's not a reason not to use alloy, because the head makes 275 cfm instead of the stock 205 cfm.

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The Australian 265 Hemi engines engines with this head survive okay with any kind of induction, but comparitivley, unless its tied together with something like, say, a Nissan Skyline Stroker style RB30 atermarket block deck plate or a 4.2 Truck V6 or Aussie 347 Windsor stroker pan to main bearing gusset....any engine is less ridgid with an alloy head.

That's why the old NASCAR 351 C 9.2 blocks were updated to the common 9.5" or 9.2" WCP 351 SVO casting in the late 80's... A3 Yates heads added more power, but less strength, so a tougher block was required.

Its not the same with the Ford 250 or Barra 4.0 DOHC, those 9.36 and 9.22 deck engines had a crap load of hard high silica iron in the blocks, the alloy heads weren't an issue, although they start to split blocks at 1600 hp.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #175 by arse_sidewards » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:21 pm

xctasy wrote:Heat treated alloy can be made stiffer in bending than cast iron, BUT its not in a straight aluminum head because aluminum allows the designers take every last dollip of metal out, making alloy castings with a lot more void space.

It's not a reason not to use alloy, because the head makes 275 cfm instead of the stock 205 cfm.

That's why the old NASCAR 351 C 9.2 blocks were updated to the common 9.5" or 9.2" WCP 351 SVO casting in the late 80's... A3 Yates heads added more power, but less strength, so a tougher block was required.

Its not the same with the Ford 250 or Barra 4.0 DOHC, those 9.36 and 9.22 deck engines had a crap load of hard high silica iron in the blocks, the alloy heads weren't an issue, although they start to split blocks at 1600 hp.


Right. We don't have block killing problems with the 300 because we can't move enough air to kill the block. Most people at present solve this problem by using a turbo to force feed air into the engine. The problem then is holding the head down. While I get that we may not need the rigidity provided by having extra material for the sake of the block wouldn't we need it for the sake of the head?
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #176 by xctasy » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:48 pm

No, alloy heads survive on long i6 and V12 engines on iron or alloy blocks. Even with four bolts per cylinder. They probably don't need any buttressing if the casting is non porus. The alloy head fretting issues are more open deck, wet liner engine related on foreign engines, like Lamborghinis, Ferraris and engineers start looking at better clamping measures when they have to cool endurance engines. US engineers just add more studs, the Europeans add deep liners, deap skirt blocks, or bring the block casting up in and around the liner. The US way is to use a cheeper iron block, and then clamp the daylights out of it.

An aluminum head, even with 300 cfm of air flow, and 4 atmospheres of boost, probably won't kill a long stroke 300 block even at 7000 rpm. The 300 crank isn't even fully counterweighed, has an open tappet conver, but is tall block takes a lot of the thrust loads off the block.

Most head clamping and stiffness improvements are made to the block. The 1988 Aussie OHC block conversion of the largley US designed 250 small six resulted in about 40 pounds of iron gusseting being put into the block to quell vibration; the crank got another 12 pounds of counterweighing and development work when it whent to 12 counterweights, then Ford removed two of them, and removed 12 pounds and got a stronger bottom end as a result. The block went from very closed water surface area to huge in 1988, and the focus was on under the cylinder head gasket to get stiffness. Even sleeved with a steel crank and extra good con rods, the block moves around a lot in a turbo engine
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #177 by Econoline64 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 10:59 am

Wonder if these LS V12 guys are willing to sell some heads.

http://v12ls.com/
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #178 by 88F15088 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 12:41 pm

Econoline64 wrote:Wonder if these LS V12 guys are willing to sell some heads.


This is a great point. Their head would pretty much bolt right up wouldn't it?

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #179 by Fordman75 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 1:40 pm

The problem is it's still a ls head. Find me a guy that builds V12 Clevelands or a V12 from 4.5L SVO engines and you'd have something! :D :thumbup:
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #180 by xctasy » Sun Oct 22, 2017 8:46 pm

88F15088 wrote:
Econoline64 wrote:Wonder if these LS V12 guys are willing to sell some heads.


This is a great point. Their head would pretty much bolt right up wouldn't it?


A welded together set of unported 241 heads

Home builder package from 21 grand, pre-assembed 35 grand, full engine 46 grand.

http://www.enginelabs.com/news/video-au ... -s-shores/

http://v12ls.com/wp-content/uploads/201 ... e-list.pdf

Straight bolt up....only after you cut it, and adjust the bore spacings back to 4.48", not 4.40".

Lots of additional work on an already expensive engines head...


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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #181 by 88F15088 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 10:10 pm

I sent them an email just to get an idea on pricing, or if they are even interested in selling only one cylinder head. I will report back with my findings.

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #182 by 88F15088 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 10:56 pm

What's the bore size? I have Googled a bit and found anything from 3.8" to 4"

It's 4", correct?

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #183 by xctasy » Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:08 am

LS2, LS3, LSX

4.00, 4.065, 4.125"

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And it still has to be cut, sliced and diced, then rewelded or expoxied back together.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #184 by arse_sidewards » Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:23 am

xctasy wrote:LS2, LS3, LSX

And it still has to be cut, sliced and diced, then rewelded or expoxied back together.


The bore spacing on the 300 is 4.480" and the LS is 4.400".

If you just plopped it on and split the difference the chambers would be off by

The chambers would be off by 0.040" (3 an 4), 0.120 (2 and 5) and 0.200" (1 and 6).

Why can't we build the chambers back up on one side and cut them on the other?

I know welding cast AL sucks but putting some 1/8" wide stringers on a high quality head casting is probably the easiest cast aluminum welding job ever. It would be a heck of a lot less work than any cutting and brazing job. Head bolts could be adjusted into position in a variety of ways.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #185 by Does10s » Mon Oct 23, 2017 10:44 am

I talked to those LS V12 guys last year at SEMA. Initially they were interested in making a head for my '64 Econoline dragtruck project, but after a few emails they dropped off the face of the earth!
As of last year, their heads were just welded up LS stockers.

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #186 by xctasy » Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:24 pm

Does10s wrote:I talked to those LS V12 guys last year at SEMA. Initially they were interested in making a head for my '64 Econoline dragtruck project, but after a few emails they dropped off the face of the earth!
As of last year, their heads were just welded up LS stockers.

Will


Yep, just like everyone elses.

Image

But just get three junked A3 Yates or iron Cleveland heads..they are everywhere, and better.

As the man says "its easy to over think this....."

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FAZER 6Bi (M112 & EEC5) or FAZER 6Ti (GT3582 & EEC5) 425 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #187 by Sick6Turbo » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:08 pm

Would it be possible to build a 2 piece billet aluminum head....upper and lower?

Machine the lower piece with chambers, lower half of intake and exhaust ports and coolant passages, and the upper piece with valve guides, upper half of intake and exhaust ports, coolant passages and rocker provisions. Could also laterally drill coolant passages above the valve bowls and plug the ends of the head.

Use dowel pins to align the halves and a copper gasket or copper wire o-ring (exhaust ports) in receiver grooves for sealing the two pieces. The head bolts would of course hold the two pieces together, maybe even more bolts in critical area's could be added.
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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #188 by Twinturbor » Wed May 02, 2018 8:46 am

For those who say the big six is a truck motor not a race motor, I have a turbo 300 that begs to differ. Bring your race cars and we shal see. I can’t wait to get one of these heads. My ported head is good but I’m ready for more power

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Re: Big Six aluminum head update 9-14

Post #189 by WorldChampGramp » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:36 pm

Twinturbor wrote:For those who say the big six is a truck motor not a race motor, I have a turbo 300 that begs to differ. Bring your race cars and we shal see. I can’t wait to get one of these heads. My ported head is good but I’m ready for more power


Help is on the way. check out progress in the following thread on the Big Six 300/240 forum viewtopic.php?f=2&t=77978 Gramps :idea:

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