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300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

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88F15088
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #251 by 88F15088 » Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:59 am

THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER wrote:You could knock that thermactor boss bump down a bit more, making it flush with the roof of the port. Don't worry about the divot.


Can you clarify a little more? The thermactor boss I am assuming is the small bump in the exhaust port. What divot are you referring to? The one right below the thermactor boss?

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THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #252 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Tue Jan 01, 2019 10:10 am

yes
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88F15088
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #253 by 88F15088 » Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:51 pm

I have dropped off the head and all associated parts at the shop my friend works at to perform all work listed in post #238. He will also be milling the deck surface smooth.

I asked him about hardened seats and he said I would be fine using the stock seats if they can be saved, since I nicked a few pretty bad while porting. He will be checking valve installed height so I know what springs to order, then I will bring the head back to him for flow testing. Does anyone have flow numbers for the stock carb cylinder head so I can compare when I eventually get my flow numbers?

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #254 by Wesman07 » Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:33 am

I saw them over on the ford-trucks site a few years ago. It was about 10 -15 cfm more, but I forget where in the lift range. I’ll try to dig them up.
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86 f150 300 efi with advanced stock cam. Np435, Dana 60/ 10.25, 35" BFG's, four link front suspension with 12" travel fox coil overs, custom deaver leaf pack in the rear.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #255 by 88F15088 » Mon Jan 07, 2019 4:44 pm

viewtopic.php?t=47616

Looks like he compares stock vs ported flow of a carb head.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #256 by Wesman07 » Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:08 pm

Yep, I think that was the same info I saw
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86 f150 300 efi with advanced stock cam. Np435, Dana 60/ 10.25, 35" BFG's, four link front suspension with 12" travel fox coil overs, custom deaver leaf pack in the rear.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #257 by 88F15088 » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:56 pm

I heard back from my machinist regarding cutting the seats for the SI Valves 1.94/1.60" oversize valves. He had no problem cutting the 1.60" exhaust valves, but says that the 1.94" intake valves will need the old seat reamed out and a larger one installed.

I wanted to get some input here before having him go through with it. Should I bother with a hardened seat or just have a regular ones installed?

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #258 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:46 pm

88F15088 wrote:I heard back from my machinist regarding cutting the seats for the SI Valves 1.94/1.60" oversize valves. He had no problem cutting the 1.60" exhaust valves, but says that the 1.94" intake valves will need the old seat reamed out and a larger one installed.

I wanted to get some input here before having him go through with it. Should I bother with a hardened seat or just have a regular ones installed?

I was not aware that the intake seats had seat inserts. I think the intake seats are ground into the parent metal. In any case it is necessary to either machine the seat area for a bigger seat or for a new seat insert.
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #259 by 88F15088 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:49 pm

I will relay that to my machinist. I too thought the seats were ground into the head.

Me and Paul (pmuller9) have been PM'ing back and forth about smoothing out casting flash and sand pockets on the block. I will be smoothing the casting flash on the crank, but we decided that since my block is already machined and has the cam bearings pressed in, creating metal debris is not a good idea. Is this a potential issue for cracks to form?

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #260 by pmuller9 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:00 pm

On the block it is more of an issue with metal or sand coming loose and getting in the oil.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #261 by 88F15088 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:53 pm

Sounds like I should be fine leaving the block alone.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #262 by 88F15088 » Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:35 pm

Heard back from machinist. He says the intake has a hardened seat and said the cost to install new seats will be in the $500-600 range, and says it is likely not worth it due to diminishing returns. He will let me know what size valve he can make work with the current seat. I assume it will be a 1.84" instead of the 1.94" I provided.

Later today I will be contacting Reher Morrison for a second opinion. I have seen several forum members using 1.94 or even 2.02 intake valves.

Reher Morrison will also be able to flow test the head.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #263 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:29 pm

1.94s will fit. 2.02s will fit but there is diminishing returns from going bigger.
I like 1.90.
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #264 by 88F15088 » Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:34 pm

My machinist says that a 1.84" is the largest he can make work without having to press in new seats. He will be sourcing the valves, so now I am just waiting to hear for the results.

Hopefully it won't be more than a few weeks.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #265 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:59 pm

It sounds like sometime in the past your head has had hardened seats installed on the intake side, which is not factory. I'm guessing he can grind out the existing seat to fit the 1.84s but can go no larger without compromising the existing seats. I would just go with the 1.84s.
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #266 by 88F15088 » Sat May 18, 2019 4:24 pm

Due to misunderstanding and miscommunication between me and my machinist, I was able to get him to cut the 1.94" intake valves. I do not believe there was a seat insert on the intake side. Regardless, the head is now sporting 1.94/1.60" valves and should be completed sometime next week. I will be taking it to Reher Morrison for flow testing as soon as I get it back.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #267 by 88F15088 » Fri May 31, 2019 5:40 pm

Got my cylinder head back today. I am trying to get in touch with someone at Reher Morrison to flow test the head next week.

CCs came out pretty good, my machinist says they are 78, 78, 79, 80, 82, and 80.

20190531_155717.jpg
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #268 by Mdixon300f100 » Fri May 31, 2019 8:01 pm

Ooooo pretty.....

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #269 by 88F15088 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:04 pm

I got my flow numbers back today. A little less than I expected, but a great improvement over stock nonetheless. Here's what looks to be pretty accurate stock flow numbers to use as comparison: viewtopic.php?t=47616

The machinist suggested back cutting the valves after I had the flow test done and claims that should add another 5-10 CFM. I went ahead and had that done but wasn't ready to throw money at a second flow test so I cannot validate those claims. I may have another test done in the future.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #270 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:31 pm

good info - thanks
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #271 by pmuller9 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:45 pm

Those flow numbers will work great for the RPM range you will be operating at.

Do you have valve springs and retainers?
Do you have roller rockers?

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #272 by 88F15088 » Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:23 am

THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER wrote:good info - thanks


Glad I can provide some useful info to some members here.

pmuller9 wrote:Those flow numbers will work great for the RPM range you will be operating at.

Do you have valve springs and retainers?
Do you have roller rockers?


Good to hear. Cylinder head is fully assembled with the Comp 942 springs and Comp 1826 roller rockers.

My only concern is I decided to have the pushrod holes bored out to 3/8" as recommended from my machinist to run larger pushrods. I'm hoping this is not going to be an issue down the line?

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #273 by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER » Thu Jun 20, 2019 8:49 am

88F15088 wrote:
My only concern is I decided to have the pushrod holes bored out to 3/8" as recommended from my machinist to run larger pushrods. I'm hoping this is not going to be an issue down the line?

I hope you mean he enlarged the SLOTS to 3/8 so you can run 3/8 pushrods. You need a SLOT to guide the pushrod movement and hold the pushrod centered. Merely a 3/8 hole will not do. Or you must use pushrod guide plates.

Somebody needs to make a broach to do this job easily - take .031" off each side of the slots. Otherwise its a milling machine job.
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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #274 by pmuller9 » Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:51 am

Please post pictures of the 3/8" holes or slots for the pushrods.

You will need one Comp 7903-1 checking pushrod to set up the valvetrain. Most checkers are 5/16"
You will also need (or borrow) a 12" caliper to measure the checker pushrod.
If not you could bring the checker to your machinist and have him measure the checker.

There are several possible problems but you won't know until you put the head on and start checking clearances, alignments and rocker tip travel.
The head will only need to have the bolts tightened snug with the head gasket until the valvetrain is figured out.

Have you ordered pistons?

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #275 by 88F15088 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 2:47 pm

The slots were just bored out to 3/8" holes. I can post photos later but the head is wrapped up and stored away right now.

Would I have any issue running 5/16" pushrods? If so, I can just get guides and not worry about the slot/hole scenario.

I have not yet ordered pistons. Right now I am putting most of my efforts toward rebuilding the ZF transmission and will begin work on the current engine for stock rebuild, turbo, and experimentation.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #276 by pmuller9 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 4:44 pm

A 3/8" pushrods needs a slotted 3/8" hole to allow it to travel back and forth as the rocker pivots.

You will need guide plates and 5/16" pushrods.
The guide plates will raise the rocker studs about .135" and the rockers may bottom out on the stud so the stud towers on the head might have to be lowered.
It will all need to be checked out to be sure.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #277 by 88F15088 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:25 pm

Should I try to get the holes machined into slots from the machinist or should I just use 5/16" pushrods with guides? Either way it sounds like I will have to make another trip to the machine shop. Do I need different lifters that would accommodate 3/8" pushrods?

And to think this could have been avoided by being more persistent for an answer from here. Oh well, live and learn.

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Re: 300 I6 EFI performance upgrades

Post #278 by pmuller9 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:51 pm

88F15088 wrote:Should I try to get the holes machined into slots from the machinist or should I just use 5/16" pushrods with guides? Either way it sounds like I will have to make another trip to the machine shop. Do I need different lifters that would accommodate 3/8" pushrods?


The pushrods move towards the center of the head as the rocker pivots so the slot needs to go in that direction but the problem is there is less than 1/4" of material before you run into water jacket in that same direction and the hole already moved in that direction when it got enlarged.
My recommendation is to use a thick wall 5/16 pushrod with guide plates.
One advantage of using guide plates is you can align the rocker tip so it is center from side to side on the valve stem tip.

The 3/8 pushrod works with the same lifter as long as it has the same diameter ball end.

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