250 EFi Questions

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So I did the transplant into the XA, got it running last night.
But now it wont start.

Ive put more gas in the tank, its being pumped around, its got spark.
But just wont catch.

Do you need a fully charged battery to get it running? (it went a little flat).
Tipping a little gas into the plenum didnt get it turning over either.
Fuel pump comes on when its winding over.

Havnt changed anything since last night.

All I can think of is the injectors, but they were working perfectly fine and theres no reason for them to play up now.
Powers going to the injectors too.

Wont even cough or fart. (it did a little when I first turned it over).
 
So know one knows?

Alright, fully charged battery, its got fuel, good pressure, good spark, injectors are gettin a signal to fire.
Good earths, no vaccum leaks, everythings hooked up.
Its exactly as I left it after it was running for about 20 minutes.

All I can think of is the injectors, but even if 4 were blocked it would still atleast fart.
So I'm thinking that maybe the computer wont let it fire when its been turned over....

Either way Im starting to consider just skipping to a 4 barrel carb and extractors.
But how do I hook up the borgie40 kickdown cable?

This is irritating the you-know-what outa me...
 
BW 40 kickdown cable is actually a throttle valve. It is critical to the sweet running of any Jag 2.8/3.4/4.2, Falcon, early Jeep or AMC, Valiant slant or Hemi.

You have to follow the instructions. All owners of BW35 and 40's hate following instructions. Becasue they just don't get the idea of what drugs Borg Warner were on when they designed the kickdown. For 95 bucks, I got a new cable, for 105 dollars I got a full hydraulic set up by a technician. He said the BW 35/40 is the most abused transimission around becasue its the least under stood. My old XE was a dog even when I set the cable up to the specifications. After a proper set-up, it was a real street stormer, with deap kickdown around town which made it a delight for my misses.

Any way.

First, start the engine up, and make sure the throttle cable is set correctly. Plastic nut must have enough thread on it. Kickdown binds on the throttle, throttle alters the kickdown.One impacts on the other, it's a silly see-saw which head bends plenty of possums.


At rest with the engine off, there must be a 1.5 mm gap between the plastic ferule and the inner cable sleave. When the throttle is pressed down fully (with the engine off, unless you like picking con rods out of your engine block), there must be 44.5 mm exposed between the sleave and fuerule.

A few messups happen when we swap bits over. Sometimes, the the lever arm of the throttle peddle differs from the donar vehicle. It must be the same.

If you don't have 45 mm of pull out when the throttle is held down with the engine off, then you need to adjust the throttle cable to ensure it does the 45 mm bit. Then you adjust the at-rest-with-the-engine-not-running distance to 1.5 mm.

Get either wrong by even a mm or 2, and you get either

:eek: roll out thumb, a slow speed jerking when coming to rest in drive...car jolts into 1 st.

:p Or you loose bulk performance by it being ultra early or ultra late to kickdown.

:devilish: Lastly, you loose reverse, and then it dies.

The other thing. :x Ford set the BW 40 to never kick down above 100 km/h. This is becasue they used long 2.77:1 gears in the diff, and the busted arse 3-speed at 2350 at 100 kmh becomes 3400 rpm which is about 400 rpm above peak torque. So all EFI autos are rather lazy loafers, with none of the ballistic tyre smoking launches or hard edged kickdown you'd get in a 3.8 Commodore. ;)
 
DYNOED250":274mdn5v said:
How is this running now?..... All sweet ?... they can be a pain in the ass some times hey

Runs like a wicked beast waiting to be unleashed!
Have yet to take it for a drive, just gotta hook up the throttle cable and exhaust, and fuel return line.

Welded in the shifter, xf hump yesterday, easy as hell, just gota adjust the linkage a little.


Soooo, how could a do a return line in an XA Station wagon?

xecute, how would you hot the borgie up then?
 
Get an EFI Fairmont wagon pick-up (or the whole fuel tank). Plenty out there.



BW 35's, 40's, 65's and 66's can be hotted up with

1) the BW 51 EA Falcon clutch packs,

2) a good Aussie Kayver 2000 to 2500 rpm torque converter.

3) There used to be a Torrington Roller kit as per the old AIT Turbos (1983 to 1987)

(They are like the High Performance aftermarket Trimatic kits for Mazda rotories and Holden 202/253/308 drag racing transmissions. They had lousy plastic bearings)

The main problem is that the main BW components are not very strong. The trans was built for lightweight with a heap of aluminium. The other BW transmissions were really heavy, and the BW 35/40/65/66's were very light. Initially, they were for little 1622 Morris Cambriges, later Escorts, Mk1 2000/Mk2 2500 Triumphs and XJ-6 2800 cc Jags, then got slugged behind 265 Valiants and 232/258 AMC's. There are kits around, but they are REALLY hard to find.

Especially the alloy stator shaft pieces.
 
Hmmm,and how much would that set me back?
Seems almost like it would be easier to just bolt a different trannie up to it.

And, the returnline, could I bung it through the sender unit?
Or the filler neck?

Heh, at the moment, I've got it duct taped to the side of the car going through the filler hole... :roll:
 
you might have less dramas in the end if you get a C4 and rig up the EFi M40 'kickdown' to it. That way you'll open up a whole new world of gearbox mods that'll be easy to get your hands on. I've fried way too many Model 40s for me to remember. I've given one C4 absolute hell, with it only starting to slur 2nd to 3rd under light throttle, when I got a yellow sticker on that car (XE EFi dual fuel).

As for the fuel tank issues, I'd second the idea that you locate an EFi wagon tank. From memory there aren't that many differences between carb and EFi tanks shape wise, and I'm pretty sure that XD-XF will fit XA-XC.. if it doesnt, then it shouldnt be too hard to make it fit :)
 
I have an EFI XF Fairmont fuel tank. It feeds the return line through the sender unit, and there is an external fuel pump. Track one down.

My Fairmont is at a friends place, and the Gregories 226 manual from a library should show you how the station wagon EFI unit works.


The fuel tank remained simliar to the Aussie XR wagon from 1966 right up the the 1998 AU Falcon.

The C4 is a much better gearbox, as good as any ever made. Track down a C9 from an Aussie assembled XC or XD Falcon. They are rare in Moo Zealand. Some local taxis got Ford NZ to import C4's for there XC's and XD's (Ford had considerable amount of warranty claims on BW autos), so if you look around, you may find one. The other option is getting a second hand C9 bellhousing and getting the common as mud XA, XB, XC or XD C10 trans from a 302, and shove the bellhousing on it. Then use the BW 40 flywheel and starter and 160 teeth flex plate. That should work.
 
for the fuel return line, I ended up doing a T joing just a bit before the pump, and having the return go there.

=<=pump=<=T(return)=<=

Works fine, no problems at all, but is it legal?

Got some Coby extractors and bolted them on, man does she fly, and sounds damned good doing it!

But, a little stumbling block for the wof check (besides the pink sticker I made fall off)


I've changed over the steering column to the XF one, wired up the indicators, had them working, but they got slower and slower with flashing then finaly stoppped.
Any help on that?
And, thought I had the highbeam wired right, but the lights only come on if the dash switch is fully on, and the highbeam stalk is clicked on, and then its highbeam, nothing else.
Help? (old ones were the floor controled dipper)
Im thinking maybe, blown fuse, and highbeam, wrong wires, or swap them round.
http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29666
 
Oh man she is quick on the open road, wish I had more gears though...
Indicators were down to the alternator.

Still cant the headlights wired to the column right so I might just have to stick with the dimming switch on the floor...
 
LukeNukem":132qcwqb said:
Oh man she is quick on the open road, wish I had more gears though......

Yep, for New Zealand and some parts of Australia, the 3 gears are just pathetic. I spent 7 years behind a 3.8 VP Commodore in my last job, and it had the THM 700 and the best ratios you could ever ask for. A savage First gear which would light up the hides, and a lopeing over drive. Everytime you pushed the go pedal at 100 clicks, it'd kick down on you, and release some great acceleration. With 190 000 km, it would still get 25 imperial mpg (19 when thrashed), a 17 second qaurter mile from a 1500 kilo wagon.

The 4.1 EFI is just as powerful but has more torque and in the XA, it only weighes 1420 kilos, not 1575 like my Fairmont wagon does.

Mate, get the thing legal so the pigs don't gore you, then enjoy it for a year or so, and then come and see me. I'm working on just the thing you need...a proper 5 spd man or 4-spd O/D transmission conversion kit.

Meantime, use the 2.77:1 axle out of a disc braked Fairmont wagon and make sure you use the GT 351 or later Fairmont dual exhast with you current headers. The whole EFI/BW 40/2.77 combo works really freekin well with out an extra 150 killer grams to weigh it down. There is a K&N filter that can be placed over the front right where it can get some air. Extractors and EFI engines are bad, bad news because Ford designed it to have a heat shield. Headers on Falcons never came about till the SVO Falcon in 1989, and even then, Ford never put them until they reworked the air intake for the 1993 EF Falcon XR6's. Ford found that headers on the EFI Falcons only gave a 3% power boost because heat soak from the exhast spoiled things.

Relocate the air sensor to anywhere else in the engine bay. The worst place for it is above the headers because that creates that heat soak.

Like Mike Vines Turbo XF. He sorted out the problem by using 90 degree HDPE or steel pipe and plumbers grips.

MikeVineXFEFITURBOPICTURE.jpg



My mate from down South has the best set up ever....this. He uses thinwall steel pipe, and had it mig welded up. He is very smart!

DSC001450.jpg


DSC001448.jpg



XFEFI.jpg



There is over 185 hp there with headers in a good EFI 4.1 XF engine.
 
was thinking bout the relocation, shit does the plastic box get hot!
I was also told its ok to stuff the computer in a sealed box and mount it in the bay, theres a perfect spot up front for it, legal in your opinion?

And the air box, tell me more about the last pics where its mounted by the firewall and how the box was eliminated.

185 horsies?
I've never owned a car with that much before, let alone, potential for..

And legalness, getting there, just have to do the seat, make sure it moves back and forward (benchy), handbrake, and rewire the floor mounted dimmer switch.
Just cant get the headlights to work with the column switch.
Im hoping she'l be in the testing station on monday
 
LukeNukem":1a1vl45f said:
was thinking bout the relocation, camel excrement does the plastic box get hot!


I was also told its ok to stuff the computer in a sealed box and mount it in the bay, theres a perfect spot up front for it, legal in your opinion?

No worries. You could shove it in the rear vison mirror or behind the number plate for all the Testing Station wallopers care. Serious buddy, they don't give a stuff.

LukeNukem":1a1vl45f said:
And the air box, tell me more about the last pics where its mounted by the firewall and how the box was eliminated.

The air cleaner box is removed and replaced with the K and N filter, a big round Cone Headed sucker you see. (This is a great idea from Richie, they guy who got me into six cylinder Frauds in the first place!). The box is gone, nada, kaput, anihilated, deap sixed, gone. Nice clean Moo Zealand cow turd smelling air can then get in, worth a lot of hp. The air vane / sensor and stay anywhere within 3 feet (um, wooops, ~ 1 meter ). The stock set up has a sidewinder snake profile, and is cow jobbies. Hey, Ford copied it from Bosch who also did the BMW 3, 5, 6 and 7 series set-ups. Like dis VVV

BMW635CSIIntakePlenumbArrangement.jpg


if you look at this VVVV

XEEFISCHEMATIC.jpg



or this VVVV

xeefi.jpg



You'll see that a nice smooth straighter pipe has gotta be better than the stock Noo Noo. VVV

th_vorlage1301.jpg


LukeNukem":1a1vl45f said:
185 horsies?
I've never owned a car with that much before, let alone, potential for..


What a majority of car tinkerer people have with cars is some kind of head in the clouds Fast 'n Furrious Brain Damage. In my humble opinion, they need to be taken out and whipped with a 6250 (Ford code for a Cam shaft) or told they are a 6750 (Ford code for a dipstick.)

185 hp is plenty of fun, even if it is 100 hp down on most of the hotter Jap sixes. Especially since the torque before you add headers and a better air intake is is going to be close to that of most Jap turbo sixes but it all happens from 2000 rpm onwards like a big old steam engine.


Oh well, looks like you'll be okay. Smokin' Rice! Wok Wacker...


Hmm Federation Against Ricers and Tossers.... :eek:
 
well that was a rather interesting read.
And why it never crossed my mind to unbolt the airfilter box, I dont know...
I know where the sensors gonna get jammed now though, right where the computer was gonna go, perfect spot, aim it down and have an extension pipe to the cone filter and she's gonna get a real nice breath of countryside air from below...

Oh yeah, side notes!
Fixed my headlight problem, loose wire on the relay box.
So, its all completely wired up.

All I have left:
Fix the drivers door hinge.
Mount the computer somewhere.
Fix the handbrake.
Fix the seat movement.

Then she's got a warrent and rego.

Oh, and I busted her titties to the tune of 1*0kmh.
And it didnt take very long to get there either, pulls like a mad monkey in a butchers bakery...
I think 0 to 60 mile was around 4-5 seconds, I think its 4...
Quick!
Acceleration slows a little in 3rd though, but still good for overtaking, actualy, bloomin brilliant!
Now if it just had a 4th gear, I could get her off the clock, and probably run out of road...
 
Heh he he he . I luv it! I must say, your one quick worker, legend.

Lara Croft is gonna be mega pi__ed when she goes to use Duke Nukems cloths dryer...
 
No point beating the bacon in the bush is there?

Tip: Supercheap has an adaptor for the air flow meter, labeled as a beamer part, made by Wildcat Griffiths Equipment, part number 36-PAB

And, the pics above, were taken with my cellphone, the Panasonic VS2, a blimmin wicked phone, and the pics surprised the hell out of me!

Re-rego process, what a hell of torture, but, on the bright side, she's gonna be nice and reliable and legal with nothing to do for a few years, which is what I want, and its worth it...

Ohand what you dont see in there, is the breakfast cerial container with the computer and half the wiring stuffed in it mounted right at the back :D
 
LukeNukem":3oqa7ycs said:
No point beating the bacon in the bush is there?

Tip: Supercheap has an adaptor for the air flow meter, labeled as a beamer part, made by Wildcat Griffiths Equipment, part number 36-PAB

Would that be an adaptor to go from the square inlet to a round filter??

That looks very nifty and is making me think twice about using the stock airbox in my ZD - especially since the ZD is two inches narrower between the spring towers than the XF - this puts the filter box an inch closer to the exhaust - although I am using stock manifold and heat shield..
 
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