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Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

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Thad
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Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #1 by Thad » Sun Feb 08, 2009 8:13 pm

There are those who just dream,
and there are those who do more than dream. ><> = +

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StrangeRanger
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Post #2 by StrangeRanger » Sun Feb 08, 2009 9:20 pm

Superior upgrade!
1996 F-150 (tow missile)
1993 Mustang 5.0 (hot rod and auto-x monster)
1982 Tiga Formula Ford (SCCA racecar)
2013 Hyundai Elantra Coupe (daily driver)

66 E100 Pickup
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Post #3 by 66 E100 Pickup » Tue Feb 24, 2009 12:45 am

it's one of the more decent upgrades.

The best one I've seen is the 4 piston mustang kelsey hayes setup, from the 65-7 V-8. It has more piston area, and more stopping, plus the entire setup (hub/rotor, and caliper) are more inboard thus putting less strain on the spindle. On these econos, unless you get really custom, the master cylinder is non-assisted and stopping is really enhanced with the greater piston area.

John

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Post #4 by Asa » Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:04 am

nice upgrade.... but is it that hard to put a parts list on the page?
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Post #5 by Stubby » Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:36 am

Most of that stuff is available at Speedway Motors.
Never squat with yer spurs on.

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Post #6 by Falcon Ranch » Mon Mar 02, 2009 11:24 am

Asa wrote:nice upgrade.... but is it that hard to put a parts list on the page?


I will agree...what would it hurt to add the parts list and the template for the caliper.

I very clean swap!

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Post #7 by 61EconoDave » Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:41 pm

Here's the part list for this setup:

Rotors - 1997 Dodge Intrepid FWD rotors, lug bolt holes reamed out to 5/8"

Calipers - 1976 Chevy Nova, Right and Left hand

Hoses - 1976 Chevy Nova, will have small notch that needs ground off to fit through the hose bracket on frame.

Lug Bolts - 5/8" diameter, 1/2" longer than stock

Sorry, but I don't have the means for scanning the template.

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #8 by Army of Six » Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:03 am

im a little confused with the wheel studs.... 5/8ths diameter? is that the knurl diameter and it is still a 1/2 dia thread?

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #9 by 61EconoDave » Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:32 am

Is this the same Vic from oldeconolines? The info posted was what Roger(?) sent me over a year ago. I believe it the lug holes in the disc brake that needs reamed out and regular studs installed, just 1/2" longer than stock. I gave up on the idea though, figured it would be best for me to go another route.
David in Huntsville AL
1961 Econoline Pickup

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #10 by Army of Six » Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:05 pm

I post over on the ford-econoline.com site. i have never heard of oldeconolines.com. anyways, yes, Roger sent me the diagram and info aswell. since i am on a budget and not afraid to use my high speed grinder i thought i would give his conversion a shot. So I guess i just need stock econoline studs just longer to compensate for the added thickness of the rotor. Im also guessing that the 5/8th knurl needs to be a bit longer and stick out past the hub a bit to help center the rotor since the rotor has to be drilled out to 5/8ths???

Vic

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #11 by Thad » Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:12 pm

Does anyone see a reason why this type conversion could not be used on pre-disc brake Mustangs and Falcons?
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and there are those who do more than dream. ><> = +

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #12 by 61EconoDave » Sun Feb 21, 2010 11:13 pm

Vic your more than welcome to join the oldeconoline site. Very active group that has been online for ten+ years now. I have my account set up so that I recieve the messages as emails and I get about 10 to 20 a day. The people at the site can help you on about any question you have. Just visit this link to sign up.

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldeconolines/
David in Huntsville AL
1961 Econoline Pickup

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #13 by 66 E100 Pickup » Thu Feb 25, 2010 3:08 am

with any conversion that uses the stock econo drum hubs, make SURE that you turn the hub face true that you are staking the rotor against. Ford did NOT true the hubs; rather, the drum got staked solid to the hub, and the drum was turned true.

The rotors will NOT run true unless the hub is turned. I have not seen any "kits" that require that the hubs be turned true. Vic in So Cal does the assembly of his rotors to a trued up hub, his (and the mustang conversion) correct the drum hub problem.

John/Fresno

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #14 by Army of Six » Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:57 pm

hey, which Vic in So Cal are you talking about. i thought i was the only Vic around here with an econoline lol

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #15 by 61EconoDave » Thu Feb 25, 2010 9:37 pm

There is another Vic (I thought you were him) also in CA. Great guy with lots of usefull info. He posts at oldeconolines almost daily. He also sells some great parts for our Econolines. You should join. http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldeconolines Vic sells modified steering columns, disk brakes, shifter cables, rebuilt 67 master cylinders, and other odd and end Econo parts. He might be a member here also, but he has yet to chime in on this topic and I don't know his member name.
David in Huntsville AL
1961 Econoline Pickup

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #16 by Army of Six » Thu Feb 25, 2010 11:27 pm

well, i never met a Vic i didnt like :)


Vic in Gardena

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #17 by 66 E100 Pickup » Sat Feb 27, 2010 3:10 am

he is a member of Ford Six, but hasn't posted in a while. He has a few posts on this econo board, other topics.

John/Fresno

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #18 by Crosley » Sat Feb 27, 2010 12:17 pm

although this thread begin life 1 year ago .... I believe the carnut.com guy charges $ for the parts lists and caliper bracket diagram for the conversion
Tony in AZ...

"130 mph is known as first gear at the Bonneville Salt Flats"

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #19 by Thad » Sat Feb 27, 2010 12:54 pm

Ok! Econoliners get together pitch in the pot, buy one parts list and template then share.
Share with non disc brake Falcon / Mustang owners.

Group hug everybody. :roll:
There are those who just dream,

and there are those who do more than dream. ><> = +

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #20 by Army of Six » Sat Feb 27, 2010 6:05 pm

Crosley wrote:although this thread begin life 1 year ago .... I believe the carnut.com guy charges $ for the parts lists and caliper bracket diagram for the conversion



No he doesnt "charge" for the information. I sent him my address and within days I had the parts list and caliper bracket diagram for free. He does state at the bottom that...

"My friend at Carnut says i should charge $50.00 for this information. If it helps you get your Econoline stopped in a straight line, then send me what you think it's worth"


once i get it installed and all goes well I do intend on sending some money for his knowledge and help as his bracket and list will have saved me tons of time and money.

Vic in Gardena

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #21 by 66 E100 Pickup » Sun Feb 28, 2010 2:14 am

Army of Six wrote:
Crosley wrote:although this thread begin life 1 year ago .... I believe the carnut.com guy charges $ for the parts lists and caliper bracket diagram for the conversion



No he doesnt "charge" for the information. I sent him my address and within days I had the parts list and caliper bracket diagram for free. He does state at the bottom that...

"My friend at Carnut says i should charge $50.00 for this information. If it helps you get your Econoline stopped in a straight line, then send me what you think it's worth"


once i get it installed and all goes well I do intend on sending some money for his knowledge and help as his bracket and list will have saved me tons of time and money.

Vic in Gardena


My econo buddy in Fresno happens to be a machine shop foreman, and is doing the Roger Mingle setup. He said the pattern he received was off by a bit...he has the brackets in his computer and a CNC machine on the other end. He doesn't charge regular prices for econo stuff....PM me if you are interested in a nice set of brackets that will fit correctly. I'll get you in touch with him.

I also strongly recommend turning your hubs to true them up.

John/Fresno

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Re:

Post #22 by blue72 » Thu Jul 01, 2010 9:39 am

66 E100 Pickup wrote:it's one of the more decent upgrades.

The best one I've seen is the 4 piston mustang kelsey hayes setup, from the 65-7 V-8. It has more piston area, and more stopping, plus the entire setup (hub/rotor, and caliper) are more inboard thus putting less strain on the spindle. On these econos, unless you get really custom, the master cylinder is non-assisted and stopping is really enhanced with the greater piston area.

John


Have you looked at D&D disc conversion and also the new master cylider bracket for a dual cylinder > www.dddiscbrakes.com

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #23 by 66 E100 Pickup » Fri Jul 09, 2010 11:18 am

yes, I have the dual MC that he sells. He has two MC's available, one with a 15/16" bore for disc/drum, and a 1" bore without residual valves. Looks to be a very excellent product. I haven't installed mine yet. There are good photos posted of the install and various issues that might crop up.

John/Fresno

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #24 by Crosley » Sat Oct 02, 2010 7:06 pm

I found a wheel stud in the Dorman brand that looks like a good fit for the disc conversion use with Intrepid rotor hat.

Looking forward to information on the CNC machined brackets for the brake calipers to fit the Econoline spindles.

I also cyphered out a possible use of Maverick disc rotors onto the Econoline spindles with the proper bearings and a custom spacer to set the rotor into correct location on the spindle
Tony in AZ...

"130 mph is known as first gear at the Bonneville Salt Flats"

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #25 by Crosley » Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:42 pm

At this point the CNC caliper brackets are not available , so I guess I am back on the plan to build my own brackets
Tony in AZ...

"130 mph is known as first gear at the Bonneville Salt Flats"

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #26 by Crosley » Sat Oct 23, 2010 2:12 pm

I have made a sheet metal template for the caliper bracket

Image
Tony in AZ...

"130 mph is known as first gear at the Bonneville Salt Flats"

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #27 by Crosley » Sun Dec 05, 2010 10:54 am

hi,

I had some caliper brackets CNC plasma cut from 3/8 inch plate by a local fab shop that works on hotrods, builds frames, suspensions. Notice the Econoline wheel hub sitting there with new longer studs pressed in.

Next I need to mount the hub with rotor on the spindle, setup the caliper and mark for holes for the retaining pins for the calipers and I am finished.

Image

A photo of the rotor fitted to the hub. I had to drill the stud holes in the rotor with a 41/64 drill so the rotor fit over the studs I am using.

Image
Tony in AZ...

"130 mph is known as first gear at the Bonneville Salt Flats"

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #28 by 66 E100 Pickup » Mon Dec 13, 2010 11:38 am

nice work...looks like you trued up the face of the drum hub, which is absolutely needed. The factory hub is not trued, but rather the drum is trued up to correct the hub/drum. So a floating rotor needs to have a trued hub to mate with.

John/Fresno

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #29 by Crosley » Tue Dec 21, 2010 7:25 am

I've had a set back.. right side caliper bracket was fitting incorrectly , not parallel to rotor. I have found the spindle is bent. Looking for replacement passenger side spindle
Tony in AZ...

"130 mph is known as first gear at the Bonneville Salt Flats"

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #30 by 66 E100 Pickup » Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:16 pm

Hi Crosley...what year is your truck? Axles are all the same, but spindles are different.

61-3's had a different kingpin set and lube method (bushings different, grease nipple in center). 64-7 have the grease zerks on top, shorter bushing.

I'm guessing you are doing the king pins along with your conversion, therefore you probably want the corresponding year spindle.

I may have one I can send you, if 64-7. If is an early, I have a set or two of those also, but they are only in sets, not singles.

The spindles swap side to side, no problem. The steering arms may be difficult/impossible to remove without damaging the threads...try to get the arm off your bent one, then let me know what you need.

Also...I can maybe use your bent spindle...if it can be centered on a lathe by cutting the end off, I might be able to turn it down and make a mustang spindle out of it.

John

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #31 by Crosley » Thu Dec 23, 2010 7:41 am

Hi,

My spindle has grease zert in the cap on each end of the king pin. These caps thread onto each end of the king pin.

I see now that I have the spindle off the axle and removed the steering arm that left and right spindles look the same.

Let me know what $$ you need for the good spindle. I can send this bent one to you if you want to try to re-use it.
Tony in AZ...

"130 mph is known as first gear at the Bonneville Salt Flats"

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #32 by 66 E100 Pickup » Fri Dec 24, 2010 1:27 am

Your steering arm threads must be ok then?

I see that you have removed your original spindles from the axle...are you also planning on replacing the kingpins, bushings, and bearing? The kingpins in your kit...are probably not grooved correctly (good ones haven't been sold in many years). I've got dimensions for the good ones. The new king pin will need to be re-grooved to the correct depth. But, check the fitment of the kingpin in the axle hole---it should be almost an interference fit (no wobble at all). If it wobbles, it is usually because a bad set of kingpins have been installed previously. At that point, most guys look for a new axle, although it is possible to bore out the axle and install oversize kingpins.

If the axle checks ok, I have the special econoline reamer tool to do the bushings (they need to be not only the correct diameter, but also in line with each other). There are a lot of little details on this job (such as freezing the brass bushings overnight, using a hose clamp on the bushing to keep it from separating when it gets tapped in, making sure that the grease tracks are pointing in the right direction).

PM me with your email, I can send photos. Or, if you are a member of the econosrus group on Yahoo, there are a ton of tech photos and drawings in the photo archives (good vs bad kingpins, etc.).

Sorry long winded here. Can go couple directions---replacement spindle (old worn out bushings in place), or replacement bushings with new regrooved king pins (probably better to send two spindles ready to go, I'd need a kingpin kit from you or else I'd need to buy one).

John/Fresno

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Re: Disc brakes on beam axle Econoline

Post #33 by Crosley » Sat Dec 25, 2010 8:46 am

Thanks for the response.

I just need a good straight spindle. The bushings for the spindle are not a problem for me to handle.

The pins on this axle are not grooved, the bushings have many grooves. The pins are very tight and smooth. Must have been rebuilt and then the truck parked for decades
Tony in AZ...

"130 mph is known as first gear at the Bonneville Salt Flats"

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