'64 Econoline Window Van

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LateApex
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'64 Econoline Window Van

Post #1 by LateApex » Tue Oct 26, 2010 2:00 am

I just bought a '64 Falcon Econoline window van that is in really good shape except for a couple of issues: no interior, missing half the glass, no wheels or axles, body rot from 10" down, broken windshield and a few other minor things.

In other words, it's a blank canvas.

I'll be putting a 300 i6 in it with a 5-speed and 9-inch. Probably some Mustang II IFS clone for the front...

I'm thinking with a mid engine configuration, lots of lowering, stiff springs, good suspension tuning, fat tires and disc brakes, this could be quite a sports car.

See you all on the forum.

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bubba22349
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #2 by bubba22349 » Tue Oct 26, 2010 2:08 am

Sounds like you have some good ideas! Check out one site members 64 Econoline Drag Build here viewtopic.php?f=40&t=62751
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

Does10s
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #3 by Does10s » Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:21 am

Blank canvas is right!
By your discription, I'm not so sure that's in "prett good shape"! :shock:

Post up some pics!
I do like your future plans though! Sounds like fun!
Later,
Will
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'86 Mustang, Turbocharged, Best ET: 10.70@132.
'69 Mustang Sportsroof, 351w, auto
'63 Falcon, Turbocharged 250, C4, 9", Best ET: 10.64@127mph 11/21/14

early ford fan
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #4 by early ford fan » Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:46 am

how are you going to shift that five speed?

LateApex
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #5 by LateApex » Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:48 am

Yeah, I was kidding when I said it's in good shape. It's in a shape, but that shape may not be a good shape.

How will I shift the 5-speed? I decided to go with a ZF 5-speed out of an F150 since I can get a running truck with trans, engine, clutch, etc. all together in one package. So, since it's a granny 1st gear, that actually makes it a 4-speed since I won't be using 1st gear. Still didn't answer the question, though... I will have to keep the shift lever on the transmission, build some kind of cage above the shifter, attach cables to the cage, run the cables forward to an identical cage and have the cables attach to an identical shift lever. That way, when I move the shift lever that I can reach from the driver's seat, the shift lever at the end of the transmission six feet away will shift, too. It'll probably suck to shift, to be honest, but I'll be more than committed at that point and I'll have to make it all work. I don't even know how I'll get reverse to work. It'll get real kludgey, for sure. Maybe I should just hire someone to ride in the back near the shifter and shift for me?

By the way, I got a Jag rear end for the Eco. I sh!t thee not that it is exactly the same dimensions and weight as the 9" that came out of the van before I bought it. 61" wide, limited slip, inboard disc brakes, 3.31 ratio and spins freely with one hand. I need to get some pictures up so people believe me on this one.

Oh, yeah, I also found some e-bay blow-through carbs so I can hook up a turbo. I'll keep you posted on that one.

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StrangeRanger
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #6 by StrangeRanger » Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:25 pm

A ZF from an F150???
Are you sure it's not a Mazdog?
The ZF was only used in the F250 and up.

Look at the pix of each in this link. They're easy to differentiate. The ZF has diagonal ribs; the Mazdog has only vertical and horizontal
http://www.motivegear.com/tech_info/tra ... guide.html

BTW the ZF is actually more like a 3 speed since it has a granny 1st and an OD 5th. All of your normal driving uses only 2,3 and 4.
1996 F-150 (tow missile)
1993 Mustang 5.0 (hot rod and auto-x monster)
1982 Tiga Formula Ford (SCCA racecar)
2013 Hyundai Elantra Coupe (daily driver)

LateApex
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #7 by LateApex » Wed Nov 03, 2010 12:03 am

Oops, you saved me a big mistake, StrangeRanger. Thanks. I read that same transmission guide that you have in the link and I saw that the ZF was used behind a 300 i6 and assumed that meant F150. But, as you point out:

"The S 542 Heavy duty 5 speed fully synchronized transmission with aluminum case and extension housing. The bell housing is integral to the case. Shifter is mounted to small shift cover on top of unit. Built in 2 and 4WD versions. This unit is used in Ford F250, F30, F450, and Super duty trucks from 1987-94. The Super duty model has a mechanical park brake assembly mounted to the extension housing. The S542 is found behind 300, 302, 351, 460, and diesel power plants."

I will be looking for an F250 now. Thanks again.

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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #8 by LateApex » Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:10 pm

Hmm, transmission problems:

As you pointed out, StrangeRanger, the ZF transmission was supposed to be used behind a 300: "The S542 is found behind 300, 302, 351, 460, and diesel power plants."

So, I went and got one from a '91 F250. The bellhousing will definitely not bolt up to any 300 I've measured so far. It's much larger and since it's not detachable, I think I'm out of luck on that.

Unless...they made a late-model 300 with a different bellhousing bolt pattern? Please tell me this happened.

The ZF I got had a 460 in front of it, by the way.

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StrangeRanger
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #9 by StrangeRanger » Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:55 pm

3 different versions of the ZF: 300/351, 460 and PSD. All have different BH patterns
1996 F-150 (tow missile)
1993 Mustang 5.0 (hot rod and auto-x monster)
1982 Tiga Formula Ford (SCCA racecar)
2013 Hyundai Elantra Coupe (daily driver)

LateApex
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #10 by LateApex » Thu Nov 04, 2010 11:40 pm

Ahhh, so I can either track down the 300 version of this transmission or make an adapter plate?

Obviously, getting the right transmission is preferable.

But, would a 1/2" steel spacer plate between the engine and transmission work? It seems like the two major problems would be 1) making sure all the holes/dowels line up and 2) getting a clutch disc that would have a long enough center section to stay engaged on the input shaft.

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StrangeRanger
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #11 by StrangeRanger » Fri Nov 05, 2010 7:32 am

...and making sure the input shaft pilot would still be engaged in the crankshaft pilot bushing
1996 F-150 (tow missile)
1993 Mustang 5.0 (hot rod and auto-x monster)
1982 Tiga Formula Ford (SCCA racecar)
2013 Hyundai Elantra Coupe (daily driver)

LateApex
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #12 by LateApex » Sat Nov 06, 2010 3:28 pm

About the pilot bushing, by the way...

...I placed a straightedge along the front of the bellhousing to see how much the input shaft of the ZF trans sticks out and it turns out that it is actually recessed by about 1/2".

On my small-block bellhousing with the OD Toploader-Impostor, the input shaft sticks out of the front of the bellhousing by about 1/2".

Obviously, there are differences in how far back into the bellhousing the end of the crankshaft goes.

I found a ZF on e-bay but shipping looks rough. I'll going to keep trying locally for now.

LateApex
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #13 by LateApex » Sun Nov 21, 2010 11:59 am

Salvation is on the way. I found a fella in Indiana (Indiana Core -- they supply Jasper Engines with transmissions) who was willing to trade me straight up my 460-spec S542 for a small-block-pattern S542. I'm paying shipping (only $200 round-trip), so this is all very good news to me.

I can't wait to go get the new trans at the depot on Monday. I'll keep you posted and thanks for the advice.

LateApex
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #14 by LateApex » Mon Nov 22, 2010 7:00 pm

Time for another mood swing ...

... the transmission that fits my bellhousing arrived but the trans locks up in reverse and seems a bit worn. It has significant free play when turning the input shaft.

I am e-mailing the supplier to see what we can do at this point.

LateApex
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #15 by LateApex » Sun Nov 28, 2010 10:56 am

A local transmission specialist gave the transmission his blessing, so I'm good to go now. All I have to do is get a flywheel, clutch, throwout bearing, $$$, etc.

It looks like Jegs sells some Morse cables I can use to make a shifter. Wish me luck!

LateApex
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Re: '64 Econoline Window Van

Post #16 by LateApex » Fri Aug 19, 2011 5:23 pm

I ditched the '64 van project because I found a '63 Econoline pickup, which is what I'd really preferred.

So, I have a donor vehicle to use to complete the pickup, at least.

Plans are:

Jaguar rear end (already have it, it fits, just needs freshened parts)

Ford 300 straight six engine (have the head, manifolds, carbs)

Turbocharger (have a Holset HX40)

Mustang II front end (saving up for that but I do have some parts [steering, master cylinder, clutch cylinder, gas pedal] robbed from a cab-forward Toyota van to hook it all up)

Very little body work (going to keep it kind of rough so I can drive it instead of customizing it)

Trying to make a decent autocrosser out of it...I'll keep you posted

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