CI/VI head setup questions

Moderator: Mod Squad

fast64ranchero
Registered User
Posts: 158
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 2:58 am
Location: Boise ID

CI/VI head setup questions

Post #1 by fast64ranchero » Fri Jul 27, 2018 3:26 pm

Questions about setting up the Alum head. Spring installed height is short unless you bury the valves in the seats. mine is 1.564" stock is 1.68 and CI use to say the alum head setup was 1.6"
what are you guys using for springs? My cam is 0.505 lift at the valve and I'm not finding much for springs that have 110+ seat pressure.
I'm thinking about just having valves made that are 0.20" longer to get me into good spring selection.
Thx
Walt
Last edited by fast64ranchero on Mon Jul 30, 2018 2:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
63 Ranchero,1965 Mercury Comet Convert V-8, 1978 Fairmont small six, mill'd off intake, 62-1 ET 12.332 @ 123.49 mph (gone)

SydneytheMustang
Registered User
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2016 11:17 am

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #2 by SydneytheMustang » Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:00 pm

As it was told to me, there are no 110# springs at the right height. Need longer valves but there are no off the shelf drop ins for the alum head. Look up "The Legend of Dyno 2A" as the community answered this in detail for me when I began my engine build. I still haven't decided on if I want to do a custom valve run but if I do (should know in the next 2 weeks) and you're interested I'd be happy to go halvsies. Might get a better deal.

Happy building.

Mark

fast64ranchero
Registered User
Posts: 158
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 2:58 am
Location: Boise ID

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #3 by fast64ranchero » Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:21 pm

I just read your thread, kind of funny, I've had this head for a long time and everything has fought me dealing with it, Porter backed up and took months, machine shop backed up. I ordered my head unassembled, if you order it this way be prepared, I expected machine work to be completed, my mistake for not making sure I passed on what I really wanted. What I got was a Alum head and a box of parts, the head was bare, not even a Guide or valve seat in it... Now I have a head that flows 234 and 188 @ 0.550" and still can't use it. Looks like another $300-400 for valves, prob $150 for springs and retainers.
63 Ranchero,1965 Mercury Comet Convert V-8, 1978 Fairmont small six, mill'd off intake, 62-1 ET 12.332 @ 123.49 mph (gone)

fast64ranchero
Registered User
Posts: 158
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 2:58 am
Location: Boise ID

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #4 by fast64ranchero » Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:06 pm

Well new valves ordered at $30 each. valve info if anyone cares is 0.30" longer than stock for a length of 4.56" This gives a installed height of 1.802" after a 0.060" spring centering cup is used. opens up the use of springs with proper seat and open pressures. Now to find a cam company that will cut me a cam in the 0.550+" lift range to take advantage of the heads capabilities.
63 Ranchero,1965 Mercury Comet Convert V-8, 1978 Fairmont small six, mill'd off intake, 62-1 ET 12.332 @ 123.49 mph (gone)

pmuller9
Registered User
Posts: 2071
Joined: Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:33 am
Location: Columbus, Indiana

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #5 by pmuller9 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:01 pm

Excellent!
Will this head be for the turbocharged 250?

User avatar
bubba22349
Global Moderator
Posts: 8135
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:46 pm
Location: Flagstaff, Az. 86005 near the old Route 66

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #6 by bubba22349 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:23 pm

:beer: that's going to be a nice flowing head with the better longer lenght valves. Good luck :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

fast64ranchero
Registered User
Posts: 158
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 2:58 am
Location: Boise ID

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #7 by fast64ranchero » Mon Aug 13, 2018 5:36 pm

This is going on a mild 200 that will be running a turbo and FI tech injection. Really not the proper setup as I'll have more compression than I should run with a turbo. We have E85 here local so it may get a E85 tune and more boost.
63 Ranchero,1965 Mercury Comet Convert V-8, 1978 Fairmont small six, mill'd off intake, 62-1 ET 12.332 @ 123.49 mph (gone)

pmuller9
Registered User
Posts: 2071
Joined: Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:33 am
Location: Columbus, Indiana

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #8 by pmuller9 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 8:55 pm

fast64ranchero wrote:This is going on a mild 200 that will be running a turbo and FI tech injection. Really not the proper setup as I'll have more compression than I should run with a turbo. We have E85 here local so it may get a E85 tune and more boost.


What is the compression ratio?

Does the engine have stock rods and cast pistons?

fast64ranchero
Registered User
Posts: 158
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 2:58 am
Location: Boise ID

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #9 by fast64ranchero » Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:21 am

Right at 10.0 to 10.1 depending on what calc I use with Felpro gasket or 10.7 with a thin Ford replacement gasket. I'll be using the thicker Fel Pro. I know it's hi, don't fear the Compression! I've ran 13 to 1 on 91 Oct. pump gas N/A without backing timing off much. special attention to the chambers to prevent hot spots helps and my elevation (2800 feet) both allow higher cranking compression.

Stock early polished beam rods, Aussie hypereutectic pistons. (I don't understand why everyone is not using these, they are cheap, and way better than Cast stock replacements). It was going to be a N/A setup, if it makes ok power I'll build a better bottom end to better suited handle a turbo setup...
Search my user name and look for stroked and turbo'd milled head 250, I built that a few years ago, it is only one of the turbo setup's I've done.
63 Ranchero,1965 Mercury Comet Convert V-8, 1978 Fairmont small six, mill'd off intake, 62-1 ET 12.332 @ 123.49 mph (gone)

pmuller9
Registered User
Posts: 2071
Joined: Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:33 am
Location: Columbus, Indiana

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #10 by pmuller9 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:26 pm

As you already know your ported head is good for 300+ hp N/A and 600 hp under boost for a street driven engine.
The difference will be the 200 will need to run a lot higher rpm than the 250 to get there.
The longer valves with the correct valve springs you are installing is the key to the higher rpm. (I'm restating this stuff for those that are looking on)

The other difference is, the 200 will not tolerate as tight a LSA on the cam profile as the larger sixes if a reasonable idle is expected.

You mentioned a Clay Smith 292 turbo grind for the 250 engine.
Is that the cam you presently use in the turbo 250 and if so does it have a 112 LSA?

fast64ranchero
Registered User
Posts: 158
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 2:58 am
Location: Boise ID

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #11 by fast64ranchero » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:44 pm

This set up will be more mild, the 250 was fun but didn't live long. Rod ratio was to short and wore out the cylinders from side load. This engine is 67 CU. inches less than the 250 I built. I'm hoping to find a cam company that will cut a more modern cam than the Clay Smith 292 grind (it was on 112 LSA) thinking less duration @ 50 and more lift if possible. Something like 0.575" 220-224 @50, 113lsa
The 250 wouldn't make any power or turn past 5,500 so that cam was overkill anyway.

At this point, I'll be glad to just get the head together and on the short block so I can start mocking up the turbo header. After my last project, I fell in love with EFR turbo's, this project will get an EFR 8374. Not shooting for the moon just 350whp, it should do that with about 10 psig. The 250's head was neat but nothing like the flow numbers this head produces. The last time I had the 250 on the chassis dyno it made 444whp/501ft lbs @ 18psig. and went over 123mph with massive wheel spin in 1-3 gears on normal street tires. My new project sole purpose in life is to dead hook on the street. No one has any respect for the little "old school" inline. If it only runs 12's in the 1/4 but hooks on the street, It'll be respected.
63 Ranchero,1965 Mercury Comet Convert V-8, 1978 Fairmont small six, mill'd off intake, 62-1 ET 12.332 @ 123.49 mph (gone)

pmuller9
Registered User
Posts: 2071
Joined: Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:33 am
Location: Columbus, Indiana

Re: CI/VI head setup questions

Post #12 by pmuller9 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:30 pm

The new plans look good.
Would you be using a BW 8374-B with a .83 A/R T3 single scroll or a 8374-C with a .92 A/R Twin Scroll turbine housing?

You may have already looked at this, with a 200 six, if you make much boost before 3500 rpm the 8374 compressor will be operating close to the surge zone.
It would be great to make power from 3500 to 7500 rpm.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests