Log Gets Injected

drag-200stang

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injectors.jpg

Here's a couple pics of the fuel injection system I'm working on for my new drag 200 turbo. I have ordered 1" shorter injectors that should make the fuel rail easier to package. As you can see in the pictures I used JB Weld on the inside of valve cover rail, as the machined pocket for the injectors break through slightly. 60 lbs./hr. is the largest I could get in a slim injector. I installed the injectors at this angle for the best shot down the port, through the valve. I'm a little concerned about the strength I may have lost by boring through the valve cover rail. The valve cover will have to notched slightly. I'm not going fuel injection to make more power, just better fuel distribution and for something different.
 
yeha your pic is the size of a gnat.

I think this is the same idea I am thnking of. put injectors directly in teh head and just mount a TB on teh log
 
ok I was thinking of mounting them vertical (makes drilling easier) and farther up the runner.but the same basic idea. so what are you using to control it? those sound like pretty big injectors you got there (like 1000 hp worth of injector)
 
i think you weill have no choice but to get more power with those injectors..lol...EFI usualy gives you more power anyhow BECAUSE of better fuel distribution to all cylinders and better precise fuel mixture.

looks like an awesome idea though....
 
It is nice to see someone tackling MP EFI.

How high do you plan on boosting it to?
 
62 Fairlane,

I have a lot of things to do to get this car race ready, so the ECU will be the last thing I install since new units keep coming out all the time. The 60 lb injectors are actually only good for between 540-680hp depending on the duty cycle and how you figure hp.

Emerald 74 4 x 4,

I hope so and thanks.


Linc's,

I plan on boosting it as high as it takes to run 8.90s. I'm hoping that will be about 22-24 lbs but the turbo I have is just getting started at that pressure ratio. Hopefully, I can hold myself back and tune up to it slowly so I don't end up with a pile of junk.
 
What turbo trim do you have?

I am pushing 22 psi through an intercooler, I don't know if it will take much more than that - - - maybe if I retard the timing more, but you can lose more power by taking out too much timing to run more boost.

I am running 8.90's - - In the 1/8th! ;)
 
run water or alchohol injection....if you already have not planned to....or if you are allowed to....you get AMAZING power gains....cools intake temps and keeps you from having to retard timing and lower boost pressure.
 
That is is an outstanding piece of work. Looks like a lot of setup time. How long did it take?
 
Linc's,
The turbo I have is a Turbonetics T66 ballbearing with a TO4P trim turbine wheel with a tangential .81AR set up for a 3.5" downpipe and a T66 compressor wheel. I truthfully think this is a bit too large. If it doesn't work, I'll downsize. I don't think our 6's need a lot of ignition timing. Just try some things and use what runs best. The Buick guys say this turbo really kicks in after 20 lbs.

Emerald 74 4 X 4,
I ran a water-alcohol injection on my draw through system. I don't plan on using it this time. It seems to work best with "pump gas" but I'll be using C16 racing gas. By using the C16, I'll have a known octane rating. Also, the way the Ford econo log exhaust is designed to heat up the intake. I think the mixture will just pick up heat. I plan on cooling the charge air with a larger ice water to air direct mount intercooler like I ran before.

Howard,
Thanks. It took about 2 hours per injector pocket. It would have been faster to drill one large hole and epoxy an injector bung in but I wanted the smallest hole on the inside of the port, so as not to disrupt air flow. I stepped the hole down as clearance allowed. Contrary to popular belief the angle of the ports are the same, just the length is different. They do snake sideways differently.
 
You guys seem to be the more serious players on the block. I'd like to bounce my plan off you and get some feedback.

I've got a 67 Mustang with a 200 and power steering. I'd rather drive it than the 3 V-8 cars in the barn.

I started dreaming about a turbo 2 years ago and came to these conclusions for a street car.

1 Upsize to a 250ci
2 Turbocharger with air -to-air intercooler
3 Throttle body injection from late model Ford V6 w/ 2V adapter
4 Mega squirt ECM
5 AOD trans
6 8" rear axle

From what I've deduced I feel that I should use forged pistons at an approximate 8:1 cr for pump gas. An adjustable wastegate will let me fiddle with boost.

What am I to do about a cam? I am reading posts saying low overlap, but what about duration ? I would like to keep the stock valvetrain.

All in all I'd be shooting for 250-300 hp at the flywheel.

Suggestions ?
 
thats a huge turbo for this engine, prolly drag only kind of setup. but it might be what you are looking for though. nice set up. I was thinking the other day about efi on the log.. let us know how it goes.
 
drag-200stang

What type of injectors did you use?

Since you didn't use an injector bung:

- Did you use a special tapered drill bit to bore the holes to leave the lip for the o-ring?
- Was there enough material in the manifold to keep the fuel injector o-ring covered?


What are your plans for modifying the valve cover (if required)?

I like the work you've done and I've been surfing the web and scouring old posts for other's thoughts.

Scott
 
Howard,

The stock cam has me at nearly 300 FWHP right now. I think an aftermarket cam will make it easier to get there. I have a 214*/214* at .050" that is going to go in Version 2.0

If your goals are 250-300 FWHP then keep the stock cam, it's not a bad piece.

I don't know if an 8" can handle the power. If I understand it, it is about the same strength as a 7.5" rear end - not good. I yanked the 7.5" from my Mustang and swapped in a 8.8"

2-bbl CFI throttle body with Mega Squirt sounds interesting. You'll need two larger injectors, though, unless you can add more fuel through some other means (extra injector?)
 
T66, huh? Yeah it should work fine. for what you plan to do.

t66.jpg


The surge line looks far enough away so you won't have problems.......unless that head has a lot of restriction. The biggest reason for why I haven't gone to a larger turbo is because I don't know If I can flow anymore air through the head and exhaust log.
 
IMG_0410A.jpg


Injected log is delayed by the stubby injectors I ordered. They sent me the same ones I already have. For some reason they thought they knew what I wanted better than me and changed the order. :x I'll start working on the injector fuel rail as soon as I get them.

Howard,
I would not bother with CFI unless you just want to try something for fun. If you're going to bother with fuel injection, port injectors are the way to go and they don't have to be as fancy as what I did. Otherwise, for simplicity I would go with a direct mount 350 Holley. If you have to install the 8" rear end, I would go with an 8.8" or 9" - more available gear ratios and they're not that much heavier. But an 8" would probably hold up fine. As far as cams go, they say the more your turbo exhaust side is restricted, small turbine wheel, small AR, small down pipe and exhaust system, then you want something with less overlap and wider lobe centers. The more free flowing the exhaust side is, the more normal cam you can run. What these numbers are, I don't know. Buy one of each, run them and let us know.

Ski4evr,
Not sure what you mean by what type - the ones I have are MotoTron made by Siemans in a 60 lb/hr. rating. They're a high performance replacement for the Buick Grand Nationals. The hole for the O-ring is generally made just straight with about a 45 deg. 1/16" seat for the injector body to set against. Like I mentioned above, I did break through on the valve cover side. That's why I epoxied that area beforehand. Also for the valve cover to seal on. As you can see in the pic it's not that much work to notch the valve cover. There will be more clearance when I bond an 1/8" rubberized cork gasket to the valve cover, trim around injector and I'm sure it will be leak-proof. If I wasn't trying to get every last 1/10th of hp I would not weaken the head by boring through the valve cover rail. I would put the injector farther up the port by just hand drilling a hole and epoxying an injector bung in. I bored the holes with a vertical mill I have access to with a boring tool in steps as you probably can see better with the new pic. When I have time I will post pics of a cut away port that will show the cross section.

Linc's,
It will flow more air. Everything I have posted is true ... even the flaming marshmallow. :)
 
drag-200stang":2xjj4xnb said:
1) If I wasn't trying to get every last 1/10th of hp.....

2) even the flaming marshmallow.

1) Man, you are insane.
I'd do a head swap to a better design long before trying what you are trying to acccomplish!!

Now that your intake manifold is DRY, you can add the other passage externally like the sketch I posted!!! ;)

2) Missed that flaming marshmallow? :unsure::
 
1) Man, you are insane.
I'd do a head swap to a better design long before trying what you are trying to acccomplish!!

Linc you should be careful to judge, I think I heard someone say something similar about you. :LOL:

This guy might be as crazy as we are. :LOL:
 
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