car jumping in gear

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"getting somewhere..."
Yes, ur putting ur hands on there'n learning. YOU are the ultimate on ur vehicle as U can C even the paid helpers 'back out'.
The manuals are almost mandatory as U (like the rest of us) were not born an expert. There R so many sub-systems on the 'automotive system' (starting, charging, running; breaking; coolant; etc) that using the resources save time'n money, and get stuff toward it's optimal performance. This is a very technical endeavor. Diagnosis can B difficult.

I'd agree - if in USA drive to the local 'big box' 'auto prts store' w/some tools. Pull the alternator in the parking lot of the store who has testing equipment (they put it on a machine, run it @ speed, test). Things did not go so good w/ur compression test (look in the manual for proper methodology) so I want to B sure the alternator is as should B (just 1 prt of that system).
 
rustywagon":2w9wvvq9 said:
looks like the rattling occurs only when car is in "jumping mode".
I checked battery and alternator - both ok.
voltage dropped to 12V when I turned lights on. I replaced the volt regulator, now ok.
Issue - voltage drops when car is in gear or reverse, it's ok when in neutral or park.
What and where to check?, neutral safety switch? Short in steering column?
I checked/cleaned all grounds in engine area so far (no change).
Thank you, I feel like going somewhere.....

The reason the voltage is dropping when turning on the lights (an electrical load) or putting the car in any gear (mechacnical load) is that both of these actions will cause an "extra load" being placed on the engine. When the engine isn't in good running condistion, the tune isn't right or there can be a part or parts that isn't in spec. causeing the engine to miss or run erratic.

If the Battery at its fully charged state is about 13.2 to 13.6 at the battery terminals (this can very some due to the local area your in). Plus the Alternator is testing good plus you have already cleaned all your wiring conections and grounds this would all be good news and the electrical system probally isn't the cause of your problem. Having some voltage drop when you turn on the headlites is normal but what is the voltage without the headlites on?

With the "extra load" magnifying the sumtoms of it jumping in gear its likely time to start looking at some other causes. At this point I would focus back on the engines condistion, as the "jumping in gear" may be caused by severial things. These could be a vacuum leak or leaks use smoke or carb cleaner to find out. An imbalance in compression between cylinders, so redo the compression test over as stated in my above post. Also could be an ignistion problem so test the spark plug wires and the Distribitor cap using your volt / ohm meter to see if they read in spec, also look at the condistion of the spark plugs too.

Other things to check, what's the condition of the ignistion switch? Did you get the coil replaced yet? The neutral safety switch is easy to test if it's good. First off it isn't likely to be bad if the car starts in park or neutral, sometimes they need a little adjustment if the gear selector isn't in the correct location on the gear indacator. A short in the steering colum probally is unlikely since the wiring in it well protected and is only for the horn and turn signals, do they work correctly? Glad you are making some progress good luck in the hunt. (y) :nod:
 
There was voltage drop when I turned on lights (above normal drop), It got fixed when I replaced voltage regulator.
There's something going on with el. power while changing gears. Voltage is ok when in neutral or park, drops when in R or D. It goes up and down while charging gears.
I was trying to remove neutral safety switch, it felt apart. I hoped it was shorting there and with bad voltage regulator was causing the problem. But what I know.....
I ordered new neutral switch.
How do I bypass switch so I can work on the car...? Must be simple, 2 wires in, 2 wires out....
Thank you. M
 
yes I replaced the coil with recommended above.
Ignition switch - what should I look for....
also there's rubber hose going to back of transmission, I think it's modulator valve. The hose it's just pressed in, should be there some sort of fitting? The valves I see online have threads....
Now I see the threaded end is screwed into transmission, I guess rubber hose is just pressed on the end....
 
rustywagon":29ryndbq said:
There was voltage drop when I turned on lights (above normal drop), It got fixed when I replaced voltage regulator.
There's something going on with el. power while changing gears. Voltage is ok when in neutral or park, drops when in R or D. It goes up and down while charging gears.
I was trying to remove neutral safety switch, it felt apart. I hoped it was shorting there and with bad voltage regulator was causing the problem. But what I know.....
I ordered new neutral switch.
How do I bypass switch so I can work on the car...? Must be simple, 2 wires in, 2 wires out....
Thank you. M

Voltage shouldn't really change much when in gear is the engine RPM dropping a lot? If it is then it's because the alternator output is also dropping along with it too. Are you sure the battery is in excellent condition? Yes two wires in two out, bypassing the neutral safety switch though isn't a safe thing to do because then the car can start in any gear.

What is the RPM the car idles at in N? What is it in D? Also do you know what the base timing was set at? Did you set the spark plug gaps to .045? Without knowing the answers to my questions I am starting to be at a loss in what direction the go.

rustywagon":29ryndbq said:
yes I replaced the coil with recommended above.
Ignition switch - what should I look for....
also there's rubber hose going to back of transmission, I think it's modulator valve. The hose it's just pressed in, should be there some sort of fitting? The valves I see online have threads....
Now I see the threaded end is screwed into transmission, I guess rubber hose is just pressed on the end....

On the ignistion switch look for a lot of slop with the key in the run position (engine running) a good switch feels snug in all positions Acc., Off, Run / On. Yes the rubber hose is just pushed onto the vacuum modulator. Pull the hose off if there is any sign of auto trans fluid coming out of the hose than it should be replaced otherwise it's likely ok. Good luck (y) :nod:
 
yes, V dropped significantly when in gear, was good in neutral and park. (N - neutral, D - drive).
Guy who was assisting me with checking voltage said it was going up and down as I was shifting. Good in Neutral, dropping in drive and reverse. I thought there was el. shorting in old, worn out neutral switch, I will find out later today when I bypass it.
I will also replace ignition switch, it's original. It's few bucks.... I just want to eliminate all...

I will replace all spar plugs today, set the 045 gap. I am not sure about RPM's - how do I measure? Timing was set by mechanic, classic car guy (found out means nothing......).
Thanks!
 
question, other 2 (from neutral switch) wires go to reverse lights I guess.
will reverse lights light up, resp. should light up when I bypass those wires?
Reverse lights do not work, I'd like t fix it also. Bulbs are ok.
 
rustywagon":2d22j4iq said:
yes, V dropped significantly when in gear, was good in neutral and park. (N - neutral, D - drive).
Guy who was assisting me with checking voltage said it was going up and down as I was shifting. Good in Neutral, dropping in drive and reverse. I thought there was el. shorting in old, worn out neutral switch, I will find out later today when I bypass it.
I will also replace ignition switch, it's original. It's few bucks.... I just want to eliminate all...

I will replace all spar plugs today, set the 045 gap. I am not sure about RPM's - how do I measure? Timing was set by mechanic, classic car guy (found out means nothing......).
Thanks!

rustywagon":2d22j4iq said:
question, other 2 (from neutral switch) wires go to reverse lights I guess.
will reverse lights light up, resp. should light up when I bypass those wires?
Reverse lights do not work, I'd like t fix it also. Bulbs are ok.

The neutral safety switch has nothing to do with the cars charging system (Alternator or Battery). The NS switch is only in use at the time the car is being started in the Neutral or Park position of the column shift gear indacator or when it's in reverse it will also turn on the backup lights. The neutral safety switch can't affect the cars running voltage much since it's only in use during starting of the engine or turning on the two reverse / backup lights when the trans is in reverse. If you plug in those two wires for the reverse lights bypassing the switch the lights will be on all the time, best solution is to replace the broken neutral safety switch.

The engine RPM is measured using a tachometer see below for a tune up style Tach / Dwell meter there are lots of others that were made. Check at your locale auto parts they may have them to buy (don't know if they also loan / rent?) or also find them used at yard sales, pawn shops, swap meet, etc. You could also use just a Tach but it's not as easy to see them when your trying to do a precession carb setting. Good luck (y) :nod:

Example of a tune up Tach / Dwell meter
https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/ ... /overview/

Example of an Engine Tachometer
https://www.amazon.com/Bosch-SP0F000027 ... B00UM9WWXW
 
Understand on SN switch. Ordered new one. Will set and replace spar plugs later today.
I bypassed the SN switch wires, I also bypassed the reverse light wires - lights works now, did not work before. The SN switch was broken.
The Voltage doesn't drop when in gear. Car runs ok so far.... Haven't chance to drive too much though.
Not sure what caused the voltage drop, maybe faulty voltage regulator I replaced....
Isn't there hot wire in NS switch for reverse light which could of been shorting...?
 
rustywagon":2e8oqcq9 said:
Understand on SN switch. Ordered new one....

Isn't there hot wire in NS switch for reverse light which could of been shorting...?

I think a short happening in the NS isn't very likely, maybe somewhere in the wire harness that conects to the switch. This is a double switch that power comes in through one each of the two plug wires. And in this case it only happens when the trans is in Reverse then the power continues on through the switch turning on the reverse backup lights. Good luck (y) :nod:
 
well, than a miracle happened, I found only 2 issues - faulty volt meter and falling apart SN switch.
I drove today for 45min., so far so good. Voltage steady and no jumping in gear.
I replaced spark plugs - cars runs better significantly. The old ones had 1/2 of gaping compare the 045 you recommended. Also there was rattling of PCV valve and huge difference of engine running with and without PCV hose connected. Now it doesn't rattle and there's much less difference.....
I will have timing re done.
Thank you!!! I Really appreciate the help. Michal
 
"... rattling of PCV ..."
they're supposed to rattle, but not while driving.
We take em out'n shake (listen for a rattle) to make sure they're not clogged/need replaced. U may need to source the correct PVC (some folk throw in any 1 they find).

U may B right bout the 'blow back'. Do U have a second connection (tube/line) from frnt of valve cover to air cleaner?
R either of these 2 lines (frnt-PVC'n back-a/c) super clogged? Is the screen inside the a/c where the line comes in very dirty/clogged?

Has the correct proceedure been used to gather compression for the 6 cylinders?
 
:beer: Michal that's great news to hear! Congratulations on your success. I would recommend that you use these tune up settings as a starting point to fine tune it now.

1. Spark Plug gap .045 that you have already done
2. Base Ignistion Timing set to 8 to 10 degrees BTDC "Before Top Dead Center"
3. Set the Carb to the lean best Idle RPM, this is with the engine warmed up good make sure the choke blade is all the way open then the air cleaner is reinstalled too. Then set the carb to the highest Idle RPM now turn the mixture screw in exactly 1/4 turn.
4. Set the Carb's Curb Idle to 550 RPM in Drive with the parking brake set.
5. Repeat step 3. Again to check if it changes any next also Repeat step 4. too.

Good luck (y) :nod:
 
I did not have time to do anything suggested so far. I just drive..... Hope to do next weekend. I was told timing should be done with some vacuum gauge, not light, since engine is old..?
The car drives much better, around 35% power increase....
While working on NS switch I noticed coolant leaking between engine and transmission.... Another issue....
It's clear (the dripping), not mixed with oil.
Car was overheating for some time, and I noticed coolant at that time was seeping around head gasket, it stopped after I replaced the radiator. Blown head gasket? Oil is clear, not residue....
What should I check?
Thank you, guys! I very appreciated your help, 2 mechanics couldn't find the problem.....
btw, don't u guys know where I can find carburetor throttle assembly? Mine is about to felt apart, totally wore out...
 
rustywagon":ijdylg4i said:
I did not have time to do anything suggested so far. I just drive..... Hope to do next weekend. I was told timing should be done with some vacuum gauge, not light, since engine is old..?
The car drives much better, around 35% power increase....
While working on NS switch I noticed coolant leaking between engine and transmission.... Another issue....
It's clear (the dripping), not mixed with oil.
Car was overheating for some time, and I noticed coolant at that time was seeping around head gasket, it stopped after I replaced the radiator. Blown head gasket? Oil is clear, not residue....
What should I check?
Thank you, guys! I very appreciated your help, 2 mechanics couldn't find the problem.....
btw, don't u guys know where I can find carburetor throttle assembly? Mine is about to felt apart, totally wore out...

Yes the timing can also be set with a vacuum gauge. The coolant leaks at the back of engine might be from a bad freeze plug check them all. If it's leaking very much this could also cause your over heating since the cooling system can't hold any pressure. Yes the head gasket might be bad but you could also first try warming up the engine than retorquing the head bolts to the correct factory spec and torque pattern. For your throdle linkage you can try posting an add for that part in our Wanted section down at the bottom of the forums. Also try cragslist and your locale area junk yards. Good luck (y) :nod:
 
I will check freezing plugs, but I am skeptical they're leaking. I replaced those when I purchased the car. It's something internal, I am afraid.
I have new water pump ready to install, I probably replace head gasket with it, it's not big deal. Any brand recommended/should stay away?
The emergency lights don"t work, switch in glove department is ok, what else should I check?
Thank you!
I am amazed, how much better the car drives!
 
rustywagon":2onbnmd2 said:
I will check freezing plugs, but I am skeptical they're leaking. I replaced those when I purchased the car. It's something internal, I am afraid.
I have new water pump ready to install, I probably replace head gasket with it, it's not big deal. Any brand recommended/should stay away?
The emergency lights don"t work, switch in glove department is ok, what else should I check?
Thank you!
I am amazed, how much better the car drives!

Did you replace the freeze plugs in the Head also? There is one large one at the back of the head plus some small ones about 1 inch just below the intake manifold, see below link. On water pumps I have been using the GMB water pumps for many years they are new pumps at a very good price. On head gaskets I have been using the FelPro PermaTorque gaskets for severial decades (see below link), the Victor head gasket is also good. If you pull the head to replace the head gasket, also change out all the heads freeze plugs, replace the valve stem seals too, plus mill the head so it's flat. You might consider doing a good 3 angle valve job with back cut on intakes if you have the time. On the emergency lights things to check are the fuse, flasher, and light bulbs, sockets and grounds are clean. Good luck (y) :nod:

This is a good picture by "Powerband" showing the back of a 200 block and head
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/Pow ... anBn/?ref=

Another good picture by "BobSled" of the back of a 200 engine block showing the two rear soft plugs, one in red is to camshaft and can only leak oil. The other above the crankshaft is to the cooling system and could be a sorce of your coolant leak.
download/file.php?id=2609

GMB Ford 200 Water Pump
https://www.summitracing.com/oh/parts/g ... /overview/

FelPro Head Gasket
https://www.summitracing.com/oh/parts/f ... /make/ford
 
I am probably going to replace head gasket for now, I'd do full engine rebuilt later.....
I will check freezing plugs, I might of missed....
I found out I do not have kickdown cable....
I think the cable was attached to lever arm on fire wall controlled by gas pedal.
Is this what I need for fairlane wagon 1966 3.3L?
https://www.cjponyparts.com/scott-drake ... NyEALw_wcB

if I have head milled, wouldn't it change the distance between head and engine, resp. does it matter what gasket I use?
 
rustywagon":169i41zg said:
I am probably going to replace head gasket for now, I'd do full engine rebuilt later.....
I will check freezing plugs, I might of missed....
I found out I do not have kickdown cable....
Is this what I need for fairlane 66?
https://www.cjponyparts.com/scott-drake ... NyEALw_wcB

if I have head milled, wouldn't it change the distance between head and engine, resp. does it matter what gasket I use?

I don't know for sure if that kick down cable will work on your 1966 Fairlane, I would need to see what your linkage looks like to know if it will fit. Mustang's have an arm coming down off the throdle linkage that this kick down cable conects onto if yours is made like that then it could work.

Yes when you mill the head it changes the distance between engine block and the heads combustion chamber (it makes this smaller) and raises the engines compression ratio. The problem though is that the original stock Ford 200 head gaskets are a steel shim type that were .022 inch thick (these type head gaskets are almost impossible to find new today). The new style composition type head gaskets we have today are much thicker at .050 so right away that puts the head up .028 of an inch higher and this lowers the engines compression ratio and reduces the engines power some. So milling the head .028 to .030 is needed just to get back to the stock engine specs and restoring the lost power it had when new, some people even go to .050 or more to give the engine a little extra power. The other purpose for milling the head is so that it's again true / or flat and gives a good sealing surface for the new head gasket. The Hydraulic cams lifters are made to take up some variance in these machining operations so that this doesn't cause any problems when doing these smaller milling amounts. Good luck (y) :nod:
 
I'd just walk into the local parts store (CJ & others who specalize R usually expensive and "wait 4 da mail") and give them a part number ('67 mustang 6 cyl:
C6OZ-7A187-D).
There wuz no fairmont till 10 yrs later but some hada 200/3.3 & probably C4/autolite.
 
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