Rear main seal keeps tearing on bottom half

Simonsalz

Active member
Hello, my name is Simon and I’m new to this group, but I am having an issue with my ford 200. I keep having rear main neoprene seal tear on the bottom half (near 7 o’clock position if looking at the crank (also it is a felpro seal and they couldn’t help me much also)). The local machinest says everything is within spec but if finding it hard to beleive and I may be forced to go with the old rope seal. But any advice on which seal to use or what to do?
 
what R ur procedures on assembly?

I think the above post may B one of our better threads on the e x a c t sequence of operations to follow
on best practices on gasket install on i6. It is a lill different than others!

W E L C O M E !!! AND stick around till it comes out right (at the least).
 
wsa111":1c3suxgd said:
Welcome aboard Simon, did you remove the pin in the seal area on the tear main cap? The pin needs to be removed to use the neoprene seal.
Here is my old post on rear main seals.
http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=19247

The first two times I didn’t but then I did. I’m on my 4th seal and it seems to only be tearing the bottom. Also I paid a mechanic to do it to make sure it was all proper with no luck.

I’ll look into it thanks! I honestly couldn’t find much on what I was looking for specifically, thanks!
 
chad":1ge1exjz said:
what R ur procedures on assembly?

I think the above post may B one of our better threads on the e x a c t sequence of operations to follow
on best practices on gasket install on i6. It is a lill different than others!

W E L C O M E !!! AND stick around till it comes out right (at the least).

Honesly I follow the instructions precisely and I’ve done with and without permeatex on the ends and a lot to a little on the caps
I’ve had a mechanic double check the lip to make sure all was right and he approved. Then I paid another one to do all of it, long story short I lost 400$. I’ll try I though!
What’s a good brand rope seal? I ordered a national because I couldn’t find much on what to get
 
may B U need to take several steps backward 1st. Not certian - pic would sure help...
ID the exact motor U have thru casting numbers on block,
ID the match w/it for the gasket U have been ordering.

It seems U may B following the tech article here/on the tech archive, w/our specific thread or where ever U R lookin 4 guidance. That's Y I suggest a step backwards. Does 'echo" go into this step, some other on-line quality guide?
 
wsa111":23qyw1oi said:
Welcome aboard Simon, did you remove the pin in the seal area on the tear main cap? The pin needs to be removed to use the neoprene seal.
Here is my old post on rear main seals.
http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=19247

I was looking through the forum and there was great advice I’ll follow, but I notice the issue wasn’t the rear main tearing, rather it leaking (if I didn’t describe it, it’s literally tearing the seals to nothing and I have to replace those, I once pulled one 3k miles after installing and it had a chunk missing)
 

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chad":2i5ucewn said:
may B U need to take several steps backward 1st. Not certian - pic would sure help...
ID the exact motor U have,
ID the match w/it for the gasket U have been ordering.

It seems U may B following the tech article here/on the tech archive, w/our specific thread or where ever U R lookin 4 guidance. That's Y I suggest a step backwards. Does 'echo" go into this step, some other on-line quality guide?

I have the 1965 200 in-line 6 and the seal is a felpro bs30135
Guide you mean as what I’m following? I’ve followed everything I have been told by mechanics (multiple) and from inline 6 groups!

Also I posted a picture! Sorry I didn’t ealier but you see what I mean by a chunk missing?
 
I mean a pic "as installed". We might C that a prt is sticking out'n catching it.
A light underneath, camera pointing up, bottom up view of motor, etc...?
(hoping that is a lill clearer...) Unfortunatly I often write (not speak) in "short hand".
(a lill dis-graphia/learning disability w/keyboards writing & so forth).
We/I need 2 B in ur shop 2C whassss up.

Some folks say they have a '62 144 which turns out 2B a '64 170 etc...
(may B less important here, but still..ID motor by casting #s1st).
 
:unsure: I have been a fan and proponent of using the neoprene type rear main seals (because they had less friction "for a little extra free power") since back in the late 1960's, plus I have also mostly used and recommended the FelPro brand. Recently this same issue has come up with severial other people when using the FelPro rear main seals in the early 144, 170, & 200 blocks (i.e. those that originally used a rope seal). Because of this continuing problem I believe that these latest seals are not being made to the orginal Ford Factory specs of the rear main seals like we're used or offered in the past, and or they may even be substituting a seal from another seal application. Anyway this is my theory and because this has now happened with quite a few instances there is definitely a recurring problem over the last approximately 2 or 3 years, of these rear main seal failures. But only by acquiring then doing a side by side comparison and accurate measuring of a new original Ford seal which I think is (C9AZ-6701-B) compared to one of these current FelPro seals will prove this theory.

At this time I don't know if there is another manufacture that makes the correct spec neoprene seal to fit these 200 blocks, so it is my opinion and recommendation not to waste your time installing one or the money to buy one of these seals that FelPro is currently offering. So It also my opion It's just best to use the old tried and true rope type rear main seal. Or unless you would be lucky enough to even find a "NOS" Genuine Ford neoprene rear main seal. To reinstall the rope seal you can make a replacement rear main seal locking pin for the main cap from the end of a small finish nail of the correct diameter and cut it off to fit into the main cap. Good luck (y) :nod: Edited
 
Hi, we used to use a piece of like 2" pipe and use it like a rolling pin to install the rope seals.
You will need to install a pin in the cap like Bubba said. Maybe there is a roll pin that would fit.
I think we used to soak the seal in oil, and let the ends sit just above the block and cap surface.
Find old factory instructions I you decide to go back to a rope seal.
So here are some questions.
Did you lube the seal with motor oil before installing the cap?
How does the crankshaft journal look in the seal area?
I wonder if the crank is smooth, and if it was cut undersize.
Is the crankshaft endplay within specs?
As mentioned, guys have posted about the seal spinning in the groove.
I'm sure you know that no sealer is used on the seal.
Good luck
 
Short of tearing the entire block down and checking for bore alignment, looking at that photo, the mating surface of your crank needs close scrutiny.
 
After 3 or 4 times I would assume you are putting the seal in the right way around. Lip facing in, towards the front of the engine. Have you inspected the crank bearings while you've had it apart?
 
chad":2fs76kxl said:
I mean a pic "as installed". We might C that a prt is sticking out'n catching it.
A light underneath, camera pointing up, bottom up view of motor, etc...?
(hoping that is a lill clearer...) Unfortunatly I often write (not speak) in "short hand".
(a lill dis-graphia/learning disability w/keyboards writing & so forth).
We/I need 2 B in ur shop 2C whassss up.

Some folks say they have a '62 144 which turns out 2B a '64 170 etc...
(may B less important here, but still..ID motor by casting #s1st).

Oh I see! I’ll get some pictures tomorrow if I can! The motor is also a cd5e to clarify! Oh I see
I’ll be as detailed as possible now! And I’ll get all the numbers and pictures
 
bubba22349":2hkdc4u3 said:
:unsure: I have been a fan and proponent of using the neoprene type rear main seals (because they had less friction "for a little extra free power") since back in the late 1960's, plus I have also mostly used and recommended the FelPro brand. Recently this same issue has come up with severial other people when using the FelPro rear main seals in the early 144, 170, & 200 blocks (i.e. those that originally used a rope seal). Because of this continuing problem I believe that these latest seals are not being made to the orginal Ford Factory specs of the rear main seals like we're used or offered in the past, and or they may even be substituting a seal from another seal application. Anyway this is my theory and because this has now happened with quite a few instances there is definitely a recurring problem over the last approximately 2 or 3 years, of these rear main seal failures. But only by acquiring then doing a side by side comparison and accurate measuring of a new original Ford seal which I think is (C9AZ-6701-B) compared to one of these current FelPro seals will prove this theory.

At this time I don't know if there is another manufacture that makes the correct spec neoprene seal to fit these 200 blocks, so it is my opinion and recommendation not to waste your time installing one or the money to buy one of these seals that FelPro is currently offering. So It also my opion It's just best to use the old tried and true rope type rear main seal. Or unless you would be lucky enough to even find a "NOS" Genuine Ford neoprene rear main seal. To reinstall the rope seal you can make a replacement rear main seal locking pin for the main cap from the end of a small finish nail of the correct diameter and cut it off to fit into the main cap. Good luck (y) :nod: Edited


Really!? I didn’t know this was becoming a common issue! But
But ford made these seals? I’m assuming they don’t make them anymore? (I’m a bit confuresed sorry! It’s a bit late for me) but with the rope seal should I just pay someone to install it (because I don’t know much on /how/ to install them. (I’ve seen videos but still the idea)

But also in theory I called felpro and one of the guys said he called another guy to do some math and he said the housing DIA. Should be 3.945 and the crank should measure as 3.375 so that’s why I have it pulled but I’m honestly not sure how accurate that really is. Along with that the top seal always seems find (and having no specific top and bottom parts where the seal goes) could I measure the top and have the bottom measured to see how true it is? My freinds and I have continplated this theory

But even if all wasn’t true and needed to be fixed should I get it machined to the “proper” spec? I’m just so lost on what to do honestly
 
B RON CO":2a736p8u said:
Hi, we used to use a piece of like 2" pipe and use it like a rolling pin to install the rope seals.
You will need to install a pin in the cap like Bubba said. Maybe there is a roll pin that would fit.
I think we used to soak the seal in oil, and let the ends sit just above the block and cap surface.
Find old factory instructions I you decide to go back to a rope seal.
So here are some questions.
Did you lube the seal with motor oil before installing the cap?
How does the crankshaft journal look in the seal area?
I wonder if the crank is smooth, and if it was cut undersize.
Is the crankshaft endplay within specs?
As mentioned, guys have posted about the seal spinning in the groove.
I'm sure you know that no sealer is used on the seal.
Good luck


I’ll check the book and see what I can do!

Yes I always made sure it was lubercated so no dry start
It looked good visually and a machinest known to be good with cranks said everything was good and within spec so I’ll take his word on that (everything else on the engine I had him do was all good and proper)
He (machinist) said all was good he polished and checked it just to make sure this time around
He said they were good! But I’m getting everything double checked
Have tried with and without and all combinations but no luck still
 
wsa111":3vvqbdty said:
Has the block been lined bored??

I’m honeslyy not sure but the local machinest said he checked the line bore and everything was good and straight but he didn’t tell me if it was line bored
 
bubba22349":236v1efu said:
:unsure: I have been a fan and proponent of using the neoprene type rear main seals (because they had less friction "for a little extra free power") since back in the late 1960's, plus I have also mostly used and recommended the FelPro brand. Recently this same issue has come up with severial other people when using the FelPro rear main seals in the early 144, 170, & 200 blocks (i.e. those that originally used a rope seal). Because of this continuing problem I believe that these latest seals are not being made to the orginal Ford Factory specs of the rear main seals like we're used or offered in the past, and or they may even be substituting a seal from another seal application. Anyway this is my theory and because this has now happened with quite a few instances there is definitely a recurring problem over the last approximately 2 or 3 years, of these rear main seal failures. But only by acquiring then doing a side by side comparison and accurate measuring of a new original Ford seal which I think is (C9AZ-6701-B) compared to one of these current FelPro seals will prove this theory.

At this time I don't know if there is another manufacture that makes the correct spec neoprene seal to fit these 200 blocks, so it is my opinion and recommendation not to waste your time installing one or the money to buy one of these seals that FelPro is currently offering. So It also my opion It's just best to use the old tried and true rope type rear main seal. Or unless you would be lucky enough to even find a "NOS" Genuine Ford neoprene rear main seal. To reinstall the rope seal you can make a replacement rear main seal locking pin for the main cap from the end of a small finish nail of the correct diameter and cut it off to fit into the main cap. Good luck (y) :nod: Edited

Would this be it?
 

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Simonsalz":tnkss2mz said:
bubba22349":tnkss2mz said:
:unsure: I have been a fan and proponent of using the neoprene type rear main seals (because they had less friction "for a little extra free power") since back in the late 1960's, plus I have also mostly used and recommended the FelPro brand. Recently this same issue has come up with severial other people when using the FelPro rear main seals in the early 144, 170, & 200 blocks (i.e. those that originally used a rope seal). Because of this continuing problem I believe that these latest seals are not being made to the orginal Ford Factory specs of the rear main seals like we're used or offered in the past, and or they may even be substituting a seal from another seal application. Anyway this is my theory and because this has now happened with quite a few instances there is definitely a recurring problem over the last approximately 2 or 3 years, of these rear main seal failures. But only by acquiring then doing a side by side comparison and accurate measuring of a new original Ford seal which I think is (C9AZ-6701-B) compared to one of these current FelPro seals will prove this theory.

At this time I don't know if there is another manufacture that makes the correct spec neoprene seal to fit these 200 blocks, so it is my opinion and recommendation not to waste your time installing one or the money to buy one of these seals that FelPro is currently offering. So It also my opion It's just best to use the old tried and true rope type rear main seal. Or unless you would be lucky enough to even find a "NOS" Genuine Ford neoprene rear main seal. To reinstall the rope seal you can make a replacement rear main seal locking pin for the main cap from the end of a small finish nail of the correct diameter and cut it off to fit into the main cap. Good luck (y) :nod: Edited

Would this be it?

Yes that's looks like a Genuine ("NOS") Ford made seal. It would be interesting to measure and compare the Ford seal against the Newer FelPro seal to see how or if they are making them different. :nod:
 
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