Bellhousing trans noise

Moderator: Mod Squad

User avatar
falcon_master
Registered User
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:25 pm

Bellhousing trans noise

Post #1 by falcon_master » Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:45 pm

Hi everyone. As part of another topic I talked about some trans noises I having and wanted some ideas. I will upload a video in a little bit. So it all sounds like kinda a scraping/noise from the bellhousing input shaft area. It does go away when you press in on the clutch but im not sure how well the clutch is adjusted. And after running the clutch is very stiff and does not release well I have to pull it up with my foot if I release it slowly. In the video I know it's hard to hear it's short and the engine is not running right and it's loud but if you listen closely when I get in the car you can here it stop when I depress the clutch and resume later.
Junior year high school AFJROTC cadet and car enthusiast. Likes all things ford and engines of any company. 64 falcon 2dr sedan with 144 six and 3spd column shift manual transmission estimated 124,000 miles. Resurrected after sitting outside for 18 years, In process fixing for use as daily driver. “Old cars may break but are never broken”-RCR

User avatar
falcon_master
Registered User
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:25 pm

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #2 by falcon_master » Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:49 pm

Junior year high school AFJROTC cadet and car enthusiast. Likes all things ford and engines of any company. 64 falcon 2dr sedan with 144 six and 3spd column shift manual transmission estimated 124,000 miles. Resurrected after sitting outside for 18 years, In process fixing for use as daily driver. “Old cars may break but are never broken”-RCR

User avatar
falcon_master
Registered User
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:25 pm

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #3 by falcon_master » Sat Jul 07, 2018 9:28 am

I also feel I should add that it still sounds just as loud running in gear on jack stands.
Junior year high school AFJROTC cadet and car enthusiast. Likes all things ford and engines of any company. 64 falcon 2dr sedan with 144 six and 3spd column shift manual transmission estimated 124,000 miles. Resurrected after sitting outside for 18 years, In process fixing for use as daily driver. “Old cars may break but are never broken”-RCR

CZLN6
VIP Member
Posts: 3241
Joined: Fri Nov 15, 2002 11:07 am
Location: Idaho Falls, Id
Contact:

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #4 by CZLN6 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 10:25 am

Howdy Back:

The first thing I'd check is the throw out bearing. Have you done any work to the transmission and clutch/pressure plate yet?

Pulling out the clutch pedal with your foot does not effect engagement or disengagement. It usually means the pedal is hanging up on the pivot bushing and/or the return spring is weak.

Adios, David
co-author of the Falcon Performance Handbook
http://www.falcon6handbook.com/

User avatar
falcon_master
Registered User
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:25 pm

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #5 by falcon_master » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:04 pm

Thanks for the reply. That makes me feel more comfortable beacuse a trans swap is way to involved right now on top of what I want to ( a 200 swap kinda a different topic of itself). I have not done anything to the clutch or trans it is in the exact setup I found it including adjustment. Eventually when i get a 200 and I am moving everything over to it i will check the TO and PB and see if replacement is needed.
Junior year high school AFJROTC cadet and car enthusiast. Likes all things ford and engines of any company. 64 falcon 2dr sedan with 144 six and 3spd column shift manual transmission estimated 124,000 miles. Resurrected after sitting outside for 18 years, In process fixing for use as daily driver. “Old cars may break but are never broken”-RCR

196158A
Registered User
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2018 2:23 pm

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #6 by 196158A » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:21 pm

As cars go the Falcon is a pretty easy job to get to the clutch. It requires removal of the trans and bellhousing. Before getting started you'll want to get a clutch alignment tool, it used to center the clutch disc to the pilot bearing. There are inexpensive plastic ones for abt $5 designed for your car. https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/for ... +tool,7700 To get started disconnect the battery, remove the starter (3 bolts + a couple of wires, get front up on jack stands and remove the 4 small nuts that secure the rear U joint the differential. Push the drive shaft forward a little and it will separate from the diff. Leave it laying w/the other end (yoke) still inside the trans tail shaft. It will pull out of the trans but when it's out the trans will leak 90wt gear oil.
Moving toward the front of the car abt mid way there is the trans mount and bracket, unbolt it and remove. On the drivers side of the trans there are two levers that have rod connected to them that look like they go to the steering column. This the shift linkage. At the leavers there are a cotter pin in each and some washer to remove. Note the order of where the washers are placed so you can replace them in the same order. Again to the driverside there is a cable fitted to the side of the trans, it's the speedo cable. Remove one bolt and it pulls out of the trans side. Lastly four bolts hold the trans to the bellhousing. Remove these and pull the trans towards the rear of the car. Should pull straight out. Fortunately the 2.77 is a little guy and is pretty light in weight. Four bolts on the bellhousing, disconnect the spring on the clutch fork and a little prying on the bell (it has a couple of steel pin that align it to the rear of the engine block) and you'll looking at the clutch (pressure plate/disc) and the release bearing will be inside the bellhousing.
Unbolt the pressure plate from the flywheel using a criss cross pattern a turn or two at a time till pressure plate is loose. Then complete the removal.
What you are looking for is on the release bearing is that it turns/spins freely and quietly. If it turns but is rough or makes any noise replace it. On the pressure plate look for ridges where it contacts the disc and check for broken release fingers. Clutch disc should be oil free, no broken springs near it's center, and have some lining left on it (not worn down to the rivets). Flywheel should be clean w/o oil, where disc contacts it should be smooth w/o ridges. If the flywheel is grooved or badly blued from over heating have a machine shop resurface it. If the pressure plate and disc look good give then a good clean w/break clean a long w/the rear of the flywheel.

I think I covered everything but am doing so from memory. If I miss something pls feel free to jump in.

Happy clutch adventure!!! Can't wait for part II the reassembly!

Terry

User avatar
falcon_master
Registered User
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:25 pm

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #7 by falcon_master » Sun Jul 08, 2018 2:16 pm

Thanks Terry! I appreciate it. One question where can I find a new TO bearing. I've been looking everywhere and either it's only part of a $200+ kit or it does not say it is for a 170/144 engine.
Junior year high school AFJROTC cadet and car enthusiast. Likes all things ford and engines of any company. 64 falcon 2dr sedan with 144 six and 3spd column shift manual transmission estimated 124,000 miles. Resurrected after sitting outside for 18 years, In process fixing for use as daily driver. “Old cars may break but are never broken”-RCR

User avatar
falcon_master
Registered User
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:25 pm

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #8 by falcon_master » Sun Jul 08, 2018 2:35 pm

But one thing I'm planning on doing I'm calling up some junkyards around here and we gotta pickup I'm trying to find a 68+ 200. My reason for doing this is my step dad kinda convinced me I mean the money I'd have to throw at this thing for marginal performance compared to what the same amount would do to a 200. So I think I'll put it on hold disassembling the 144 until I get a 200 because I don't plan on taking the trans out I plan on unbolting the bellhousing from the trans and lifting the engine out putting all my old mounts, oil pan, water pump, bellhousing, etc and dropping the 200 back in. And while the engine is out I'll do a check of the input shaft see how it feels
Junior year high school AFJROTC cadet and car enthusiast. Likes all things ford and engines of any company. 64 falcon 2dr sedan with 144 six and 3spd column shift manual transmission estimated 124,000 miles. Resurrected after sitting outside for 18 years, In process fixing for use as daily driver. “Old cars may break but are never broken”-RCR

User avatar
chad
Registered User
Posts: 4024
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:51 am
Location: Lawrence Swamp, S. Amherst, MA

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #9 by chad » Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:11 pm

the Handbook should tell U which yrs and motors fit what bells & transmissions.
Make sure'n get stuff that matches or line up prts 4 the swap 1st.
Stardeio is at this point right now & it's no fun.
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), 250, NV 3550 & DSII to B transplanted, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

196158A
Registered User
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2018 2:23 pm

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #10 by 196158A » Sun Jul 08, 2018 7:20 pm

My best recollection is that all the 6's use the same bearing from '60-'65 and maybe newer.
This listing shows it being used on the 10" clutch V8 model too.
https://www.carpartsdiscount.com/clutch ... 93=1058391
I neglected to mention you may want to check a couple of things while you
are under the chassis.
Front of the diff near the u joint oily? Good time the replace the pinion seal.
If you are keeping the 2.77, oily tail shaft/yolk? Replace tail shaft bushing.
Shift leavers oily? You guessed it there are seals for it too.
When you get the trans and bell out it probably will be oil inside the bell. If the oil
smells like 90wt the leak is coming from the front seal in the trans, it right
behind the release bearing. If it smells like motor oil it's coming from the
engine's rear main seal. It's a separate job. Got to pull the oil pan off to get
at it.
When you have the trans out I would change the gear oil in it. Once it's back
in the car you'll need a suction pump to fill it unless your trans tunnel (floor)
is really rotten!
Just so you know there isn't any speed advantage by using the 3.03 vs the old 2.77
as both 3rd gear ratio is 1:1, no overdrive. There is an advantage w/the 3.03 in
that it has a syncro 1st gear where the 2.77 doesn't. This means w/the 2.77 the
car has to be stopped before you can shift in to 1st gear. Makes it a bit of of a
pita to drive. There is a T-5 trans that alot of folks use but requires some modifications,
welding, shortening the drive shaft, ect. All said and done abt $1K. Stock used in
Chev S-10 p/u and Mustangs. It's 5spd w/od 5th gear.

GL
Terry
Last edited by 196158A on Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
StarDiero75
Registered User
Posts: 477
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:39 pm

Re: Bellhousing trans noise

Post #11 by StarDiero75 » Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:07 am

Heed my warnings, match your engine and tranny or you'll be screwed like me. If you want a drop in, no probs, you want a 64-67 200. Those years will be either only 8.5" clutch/bell setup or the dual drilled so it csn take both 8.5" or 9". If you have a 144, you need the early pattern from the yesrs i gave you, if yoy go later than that youll have to get all new toys, like a new flywheel, starter, clutch kit, 3.03 tranny or SROD if you want a challenge, and modify your driveline appropriately like length and V8 input yoke.
OR you csn go the automatic route, just make sure you get all yoy need. A 2 speed auto or C4 will bolt to yours (you need an early C4 bell but they bolt on). Then yoy need all the stuff like a radiator with cooler lines, new steering column, linkage, cross msmber piece, mount, modify driveline in length and yoke.

Id say just keep what you have and dont play with the devil. I know first hand here what happens when you mismatch parts incorrectly. Slap that expensive $350 clutch from CJ Pony on and ride into the sunset brother.

Good luck
--1965 Ranchero w/1966 200 and 3.03 column shift, 8" rear 2.8 (Yes I know the gearing sucks), weber 32/36, CRT Performance HEI.
--1961 Studebaker Lark VI, OHV 170 l6 in the process of being resurrected. But it lives
--Creator of the only Weber 32/36 conversion video.

User avatar
chad
Registered User
Posts: 4024
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:51 am
Location: Lawrence Swamp, S. Amherst, MA

drive train prts mismatch

Post #12 by chad » Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:16 am

ahahahahahaaaaahaha
(try throwin a transfer case & dodge tranny in simultaneously)
;^ )
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), 250, NV 3550 & DSII to B transplanted, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 20 guests