Manual Choke on the Weber 38

['62 Susie Q]

What a great forum! I've already learned a lot and eager to learn more from this knowledgeable group. I'm a couple of months away from disassembly of my signature truck with a venerable 223 in it that runs pretty well for an old motor. During the rebuild, I'll be putting Clifford's 223 header, intake and carb kit on it which includes a single Weber 38 carb. It comes with an electric choke but I was wondering if anyone out there has set it up with a manual choke? My truck is very basic (no electric frills, not even a radio). I think I want to stick with a manual choke if there is a way to set one up on the Weber. Thanks in advance!
Bob H.

 

[manglass]

The Weber 38/38 DGES carburetors are only available with automatic choke (DGES=electric, DGAS=water). I'm not aware of a conversion kit for a 38/38 so I don't think it would be possible to convert one unless you had a parts carburetor available. A 32/36 DGV is similar so parts might interchange and it is available with a manual choke. The 32/36 has a progressive throttle opening and would also work good on your 223 depending on camshaft.

Lou Manglass

 

[62bigwindow]

Look at this on eBay

MANUAL CHOKE CONVERSION UNIT FOR WEBER 32/36 DGEV CARBURETORS WEBER 38/38 | eBay

WEBER 32/36 DGEV WEBER 38/38 DGEV MANUAL CHOKE CONVERSION. YOU ARE BUYING THE MANUAL CHOKE CONVERSION KIT ONLY. CARBURETOR AND CABLE ARE NOT INCLUDED THEY ARE FOR DISPLAY ONLY.

www.ebay.com

 

['62 Susie Q]

The Weber 38/38 DGES carburetors are only available with automatic choke (DGES=electric, DGAS=water). I'm not aware of a conversion kit for a 38/38 so I don't think it would be possible to convert one unless you had a parts carburetor available. A 32/36 DGV is similar so parts might interchange and it is available with a manual choke. The 32/36 has a progressive throttle opening and would also work good on your 223 depending on camshaft.

Lou Manglass

Thanks for the quick response and helpful advice, manglass.
Bob H.

 

['62 Susie Q]

Look at this on eBay

MANUAL CHOKE CONVERSION UNIT FOR WEBER 32/36 DGEV CARBURETORS WEBER 38/38 | eBay

WEBER 32/36 DGEV WEBER 38/38 DGEV MANUAL CHOKE CONVERSION. YOU ARE BUYING THE MANUAL CHOKE CONVERSION KIT ONLY. CARBURETOR AND CABLE ARE NOT INCLUDED THEY ARE FOR DISPLAY ONLY.

www.ebay.com

62bigwindow,
Appreciate the search help. I saw that and I'm corresponding with the seller. Prague? Interesting...
Thanks!
Bob H.

 

['62 Susie Q]

62bigwindow,
Appreciate the search help. I saw that and I'm corresponding with the seller. Prague? Interesting...
Thanks!
Bob H.

I stand corrected. That item is from CA. Thanks again!
Bob H.

 

[manglass]

That conversion kit is like many I've tried in the past in that there is no solution for the fast idle cam. The fast idle cam is sloped for a manual choke while it is stepped for automatic.

If you don't hold the gas pedal down when you close the choke, it will hang up on the step of the fast idle cam preventing the cable from closing the choke or even completing full travel. If you pull hard enough, you'll bend the cable mount or end.

As you open the choke during warm-up the fast idle may not reduce until you "kick" the gas pedal enough for it to drop by gravity as it does with the automatic choke. If you are going to attempt this, make sure you have some way to address the fast idle situation.

Lou Manglass

 

['62 Susie Q]

That conversion kit is like many I've tried in the past in that there is no solution for the fast idle cam. The fast idle cam is sloped for a manual choke while it is stepped for automatic.

If you don't hold the gas pedal down when you close the choke, it will hang up on the step of the fast idle cam preventing the cable from closing the choke or even completing full travel. If you pull hard enough, you'll bend the cable mount or end.

As you open the choke during warm-up the fast idle may not reduce until you "kick" the gas pedal enough for it to drop by gravity as it does with the automatic choke. If you are going to attempt this, make sure you have some way to address the fast idle situation.

Lou Manglass

Was not aware of this difference, Lou. Thanks very much. I need to figure out how to set up the automatic/electric choke.
Bob H.

 

[manglass]

An electric choke is relatively simple. One wire connected to an "ignition" circuit off the switch. You may or may not need a slight adjustment based on your climate. The only hang up would be if you were to leave your ignition in the "on" position. The choke will open whether the engine is running or not. When they were in use by the OEM's, some were run through an oil pressure sending unit to assure the engine was running when the choke opened.

As far as I know, all the DG series carburetors shared parts so if you decide you really want a manual choke you can probably find a used 32/36 with a manual choke and change those parts over to your 38/38. I had a 32/36 that I was planning to use on my '58 F-100 but it was beyond repair. I don't have it anymore or I'd offer to send it your way.

Lou Manglass

 

['62 Susie Q]

Great info, Lou. Always learn something from the gurus on this forum. Thanks!
Bob H.

 

[Paps61]

Sorry I know this thread is a little old but I was also considering the same thing, Clifford’s can only get the electric choke 38mm(DGES), Redlines website only shows electric or water choke for the 38mm but I found this carb they list as a 38mm DGMS (manual choke) not sure if it’s from Weber like this or not there’s two other places that sells these, Morris 4x4 centerand LC engineering performance(which also makes nice adapters), and pierce manifolds. I’ve attached a link to one from Ireland engineering motor sports which shows its from redline Weber. You could always buy the Clifford’s intake, header and adapter separate then one of these to use your manual choke. I was considering this in my ‘61 f100 223 to make it look more original, I was also going to adapt the oil bath air cleaner. Good luck with your build!

Weber 38 DGMS – Manual Choke

Each

www.iemotorsport.com

 

[manglass]

I like the idea about using the original air cleaner. I'm thinking of doing the same, mine has a paper element air cleaner so I think only a new, or modified, baseplate would be all it takes.

Lou Manglass

 

[Paps61]

I like the idea about using the original air cleaner. I'm thinking of doing the same, mine has a paper element air cleaner so I think only a new, or modified, baseplate would be all it takes.

Lou Manglass

Yes! I was thinking of cutting out the base and welding on replacement steel bottom for a 5 1/8 base then using an adapter, they make a Weber to 5 1/8 adapter, basically just using the housing for the look and putting in paper element.
If I can find a second oil bath air cleaner to match my original I was going to do this with the Clifford’s dual carb setup!

Round Air Filter Cleaner Adapter for Weber Carburetor Kit 32/36 38/38 – JT Outfitters

www.jtoutfitters.com

 

['62 Susie Q]

Sorry I know this thread is a little old but I was also considering the same thing, Clifford’s can only get the electric choke 38mm(DGES), Redlines website only shows electric or water choke for the 38mm but I found this carb they list as a 38mm DGMS (manual choke) not sure if it’s from Weber like this or not there’s two other places that sells these, Morris 4x4 centerand LC engineering performance(which also makes nice adapters), and pierce manifolds. I’ve attached a link to one from Ireland engineering motor sports which shows its from redline Weber. You could always buy the Clifford’s intake, header and adapter separate then one of these to use your manual choke. I was considering this in my ‘61 f100 223 to make it look more original, I was also going to adapt the oil bath air cleaner. Good luck with your build!

Weber 38 DGMS – Manual Choke

Each

www.iemotorsport.com

Many thanks, Paps61. I appreciate this great tip, I only wish I had this info awhile back. I already have the Weber 38 DGES. I would be interested in a swap out of some kind for a manually choked Weber 38 but I can't afford buying multiple carbs. Thanks regardless and the original air cleaner idea is a good one as well.

 

[Paps61]

Many thanks, Paps61. I appreciate this great tip, I only wish I had this info awhile back. I already have the Weber 38 DGES. I would be interested in a swap out of some kind for a manually choked Weber 38 but I can't afford buying multiple carbs. Thanks regardless and the original air cleaner idea is a good one as well.

No problem. Have you installed your new carb yet? I’m currently building my 223 and I’m stuck on wether to run the single or dual webers or I’ve even seen a 2 barrel efi setup with the original air cleaner. I think we both have similar ideas of modifying but yet making it look original. I liked the idea of using the manual choke to keep it as original looking as possible. Are you running the Clifford intake and header as well?

 

['62 Susie Q]

No problem. Have you installed your new carb yet? I’m currently building my 223 and I’m stuck on wether to run the single or dual webers or I’ve even seen a 2 barrel efi setup with the original air cleaner. I think we both have similar ideas of modifying but yet making it look original. I liked the idea of using the manual choke to keep it as original looking as possible. Are you running the Clifford intake and header as well?

Hey, Paps61. Sorry for the delay. No I have not installed the carb yet. I'm prepping for the full teardown and won't get to the Clifford set up for a while. I had the intake and headers Cerakoted and have tinkered a bit with how the carb might fit into the space but haven't run it at all. I obviously have committed to the single carb set up as of today. I like the original air filter idea. My only concern is the space between the original air filter can (once the new carb is mounted on the new intake) and the hood. I just haven't looked at the measurements yet, but would be interested in hearing from you or any of the experts here on whether they've been down this road. Still interested in potentially finding the manually choked Weber in a swap for a DGES. Best of luck!

 

[Paps61]

Hey, Paps61. Sorry for the delay. No I have not installed the carb yet. I'm prepping for the full teardown and won't get to the Clifford set up for a while. I had the intake and headers Cerakoted and have tinkered a bit with how the carb might fit into the space but haven't run it at all. I obviously have committed to the single carb set up as of today. I like the original air filter idea. My only concern is the space between the original air filter can (once the new carb is mounted on the new intake) and the hood. I just haven't looked at the measurements yet, but would be interested in hearing from you or any of the experts here on whether they've been down this road. Still interested in potentially finding the manually choked Weber in a swap for a DGES. Best of luck!

No worries! Yeah mine is currently in the tear down process, it’s very difficult to get certain parts right now. I’m not sure on the clearance I was just going to go for it and measure before I modify the base of the air cleaner. I’ll definitely post pics after it’s done. Nice on the cerakote I was also going to jet hot coat my intake and header. So my original idea was to do the dual carb Weber 38mm setup and adapt two oil bath air cleaners to make it look like a stock dual carb version in a way but I like the idea now of making it look as stock as possible and using the manual choke knob just like original. I’ve also seen the Holley sniper 2 barrel efi setup with the original air cleaner adapted that looked really good and I like the idea of EFI. But I’m keeping the 3 on the tree so may just stay all mechanical/simple! Too many ideas having a hard time settling with one lol!
Let me know if you don’t use your air cleaner and want to sell it I’m looking for a second one.
Thanks and good luck with your build as well!

 

['62 Susie Q]

No worries! Yeah mine is currently in the tear down process, it’s very difficult to get certain parts right now. I’m not sure on the clearance I was just going to go for it and measure before I modify the base of the air cleaner. I’ll definitely post pics after it’s done. Nice on the cerakote I was also going to jet hot coat my intake and header. So my original idea was to do the dual carb Weber 38mm setup and adapt two oil bath air cleaners to make it look like a stock dual carb version in a way but I like the idea now of making it look as stock as possible and using the manual choke knob just like original. I’ve also seen the Holley sniper 2 barrel efi setup with the original air cleaner adapted that looked really good and I like the idea of EFI. But I’m keeping the 3 on the tree so may just stay all mechanical/simple! Too many ideas having a hard time settling with one lol!
Let me know if you don’t use your air cleaner and want to sell it I’m looking for a second one.
Thanks and good luck with your build as well!

I hear ya, Paps61; lots of great ideas out there. I'll let you know on the air cleaner. If its out of my handyman zone, I'll look for other options and pass along my original can. I too want to retain the mechanical simplicity of these great trucks. Right now, I know when I open the hood where everything is, what it does, and how to fix it; not so on the newer trucks (or cars for that matter). Good luck and I'll keep the forum posted.

 

[Paps61]

I hear ya, Paps61; lots of great ideas out there. I'll let you know on the air cleaner. If its out of my handyman zone, I'll look for other options and pass along my original can. I too want to retain the mechanical simplicity of these great trucks. Right now, I know when I open the hood where everything is, what it does, and how to fix it; not so on the newer trucks (or cars for that matter). Good luck and I'll keep the forum posted.

I’m going to post my engine build with details but here’s an update I was able to have Larry from Clifford’s order me a manual choke 38mm Weber so I can use the original choke cable.
I converted the original oil bath air cleaner to a paper element turned out great! Here’s some pics: just need to put the decal on air cleaner but I had everything cerakoted in black. I used a 5 1/8” Weber adapter with another adapter to raise the air cleaner slightly, the air cleaner was cut on a CNC machine.