200CI linkage problem

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A few years ago I built a 200 inline six with a C4 automatic for my 65 mustang and i cant seem to get the throttle linkage right to the weber 38/38 carb I installed. I used the clifford linkage adaptor but still cant get wide open throttle. The clifford header seems to throw off the geometry. Do you have any ideas such as a cable linkage that may work for my predicament. Any advise will be greatly appreciated.
Daniel
In case you need it the engine has the clifford 272 cam, balanced bottom end, polished valve bowls and exhaust runners, 3 way valve job, clifford upgraded valve springs, clifford single outlet header, 2 1/2 exhaust tubing, and a stock distributor with a pertronics pointless upgrade, and stock fuel pump. Feel free to give advise on how to better tune the engine.
 
I was just thinking about moving your initial post from the Mustang forum, up to here. It's probably fair to assume that you've not got excess carpet/underlay fouling the pedal action.

My biggest dislike about cable throttles, is the safety aspect that really forces you into over-springing the return. It just exacerbates wear.

If you have to modify the existing rod and crank setup, make sure that the arcs of travel are relatively even from one to the next - it means you'll have a more controllable throttle action.
 
Its only the regular OEM style carpet underlay setup as far as i know. Whats your prefered way to bend the linkage. Sorry for the lack of experience in the modification dept.
 
Ideally you want the linkage to push/pull in straight lines from one pivot point to the next.

If there's something (small) in the way then of course you need to bend around it - but the bends should be made so that the reshaped part moves fully parallel to the position it would take if the obstruction weren't there. So - don't just bend a single kink into a rod. Bend out to clear the piece, then parallel to the original travel, then back in to meet the other pivot.

If pivot points are not sufficiently in parallel planes, then you lose motion because it gets translated into sideways movement rather than just pushing/pulling.
 
Awesome thanks for the advise ill be working on it in the morning. Any advise on my engine setup btw for optimum performance. This is my first inline six ive built just want to make sure everything is right.
 
Your biggest "gotchas" with a six like you describe, are inadequate compression, poor cam timing and bad distributor curving.

Once the carb linkage is fixed, see how it goes then - that'll be a better stage to determine if you need to dig deeper.
 
I had a similar problem with my stock throttle linkage arm over the rear of the header. I was using a stock throttle lever shaft. You know, the standard 1/2" rod bent at two 90* angles. I tried a couple mods of the first one including sawing it in half in the mid-section, sleeving the two pieces and cranking them down with allen head set screws. The geometry was there but the rod was too floppy at the joint to run the throttle dependably.

I ended up getting a salvage pedal/throttle rod at the junkyard. I went and retrieved the cut-up one from where I had flung it in the yard and laid the two next to each other; the new-old piece along side the prototype. As it happened, the failed prototype laid dead flat on my work table. I secured the new piece in the vise and tugged and pulled on it here and there with a steel pipe sleeve. When I was done it was flat like the prototype. I put the solid linkage back in the car and found that the long shank that connects to the carb was sticking up in the air about 20-30* over the top of the header pipe.
I marked the location of the rear pipe with white ink just back of where it touched the header pipe. Then I took the throttle connector rod out and secured it in my trusty vise. Using the steel pipe, I bumped it at the mark with a pipe sleeve and pulled it down the required almount. Put it back in the car and hooked it up with the adjustable stock thottle linkage thingy that clips to the bulbs on the rod and the throttle. It worked just perfectly.

When I replaced the carpet and put in sound deadener, I had to pull up on the gas pedal arm inside the car to get enough throw for WOT. The service manual has specs for the pedal height. You achieve them through fine adjustments to the throttle connector thingy and brute force at the floor. Once again, it works perfectly. You will also have to readjust the kick-down lever on the horizontal part of the rod after it is all working properly, but this is the least of the project. Leave the cable connected and just take the lever off the horizontal part of the rod.
I would suggest that you promote two of the rods though, in case you lose one over the back fence in a fit of pique, or it bends the wrong way. I think I remember something about propane, torch and red at the bend too, but that might have been another project.

Now the throttle linkage rod is dead level across the tops of the header at idle and dives down to the firewall bracket right behind the header pipes.
 
Ludwig, you should make specific measurements of everything you did to that stock throttle linkage to make it work just like that. SPECIFIC measurements. With pictures. And diagrams. And pictures. =D
 
I can see it now, next band interview. Spotty faced interviwer asks The Question No One Should Ever Ask.

"Does the drummer have any kinky hangups, I've heard a lot of them are prety, um, bent".

Lead singer, embarresed, answered before the drummer compromised himeself.

"Nah, he's straight as. The guy sells accelerator shafts to a select group of Ford Mustang owners. The are sold as Ludwigs 200 Combine Header Haverster Drumstick."

Then he added "I think he's working on a promo self styled 'skunk works project'. Sort of like the later C4 kickdown lever. That's to be called Lugwigs C4 Explosive Kit".

He's strange, but straight as a die...
 
Thanks for the advise the weather didnt let me work on it last weekend hopefully ill get to this weekend
 
x is cute":3n2845pn said:
Then he added "I think he's working on a promo self styled 'skunk works project'. Sort of like the later C4 kickdown lever. That's to be called Lugwigs C4 Explosive Kit".

wilhelmet":3n2845pn said:
Ludwig, you should make specific measurements of everything you did to that stock throttle linkage to make it work just like that. SPECIFIC measurements. With pictures. And diagrams. And pictures. =D

Better late than never. I have the camera and finally got the hang of photo posting. The measurements can be deduced from the relative juxtaposition of the corresponding attributes. (Nobody would hold the tape for me.)

Ludwig's C4 Explosive Kit:

IMG_0150.jpg


View at the firewall:

IMG_0151.jpg


Adjust the footpedal distance above the car floor to your own spec by pulling up.

As for specific directions, I don't think you need much more than to tweak the stock linkage until it lies FLAT on your worktable. Then bend the carb end as needed.
 
This came up some time ago. The link below shows how I actually cut the linkage and used a tube. This allows you to reinstall and adjust while it is in the stock position. Once you have the pedal propped up and the business end of the linkage rotated up, you can mark where to make your bend and how to clock the tube and weld to complete the assembly.

http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=14909&highlight=#14909

Please note that this application was for a 32/36 FGV. If the 38/38 has the throttle on the forward side of the carb you may have to extend the final length of the throttle rod.

Good luck, Ric.
 
Yeah, I know. Your post was from '03. I just posted on a string from Feb '07. I just got the camera recently.

I originally tried exactly what you did except I used allen screws on the sleeve, not tack welds. The allen screws didn't get it rigid enough so I re-bent a stock linkage. Yours looks just like mine at both ends.
 
Thanks guys yall are very helpfull. Ill be trying out your ideas in the very near future.
 
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