HEADERS-HEADERS, CHOICE OF L@@KL@@K

wsa111

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TILL NOW ALL THE HEADER CHOICES I HAVE SEEN ARE CLIFFORD OR FSPP. THESE COMPANIES OFFER A SHORTY PRIMARY TUBE 1 1/2 DIAMETER, PROBABLY ONLY 15 INCHES LONG THEN INTO A 2 1/2 COLLECTOR IN A SINGLE OUTLET OR A 3 INTO 1 THEN INTO DUAL OUTLET COLLECTOR.
I FOUND HOOKER OFFERS A HEADER PART #6601 WHICH HAS A PRIMARY PIPE DIAMETER OF 1 1/2 38 INCHES LONG INTO A 2 1/2 COLLECTOR. I HAVE NO EXPERIENCE WITH ANY DYNO TESTS WITH THIS 200 SIXCYLINDER ENGINE, BUT PREVIOUS ENGINES EITHER FORD OR CHEVROLET HAVE GREATLY BENIFITED FROM THE LONG TUBE PRIMARY DESIGN RATHER THAN THE SHORTY HEADER DESIGN.
THE SHORTY DESIGN SEEMS TO SOMETIMES PRODUCE A SLIGHT HIGHER HORSEPOWER OUTPUT AT HIGHER RPM'S BUT LACKED A GREAT LOSS OF TORQUE IN THE LOWER & MIDRANGE AREAS.
WOULD LOVE FEEDBACK ON THIS SUBJECT FROM SOME OF THE HEAVY HITTERS,XECUTE,SLADE, MUSTANG GEEZER, & DAVE OR ANYONE ELSE.
I ORDERED THE HOOKER SETUP FROM PREVIOUS EXPERIENCE.
PLEASE VOICE YOUR OPINION & EXPERIENCE.
THE SETUP I WILL USE IS A 2 1/4 SYSTEM FROM THE COLLECTOR TO TAILPIPE SINGLE OUTLET.
THE ENGINE IS A 200 WITH A 80 HEAD WITH FSPP VALVES A 264 FSPP CAM,1.6 ROLLER ROCKER ARMS & A HOLLEY 350 CFM CARB.
ANY AND ALL RESPONSES WOULD BE APPRECIATED.
SOME DAY A MAGAZINE WILL RUN A DYNO TEST ON MANY OF THE PARTS AVAILABLE FOR THESE SIX CYLINDERS. THANKS WILLIAM :?: :D
 
XECUTE, THANKS FOR THE REPLY. IN LOOKING THROUGH THE MANY POSTS ON EXHAUSTS I MIGHT GO WITH THE CAMARO SINGLE INLET SYSTEM THEN EXIT WITH A DUAL PIPE OUTLET. SEEMS LIKE THE MAJORITY OF THE OWNERS LIKE THE SOUND OF THE CAMARO SYSTEM.
I HAVE A FLOWMASTER 40 SERIES DELTA FLOW ON MY PRESENT ENGINE & IT SOUNDS LIKE A DOG CRAPPING RAZOR BLADES. I AM OPEN FOR ANY AND ALL COMMENTS. THANKS WSAIII :!:
 
i need some feedback on the camaro muffler setup for a 67? read my previous post. what dynomax muffler have you used?? any info would be appreciated. william :?: :?: :D
 
William, I've seen lots of amazing work done on Aussie sixes. Plenty of very astute people have tired varying types of exhasts for sixes. Some times, very strange things happen because of the accoustic properties of the material and length combinations.

I've seen some 202 cube Holden sixes show more power with cast iron two branch headers than with any extractor combinations. This was on an altered rod in Austraila, where the exhast envelope was clear of chassis rails, wishbone towers, steering boxes and fire-walls. There is an old post on it which is here. http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5554

The information from Aussie Kevin Bartlett, who has had a little experience with some of these header combos, says to forget the theory, and find a totla exhast combo which reduces back-pressure and gives good scavanging. This is a point underlined by Aussie Dick Johnston, who believes going for excessivley large tubes kills torque and narrows the power band. Vizard affirms this in his work with other engines.

Holden Australia spent thousands on a very specific type of interferance header made of stainless steel which was designed primarily for torque optimisation with no power loss. In essence, to widen the torque and power peaks algebraicly. The 1985 engine had very high specific torque per cube, something like 200 lb-ft from an engine with only 145 hp net from a 3.294 liter engine.

Ford Australia made there exhast extractors exclusivley for the 250, and would have tried very hard to optimise power and torque. I've written about ex Repco engineer Bill Santaccione, who did most of the early 2V 250 and 351 HO Cleveland development work, which included very advanced header and cam experiementation. http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=919&highlight=

I have no hard data to add to this. I lean on the links given as they push the envelope beyound my understanding. I do want to nail down some aspects publicly.

1. The headers must not be too big, and must fit the chassis. I'm unsure of any published data on our log head, 2v, ME, SP or non-cross-flow heads on what works and what doesn't. I have no specifics on the single or dual out collectors, and haven't a clue what works and what doesn't. The Holden boys, and Aussie company H-M seem to have very well-formed ideas, with either single 2.25 or dual 2" pipe collectors. Since Aussie cars have no low-mount starter but do have steering boxes and handbrake cables which get in the way, there has been no longer Perry, Gennie, Pacemarker or H-M header to suit. Therefore, no comparison. Only Aussie7Mains or some other guru could be of assistance.

2. The exhast system past the header is better being two big duals than one large single. http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7162&highlight=#7162


3. The Camaro system sounds ideal because its cheap, looks cool, and has a good low restriction design.
 
thanks guys for all the pm,s & feedback. i will go with the hooker header then use a single camaro muffler to a dual outlet. do most of you use a dynomax muffler or what??. also i will run a 2 1/4 pipe to the muffler then will exit with 2 " dual exhausts.
any replys would be appreciated. :?: :?: :D :D :D
 
William,

I've never run the Hookers (or seen them in person) But several people in the past on the forum have mentioned the fact that they hang down under the car rather excessively....

I've only ran the Cliffys and the Pacemakers from Mike myself :D :D :D

I ran the dynomax Camaro muffler on mine (single in dual out) up untill last summer and really liked the sound...there is bairly enough room between the rearend and the gas tank for the muffler though....on a 66

Later,

Doug
 
DOUG, THANKS FOR THE FEED BACK ON THE CLEARANCE BETWEEM THE REAR AXLE & THE FUEL TANK.
IF THE HOOKER SET UP DOES NOT WORK I WILL TRY THE CLIFFORD DUAL OUTLET SYSTEM HEADER THEN THROUGH AN X-PIPE THEN TO A DUAL EXHAUST SETUP. THE REASON I WOULD CHOSE THE CLIFFORD SYSTEM IS BECAUSE THE PRYMARY PIPE LENGTH SEEMS TO BE SLIGHTLY LONGER THAN THE FSPP HEADER & THE PIPE INLET INTO THE HEADER MATCHES THE OUTLET OF THE EXHAUST PORT OF THE STOCK HEAD. THE AUSTRAILAN HEAD SEEMS TO HAVE A HIGHER DIMINSION IN THE CENTER 3-4 EXHAUST PORT THAN THE STOCK HEAD. DOES IT MAKE A DIFFERENCE ????
AS FOR NOW I WILL GO WITH THE HOOKER JUST BECAUSE OF THE 38" LENGTH OF THE PRIMARY PIPE.
ANY FEEDBACK FROM DYNO RUNS OR 1/8 OR 1/4 MILE TIMES WOULD BE APPRECIATED. IF YOU HAVE REAL FACTS RATHER THAN THEORETICAL DATA WOULD GREATLY BE APPRECIATED. VERY RESPECTFULLY WILLIAM
 
I just received my hooker headers from jet-hot. They look awsome. The primary tubes are 1 1/2 " into two 2 1/2 collectors. The hooker part # is 6601. The primary tubes are exactally 38" in length.
Finally got my 80 cylinder head back from the machine shop. I used fspp lightweight valves. intake is 1 3/4, i had the exhaust valve cut from 1 1/2 to 1.430 so i could use hardened seats without going into the chamber wall too far. I don't think i'll loose much power, because the ports are not large enough to support a 1 1/2 exhaust valve. These valves look great especially after a 28 degree back-cut after the valves were lapped in. The intake log has been modified to accept a 350 cfm holley.
I plan to run either 2" from the collector or 2 1/4 after the collectors to an x-pipe then through dual exhausts.
Need your advise on exhaust pipe size???
This is a very fine line. with the 2 1/4 system would i loose the needed slight backpressure which a 2" system would give me????
Muffler choice? I want a system that does not drone like flowmasters. Another member thought borla was the best choice???
Any comments would be appreciated. The camshaft is a fspp 264, 214 @050 degree cam with 1.6 roller rockers. :D william
 
FSPP duel out headers,straight pipes,Purple Hornies glasspacks and a lead foot. That's all you need :wink:
 
William, I am about to install the Camaro setup on my 68 Mustang also. I think my exhaust guy is going to use a Flowmaster 70 ?? I think. I am finishing up the install of my 8" rear end first, then it's off to the exhaust shop. I am looking forward to the new sound and dual exhaust setup.

.............Cheers, Alex
 
Here is a picture of the hooker 6601 header.
hooker_header.jpg
 
this is the final post on this subject till i get the componets installed.
i have converesed with a representive of a company who has done research & devlopment on exhaust systems for clifford & several other manufacturers of exhaust componets.
i am using the 6601 hooker header with 38" primary pipes through dual 2 1/2 inch collectors. The final desision is to use a 2' reducer from each header outlet to a 2" extension to a y pipe 2 1/2 pipe to a muffler to a dual 2 1/4 dual outlets.
He claims with dyno tests this is the best setup for just general street use.
Will let you know. :idea: wiliam
hooker_header.jpg
 
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