HEI delco for 223? Can it be done?

240SIX

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Hi, i am used to 240/300 engine but i read the distributor will work into a 1964 223, has anyone ever used one of the aftermarket Delco HEI with intergrated coil on top? I am a ford man but it is hard to beat delco alternators and distributors! Plus it looks so clean without all the extra boxes and wires run all over the place... ford alt and dizzy wiring is a total rat nest even new.
 

bubba22349

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The 240 / 300 Distribitors can fit in any 223 if you adapt the oil pump drive or change to the 1964 oil pump that has a 5/16 inch hex shaft and use the 223 drive gear. I haven't seen or heard of anyone using an HEI Distribitor in a 223 yet, but if it's a copy that's made for use in a 300 then it probally can fit with the drive gear changed to the 223 gear, the advance cruve isn't going to be right and will need some attention. :nod: Edited
 

240SIX

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bubba22349":32ac8nhe said:
I haven't seen or heard of anyone using an HEI in a 223 yet, but if it's a copy made for use in a 300 then it probally can fit with the drive gear changed to the 223 gear. :nod:

That's what i was kinda hoping for... my new to me '64 F100 would really like it!
 

240SIX

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"the advance cruve isn't going to be right and will need some attention. :nod: Edited"

Bubba, i have encountered that even with the 240's and 300's... sometimes i cannot adjust the vac advance less enough and i will at that point leave it disconected... not correct but works with just the mechanical advance okay, there again not right but temporarly halfass and better than the stock wornout dizzy that i cannot seem to find the correct rotor for.
 

bubba22349

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Yes getting the advance systems working right can take some time and work but the effort will be worth it when acomlished. Shouldn't be all that hard to get the stock 223 rotor, looks like this one right? https://www.carid.com/1964-ford-f-100-i ... 21626.html

Standard still makes them also and I have been using the best in my OPIN NAPA Echlin ones for years.

One other thing on those aftermarket HEI distributor copies they have a shaft oiling problem, they need to be taken apart and moded to fix them, the directions to do it are located on this site. Best of luck. :nod: (y)
 

240SIX

Active member
Wowwie!! I just spent the last hour? Maybe? I went in the shop and robbed one of my "hotrod" 240's dizzy i bought and all i had to change was the gear! No drilling or milling or cutting etc. the roll pin was in the correct place everything! Reused the stock 223 pencil shaft (5/16") and it droped right in with a little fudge per usual ford to engage the pump. Piece of cake! Now the tidbit stuff comes into play...

In regaurds to the 223 rotor, yes it looks like the one in the link BUT... the D shaft is way too large and it rotates on the shaft a good 1/8 turn either way before catching the shaft... no bueno.

Totally stoked... wish i knew how to post a pic without having a turd site to hose-t it. Will update after i buy some modern wires to match the gm cap... its holiday time and the lonestar red is flowing, time to walk away from the ford. Thanks guys!
 

240SIX

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bubba22349":1zbg5h9t said:
Yes getting the advance systems working right can take some time and work but the effort will be worth it when acomlished. Shouldn't be all that hard to get the stock 223 rotor, looks like this one right? https://www.carid.com/1964-ford-f-100-i ... 21626.html

Standard still makes them also and I have been using the best in my OPIN NAPA Echlin ones for years.

One other thing on those aftermarket HEI distributor copies they have a shaft oiling problem, they need to be taken apart and moded to fix them, the directions to do it are located on this site. Best of luck. :nod: (y)

The rotor i have is echlin.

Oiling problem? Oh dear... hope its ok, ive used these in the 240's and 300's with great success... cheap and simple. Hope it is the same for the 223
 

240SIX

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bubba22349":zpyndpyc said:
One other thing on those aftermarket HEI distributor copies they have a shaft oiling problem, they need to be taken apart and moded to fix them, the directions to do it are located on this site. Best of luck. :nod: (y)

Is it because the original 223 distributor used a external oiler? I know it has a flip cap like my 1930's west bend lathe to oil it periodcly... does it not get any since that is not there? Thanks for any education i would recieve!
 

bubba22349

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:beer: Good job yes the 1964 223 is going to be the easiest one to do the 240 / 300 distribitor swap except for changing the drive gear it's a drop in. All the other years of 223's can also use the big six distributors you just need to eigther change to the 1964 oil pump or make an adapter from the current oil pump drive to the distributors 5/16 hex drive.

I may of gave you some bad info on the HEI shaft oiling problems this is a problem on the units made for the small block Ford six'es (170, 200, & 250's not getting oil to the lower shaft bushing and they would Seaze up, sorry about that. At this time I don't know of any problems yet on the 240 / 300 made units and of course your HEI when used in a 223, but the stock big six Ford Distribitors seem to work fine in a 223 so chances are if there is enough oiling at the drive gear and bottom of the shaft then the HEI could work fine also. As far as the top oiler this dose help keep the upper shaft bushing lubed and extending its life span a good idea however on the newer models this was discontinued.

I think I rember talking about that 223 NAPA rotor being too loose a while back, the problem isn't in having the wrong rotor its because there is a spring type clip that is missing that is suppose to slip on the end of the Distributor shaft. Without that clip then the rotors made for those distributors doesn't fit on the shaft properly or be as snug as its suppose to, these clips are also still available new or maybe it was still stuck in the old rotor when you took it off? Best of luck (y) :nod:
 

240SIX

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bubba22349":1yv8n3yw said:
:beer: Good job yes the 1964 223 is going to be the easiest one to do the 240 / 300 distribitor swap except for changing the drive gear it's a drop in. All the other years of 223's can also use the big six distributors you just need to eigther change to the 1964 oil pump or make an adapter from the current oil pump drive to the distributors 5/16 hex drive.

I may of gave you some bad info on the HEI shaft oiling problems this is a problem on the units made for the small block Ford six'es (170, 200, & 250's not getting oil to the lower shaft bushing and they would Seaze up, sorry about that. At this time I don't know of any problems yet on the 240 / 300 made units and of course your HEI when used in a 223, but the stock big six Ford Distribitors seem to work fine in a 223 so chances are if there is enough oiling at the drive gear and bottom of the shaft then the HEI could work fine also. As far as the top oiler this dose help keep the upper shaft bushing lubed and extending its life span a good idea however on the newer models this was discontinued.

I think I rember talking about that 223 NAPA rotor being too loose a while back, the problem isn't in having the wrong rotor its because there is a spring type clip that is missing that is suppose to slip on the end of the Distributor shaft. Without that clip then the rotors made for those distributors doesn't fit on the shaft properly or be as snug as its suppose to, these clips are also still available new or maybe it was still stuck in the old rotor when you took it off? Best of luck (y) :nod:

Outstanding! That clip must be missing in action someplace. Thank you very much!
 

bubba22349

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m1e9r5c6

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I just installed a 1977 Duraspark 2 distributor, ford TFI coil and GM HEI ignition module in my 56 223 and after working through a few minor glitches (mainly carb related) she idles smooth. Your 64 should be even easier because you won’t need the machining work. Just swap and go. I highly recommend it.
 

wsa111

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:beer: Good job yes the 1964 223 is going to be the easiest one to do the 240 / 300 distribitor swap except for changing the drive gear it's a drop in. All the other years of 223's can also use the big six distributors you just need to eigther change to the 1964 oil pump or make an adapter from the current oil pump drive to the distributors 5/16 hex drive.

I may of gave you some bad info on the HEI shaft oiling problems this is a problem on the units made for the small block Ford six'es (170, 200, & 250's not getting oil to the lower shaft bushing and they would Seaze up, sorry about that. At this time I don't know of any problems yet on the 240 / 300 made units and of course your HEI when used in a 223, but the stock big six Ford Distribitors seem to work fine in a 223 so chances are if there is enough oiling at the drive gear and bottom of the shaft then the HEI could work fine also. As far as the top oiler this dose help keep the upper shaft bushing lubed and extending its life span a good idea however on the newer models this was discontinued.

I think I rember talking about that 223 NAPA rotor being too loose a while back, the problem isn't in having the wrong rotor its because there is a spring type clip that is missing that is suppose to slip on the end of the Distributor shaft. Without that clip then the rotors made for those distributors doesn't fit on the shaft properly or be as snug as its suppose to, these clips are also still available new or maybe it was still stuck in the old rotor when you took it off? Best of luck (y) :nod:
I recurved a points distributor for a 240-300 with a 223 gear on it.
It worked great in his old truck.
If you use a 240-300 HEI it will definitely need to be recurved. All of the Chinese HEI's have way too much centrifugal advance as well as vacuum advance.
 

GalaxieInline

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I did a DUI HEI on mine 223! All it required was swapping timing gears. I used a 223 gear bored out to fit the 300 shaft, then drilled the DUI shaft for the right size pin in a vice. Then of course you do need the 1964 5/16" drive oil pump, and I made a shaft out of a 5/16" hardened steel allen wrench. Works beautifully to say the least.
 

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wsa111

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I did a DUI HEI on mine 223! All it required was swapping timing gears. I used a 223 gear bored out to fit the 300 shaft, then drilled the DUI shaft for the right size pin in a vice. Then of course you do need the 1964 5/16" drive oil pump, and I made a shaft out of a 5/16" hardened steel allen wrench. Works beautifully to say the least.
Good job.
Just hope the advance curve is correct for your 223. You might want to hook up a dial back timing light & see how much centrifugal advance you have with the vacuum disconnected. Then check how many degrees of vacuum advance you have.
 

GalaxieInline

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Mine is a Davis and curved for my application by them, within reason. I told them to give me 10.° I've got 24° at idle and 34° total. During cruise it varys but it goes to 30-40° until I tip in the gas. My afr gagues say it's doing its job by keeping the mixture lean on cruise and rich when I step back in and there is no pinging. It could use some fiddling probably though, I think I'd like lighter springs to let it come in quicker because I do gain torque I'd I back the the timing down manually, but that reduces my top end also.
 
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wsa111

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Mine is a Davis and curved for my application by them, within reason. I told them to give me 10.° I've got 24° at idle and 34° total. During cruise it varys but it goes to 30-40° until I tip in the gas. My afr gagues say it's doing its job by keeping the mixture lean on cruise and rich when I step back in and there is no pinging. It could use some fiddling probably though, I think I'd like lighter springs to let it come in quicker because I do gain torque I'd I back the the timing down manually, but that reduces my top end also.
I believe you could use more initial & i can recurve it for your engine specs. Bill email me with your phone # & the best time to call. billythedistributorman@live.com
 
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