Pony Carb Customer Service

[MPGmustang]

So, after putting off time and time again I finally sent in my 1100 vaporizor pony carb back to pony carbs for a "refresh". Since March (ish) of 2008 I have done the followng to the little carb:
jets, carb rebuild kit, idle adjust, cold Idle adjusts, blocked off the SCV to use my DUI on manifold vacuum, adjusted the 2nd dashpot, and changed direction of the lever from the gas pedal.
well now (before I sent it in) it has the following symtoms/problems:
can't idle cold without fethering the pedal, can't idle constantly warm (due to the throttle shaft is loose at the linkage making the idle screw miss its seat) and same MPG as before the rebuilt engine (kinda nice though as it has alot more top end)

I mentioned I've upgraded my distruibutor to a DUI and my cam is no longer stock, and planing on higher ratio rockers.
I was told today that tomorrow they are to start work on it, ,
they will upgrade/replace ALL parts that are not working properly, ,
I'll get a new 1yr warranty , ,
I'll technically receive a brand new carb in thier eyes, ,
and they will do it all free , :wow:

they informed me that since i've puchased it in 2008 (march ish) they have made MANY improvements to the carb and the selection of parts and springs that they put into the carb. I just happened to purchase one that was very early in thier making.

Now, I know I'm counting chick's before the eggs hatch, but so far thier customer service has gone beyond my expectations

Richard

 

[CobraSix]

Wow...that is impressive.

I've only owned a Pony Carb that I bought 2nd hand. Was a great carb. Glad to hear the service is outstanding.

 

[echo1955]

Great..
Free is the best price around

 

[Frankenstang]

they informed me that since i've puchased it in 2008 (march ish) they have made MANY improvements

MPG I think you might mean later in 2008. I also have a very early one. They were very delayed in production of the first run (like until July or Aug before they started shipping carbs AFAIK). Originally they were slated for as early as beginning of '08, pushed back till May '08, and they starterd sending them out in July of that year. Mine for example was ordered in April of 2008 and it was not shipped until the end of July 2008 because of the first run delays. In fact mine had/has a "76" written in 'sharpie' on the body of the carb which would lead me to believe that was it's production run number...wonder if you had a similar numbering on yours :

Just the same...many thanks for the update, as I'll be interested to hear how it turns out and may follow up with them myself. I originally sent mine back Dec 08/Jan 09 to have the float/needle valve/seat fixed because it was stuck open and flooding like crazy and under warranty. At that time they said they would check it out and fix it, but also said if it was due to trash in the bowl (which I knew it was not) they would have to charge me for it. They did fix it free of charge and returned it to me (minus my relatively new fuel filter). They made no mention at the time about upgrading parts, only that they had troubles with the tabs on some of the early floats. Again this was in the earliest runs, well before they changed foudries because they were having high failure rates with porous body castings initially (fuel weeping through the cast of the bowls).

So I'll be interested to see what they say when I get around to contacting them. It still really would be nice if they took a proactive approach and possibly contacted customers who purchased the early carbs and recommended they return them for servicing when convenient, rather than addressing problems as they hear back from us (proverbial 'letting the squeaky wheel get the grease'). If known 'less improved' or 'less favorable' parts were intially used it would 'save alot of face' or build them 'capital' with regard to their customer service reputation.

Please follow up with how it all turns out, when you can, and thanks again for sharing!

 

[MPGmustang]

Frankenstang,
you're right, I had to check myeslf from my 1st dyno, march of 2009... :rolflmao:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=56291
okay, so I got something wrong...

I don't remember a number my carb, I've taken it off multipule times and can't remember, I'll look again... when it comes back

 

[Frankenstang]

okay, so I got something wrong...

Heck MPG I usually get at least one something wrong every day :rolflmao:

Just helping clarify the timeline...there's been very good documentation here regarding the evolution of the vaporizer 1100, so it's much appreciated (at least by me for one, and I'm sure by others) that you're keeping us apprised of your progress.

Just to add to the info and timeline here's the post where Mike/AZcoupe mentioned the casting problems.
viewtopic.php?t=51889
AFAIK those issues were probably resolved by the second half of last year (wanna say I started seeing the carb offered again through their ebay store by Sept of 2010)...Mike would probably know for sure.

More info the better Thanks again, and look forward to hearing your results.

 

[MPGmustang]

The Vaporizers are currently out of stock, because Pony Carbs is no longer making them. At least not until they find a good supplier for the carb bodies. Not only were the shipments being delayed on a regular basis, the quality of the castings was so bad, they commonly had a 60 percent drop out. In other words, 6 out of 10 casting had to be sent back to be melted down and recast. As such, they kept running out of carb bodies, which prevented them from filling orders in a timely fashion. There were a few times when we waited 12 weeks or more, to get an order filled. Not good..... As such, they are currently looking for a new foundry. They think it will be several months before they start producing them again, but I'll let you know when they do.

I've had several customers tell me they are very please with the results. Not only are they getting a noticeable increase in power, they are getting better mileage as well.

Wow!!! yeah maybe it's a good idea I did send it back! lol 60% is alot of failures, this is kinda funny because I did have a "hairline crack" on the vacuum port for my old LOM... so I guess i'll be getting a new carb altogether??
Thanks Frankenstang!

Richard

 

[MPGmustang]

update:

Got a call today, my carb tested cold @ 87hp (the 3rd carb they tested @ 102hp on a stock engine warmed up) I'll put in a bigger jet as they suggested, wish I got larger jets than 65... would like to dyno after my suspension, I'll see if i can squeeze that in.

 

[Frankenstang]

Since March (ish) of 2008 I have done the followng to the little carb:
jets, carb rebuild kit...

Hey MPG, was the float inside the vaporizer nitrophyl/black or brass? Also I recall seeing in one of your other threads their stock jet size, but can't seem to find it now...do you recall the original jet size pony shipped 'em with?
Thanks in advance!

 

[MPGmustang]

Hey Frankenstang,

I have the brass float, even after they rebuilt it. The stock Jet is a f59 my current Jet is a 65 and with it I can reve alot Higher than before, 59 fueled out @ 4300rpm, I've had this 65 run up to 5500rpm, I won't go higher than that, but it's a huge difference, and I get more throttle response down low. I bet I'd be fine with a 64 or a 63 for summer but it's not here yet.

Thinking of changing jets?

 

[Frankenstang]

Many thanks for the response MPG

Thinking of changing jets?

Contemplating a few to experiment with...someone posted this site as a possible source and alternative to Pony's min. order...I should look into it...
http://www.carburetor-parts.com/Autolit ... /120-4.htm

My fuel consumption on the main jet seems okay, and no negative symptoms of being to lean with my mostly stocker setup "so far" (I'm usually topping out at 3500rpm). Sidebar: Do have some slight detonation at Full WOT, but believe that is more a result of the total advance on my mech adv only Unilite...total adv is a bit much on these for a stock 200, but luckily I can adjust that back internally on the plate.

Was almost hoping to hear they were nitorphyl (okay, not really ) cause that might explain the gradual move of my 1v to a richer idle as IIRC the nitrophyls are known to get 'gas soaked' over time and not float as well. I also wanted to be sure to have one of my spare parts brass floats on hand when I give her a clean up if need be...so actually that's good news. Should just be build-up/wear on the seat and/or the needle [fingers crossed]...although some amount of the disparity between 13 city & 24 highway could just be my 'fat' foot

Did leave a message for Scott/tech @ pony but didn't hear back...would still like to try my luck with a spruce up before having to send it in. That'll mainly depend on condition of the throttle plate/shaft given your experience and some of the early casting issues. Thanks again!

 

[MPGmustang]

Contemplating a few to experiment with...someone posted this site as a possible source and alternative to Pony's min. order...I should look into it...
http://www.carburetor-parts.com/Autolit ... /120-4.htm

Pony's min order? I didn't know they had one... Earlier I just orderd 60-65, already had the 64 from a local shop so a total of 5 jets, each was the same $4 plus a $4 shipping fee.

The nice thing about pony is that they have EVERY number and it's really nice for fine tuning. I'm just about due for reading my plugs so I'll let you know how they look this sat when I change my oil too.

as you have the same carb I'm wondering how your venturi looks, Mine looks kinda just stuck on, I wonder if there is room to grind/smooth out what I have and increase the area and CFM?? right now it looks like it goes 1/2 inch below the old bras hole, and it has 5-6 holes for equal distribution... maybe I'll get a picture and post it later.

 

[Frankenstang]

Pony's min order? I didn't know they had one... Earlier I just orderd 60-65, already had the 64 from a local shop so a total of 5 jets, each was the same $4 plus a $4 shipping fee.

The nice thing about pony is that they have EVERY number and it's really nice for fine tuning.

Well, actually I haven't experienced it myself, it's what they show on their website IIRC and have heard that from others. Last time I bought some 'parts' for an 1100 from 'em I think they were still on the east coast...long time back.
If that's the case I just might opt for letting them do the service on it like you did and picking up an assortment of jets while I'm at it.

I'm a little more encouraged that it wont' involve as much or any arm twisting to get the 'update' done after I found this thread...
http://mustangforums.com/forum/classic- ... arb-4.html
Page 5 actually mentions Scott/tech@pony extending the same offer, so hopefully it's something they're offering to all the early model "vaporizer" owners, that would be cool.

Otherwise it does have a couple pics of the vaporizer's innards...although I think that's the upper air horn we're seeing...you'd probably know, since I haven't cracked mine open as yet...still might have to do that before I send it in just for curiousity's sake. I'm not opposed to sprucing her up myself but also not opposed to getting my money's worth out of them and any updated parts they would replace

Anyway...I'm not sure the pics in the thread above have a shot of the "vaporizer" venturi or not, but they do have a pic of the standard 1100 autolite venturi, and I do recall xctasy and kevin discussing venturi shaving on the tri-power thread...definitely sounds interesting if not promising...probably need to crunch the math myself for the limits on these venturis (with a stocker build I might be there already).
EDIT: don't recall what the FFPH has to say about the venturi shaving on non-stock or near stock

Again, this is a good thread you started that might benefit others who have or will do business with PC
Look forward to your plug and jetting results. I'd like to move a little more towards economy than power right now, but then again who am I kidding...if I can't reach rickwrench's lofty 30mpg number (doubtful him with a 170)...I'll opt for a little more power 8)
Good luck on yours

 

[MPGmustang]

Thanks for that link! perfect!

The pony venturi that is in those pics is what mine looks like, notice the blocky sides around (after) the airhorn.. (don't know part names) it's squared and not very smooth at all, I was thinking of rounding/angling those edges and possibly making the PC horn shorter and maybe polish it up, I think the more smoother the faster the airflow like xtasy mentioned (yes I've read that thread too). Its actually nice to see a stock 1100 fuel discharge too for a good compairison on before and after.

FYI: when I talked to the guys @ PC they mentiond that any earlier models coming back in would receive the upgrades mentioned. I'd leave your stock 59 jet in they will change it for you, I asked them to leave it in as I had other numbers and didn't want to loose my number 62 jet. IIRC they said I could use more gas to achieve the 12.8 A/F ratio so I bumped it up to a 65.

 

[woodbutcher]

From looking at the photos of the venturi in those pics,the annular discharge holes look to be unfinished.Judging from the BURRS present,someone did`nt do a proper job of finishing their work,and the final inspection was sloppy.If I`m wrong,please correct me.
Leo

 

[Frankenstang]

Leo, yeah I'd have to agree with you on that one, the finish on a couple of those booster venturi holes looks a bit rough. I'm also puzzled about the merits of placing one of the booster venturi holes right inline with the dog leg feed (seems it would bias fuel distribution).

Not to excuse these away or for that matter their QC in general, but when Pony was trying to get the very first models of the "vaporizer" (w/annular discharge) out there were definitely some not to be totally unexpected delays and issues, as mentioned above, with regard to the development and production of a new ‘performance’ part. I’m guessing some of these might not be that dissimilar to issues Mike faced when developing the aluminum head, intake, stainless headers, etc.

I sincerely don’t want to sound like a PC apologist here; in fact I believe I have approached my own purchase with a healthy reserve and critical eye. Especially given the fact I, like MPG, was one of the early ones who plunked their money down (you know…beta testers ). However, I will give some deference and a degree of recognition to any efforts aimed at developing and actually producing any type of performance product targeted for what one could easily describe as a niche market (particularly the well out of production ford small six). So personally I might anticipate…probably expect…and even accept some unsurprising ‘beta’ testing issues. Yet I can still be okay with being slightly annoyed or frustrated by them at the same time. I’m encouraged to hear that it sounds like Pony has resolved mfg issues (internal/external, suppliers, etc) and apparently some CS ones as well, while working to correct issues on the early production units.

Well I didn’t mean to beat a dead horse there, and my $.02 is not intended as response to Leo’s comment, more just some acknowledgement for those in the business serving a more select performance group that the bigger Holley’s, Eddlebrock’s, etc tend to not even recognize.

Richard, I believe the smaller ring in the center with the holes is called the ‘booster venturi’ while the main venturi (the one being discussed for shaving/honing) is the larger convex curved funnel shape (metal? in the original autolite in the above thread pic) which is actually plastic, lexan? or some such in the Vaporizer. Hopefully you can just make it out in these pics of mine (it’s the white or offwhite convex curved funnel restriction just above the throttle plate). Trying to recall from the other thread, I think cfm capability of the log, as well as VE, measurements of the carb opening at butterfly & at the intentional restriction of the venturi (and probably another thing or two I’m forgetting) all need to be factored into consideration when figuring how much to open up the main venturi.

 

[woodbutcher]

Hi Frankenstang.I agree with with your comments.However,what I was referring to,and I was`nt clear on that,was the cost vs finish,as I understand that they ARE a bit pricey.Hopefully,they have resolved the QC problems.(Fit and finish)
And by the by,I AM enjoying this thread.
Leo

 

[Frankenstang]

Hi Leo, I think we're on the same page here as well 8) It's definitely a cost vs finish, or cost vs benefit equation, and I agree there's room for improvement at that price. Just to be clear I certainly intended no offense to you sir, and in fact didn't really intend to offer those remarks in response to anything you said. :idea: Probably could have said all that much shorter&simpler (too strong coffee too early )
Better said, "anything that keeps more folks from ditching the six (while maybe is not good for my own personal parts sourcing in the near term ) is good for all sixers".

I was looking at the hi res copies of the pics I posted above of mine and don't seem to have the 'burrs'. However mine's got some distinctive honing marks or lines instead....a little finer honed or polished finish would be better still ...it does look like that one was missed above :thumbdown:

And I finally spoke to Scott/tech today, seems like a nice guy, and looks like I'll be sending mine back as well, no charge for updates. Oh, but the jet prices have gone up (commodity tied? :mrgreen: )...$8/pc now. He says the '76' in sharpie on the body does indicate 76th one in the production run. I know they were out of production for a time based on Mike's thread above, but sounds like they're selling a healthy amount now. Wonder how many in total have been sold by now...going on 3 years , and would be cool to see a more recent version for comparison.

PS Richard, IIWIYS I wouldn't worry to much about smoothing the straight edges on the upper air horn since the main venturi really dictactes flow and velocity, and liberating the air horn flow might actually work against the objectives of the 'venturi honing'...akin to making the venturi smaller I would think.

 

[woodbutcher]

Hi Frankerstang.NO problem.Thats what this place is all about.Exchange of ideas and
GOOD conversation.
Leo

 

[MPGmustang]

And I finally spoke to Scott/tech today, seems like a nice guy, and looks like I'll be sending mine back as well, no charge for updates. Oh, but the jet prices have gone up (commodity tied? )...$8/pc now.

They offered 2 jets (of the same size) for $8 at the time, and I talked the lady into 2 different sizes for $8... worked great for me... bummers that they don't do that anymore. but the fact still remains they have every number and I havn't found that online yet.