200 needs a rebuild...

So, I just bought a 67 Mustang, and its got the original motor and transmission in it. The guy I bought it form said the starter is froze but it will turn over (i think...??) but needs a rebuild. I had planned on that anyway. BUT, what parts would have to be replaced, and what could be reused, if I had the block bored over? Or should I do that at all, since then it wouldn't be a 200CID anymore? Also, my dad says too much more than 30/thousandths will run it hot...whats the most size increase I could get without running hot all the time? ALSO, if it were bored over, how would that effect MPG?

Thanks for putting up with me...I did a search but there was too much to look through to see if my exact series of questions had been addressed before. Any opinions and advice will be greatly appreciated.

Better to do your research this side of any dismantling, so a big thumbs-up there.

Where are you located, what's your end purpose, do you have other transport, what's a feasible budget, are there other issues to attend on the car, and how would you describe your hand skills?

I dont think the overbore is going to have a significant impact on mileage or performance. Mine is 60 over and seems to run fine and cool. It was like that when I got it. I had work done on the head but the bottom looked pretty good and at 60 over already I figured there was no where to go so I just left it.

Addo asks good questions, with those answers we will have lots of good info for you. Those old motors are pretty simple and tough so you may not end up needing a full rebuild just yet. Good part is there are so many people out there that got to have a gas sucking V8 that the 200's can be had fairly cheap if you keep your eyes open. In 66 almost 1/2 the mustangs sold were 200's.

Better to do your research this side of any dismantling, so a big thumbs-up there.

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Haha, yea. It would be just my luck to have it tore down ready for a rebuild and not have any clue what to do.

I'm in Tahlequah, OK. Kinda humid, but right now...its just ungodly hot. My goal is to have a daily driver that's fun to drive...so I'm going to need something with decent MPG, but power as well. Not necessarily a 300horse car, but it definitely needs some get-up-and-go. I've got other transport, yes. And NE OK also happens to be kinda hilly, so torque is a must as well.

A budget...well, I would definitely consider the layout first, and then worry about cost. I would much rather shell out extra and have it last longer/run better than to keep more in my pocket (or put more toward other parts) and have to replace it later, or have "buyer's regret" and wish I had bought something better.

Other issues...well, the car itself is disassembled, cuz the floor pans are being replaced. There's a bit of rust but nothing major, it'll need paint eventually, and new upholstery...(its going to be restored...and once I hose it down and find the car under the dust, I'll get some pictures up)...but I can deal with the cosmetics after its drivable. My hands skills are negligible, referring to engine knowledge, but if I am told what to do and how to do it then I'll do it fine. I just didn't grow up learning this stuff, so my dad and I are starting 17 years late.

EDIT: hehe...I've got 2 emails with plenty of pictures that I can fwd to anyone interested in seeing it, before it gets cleaned up.

Is the engine out of the car now?

Sounds like you might as well get the engine in a stand and pull the covers and see how things look. If things seem nice and tight and not to dirty some new gaskets and seals and you should be able to run it while making plans and finding parts for a serious build and working on other stuff. If you dont have to pull the head it wont be that hard or cost that much. While you have the covers off you can make sure the valves all work before you turn it and bend stuff. If you get the covers off and it is trashed you just take it down the rest of the way and decide if its worth saving or if you should look for a better motor.

KHC67Coupe":oa5x2wqm said:

EDIT: hehe...I've got 2 emails with plenty of pictures that I can fwd to anyone interested in seeing it, before it gets cleaned up.

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I bet most people would like to see the pictures.

Look in the Eye candy section for directions on how to post pictures. I use photobucket and have no complaints.

Howdy KHC:

And welcome to THe Forum. While we're waiting for your answers to Adams questions, let me add-

In general, it is good to never overbore anymore then is necessary to clean up the cylinders an achieve a true bore. Less is better not because it may run hot- although that is not a typical problem with overboring, but because the cylinder walls begin to lose structural rigidity and the ability to seal properly. Our engines are a thin wall casting to begin with. What you might gain in an additional cubic inch of displacement is easily lost due to poorer sealing ability.

An engine running hot after a rebuild involving overboring is more likely due to tight piston to cylinder wall clearances.

You would do well to have a knowledgeable and sympathetic mechanic help you assess what you have and plan from there. It would best be done with a running engine.

IIWIYS- I'd verify that the engine will turn over, check out the starter and replace if necessary, try to get the engine running and go from there. Did the PO give you any reasons why he thought it needed to rebuilt? Did he say it was "Knocking?" "Burning oil?" "Smoking?" or ?????

Finally, if the rings are shot or broken and/or the cylinder walls are scored or barreled, it is very likely that a quality overbore with new replacement pistons and rings will increase MPG.

Every good plan begins with a thorough and accurate assessment of the need. Need is defined as the difference between what you have and what you want.

I hope you'll keep us informed on your progress.

Adios, David

Nope, its in the car. I haven't picked it up yet, either. Still out at the sellers place, cuz I need to borrow a trailer that wont be free for about a week...We're building a shop at my grandmas house, 30x50.

Whats pulling the head, btw?

30 X 50 shop? Dang thats something almost none of us have here so you are already ahead of most of us.

The head is where the valves are, sort of the top of the engine. It is where the head gasket is. Once you take the head off there are a ton of 'might as wells' and 'as long as its this far' that ends up taking more time and costing more money that you likely want to spend at this time.

wow, I'm definitely glad to get a great response count so far.

Fordconvert:
I'll get those uploaded tonight sometime

CZLN:
Well, its the original motor, so its bound to need connectors and gaskets and little stuff replaced, if it doesn't need alot fixed. Plus, I plan on increasing its power a bit so its best to start fresh, right? The seller said it ran when he got it, about 7 years ago. And its sat on jacks for about that long, without doing much to it at all.

Another Question: IF I get a 2-barrel carburetor and the associated intake and all that stuff, would I be able to use a modular intake system? I've always wanted one...lol

Well aloha and welcome to the "still learning" club! I got my Ford about a year ago, and before that I didn't know much more than how to change the oil. There's a fair amount of information out there on these engines (especially here), and thankfully they're not terribly complicated, so with some patience and determination you'd be surprised how much you can learn. Tools and space are my biggest problem, and I've still managed to do quite a bit.

I've been considered getting into the block one of these days (she doesn't really need it, but I like to tinker and there's room for improvement) so if you do it first, maybe someday you can give me a few tips

If the engine is still in the car and you can turn the crank over, I think a compression test will let you know what kind of shape the cylinders are in. Someone else might have better advice, but I think I'd start there.

Like L3n said compression test is a good thing. I would at least take off the valve cover and make sure things are able to move before trying to turn it if it has been sitting for that long. Also some of your favorite magic oil down the spark plug holes wont hurt. To turn over by hand you use a big socket on the crank pulley. That way you can do it nice and easy and stop if things are sticking.

Sounds like you have some reading and learning to do to pick up the basics and know what specific questions to ask the I6 experts here.

Good Luck and remember to have fun!

Yea, I tried to convince my dad to let me take home a non-working transmission from the junkyard so I could mess with it and see how it (didn't) work, but he wouldn't let me..lol.

So, for the compression test...once we get it home and I see i it runs or just cranks or what, then I'll go from there. But I do know it cranks, so that's a start. lol.

OK, so I'm off to upload those pictures, and Ive got dial up so that means I'll probably have to wait a while to let them upload..but since I've never uploaded to Photobucket form another web address, I dunno. Either way, I shall return shortly.

OK, conservative viewpoint... The motor either will run, or it won't.

As money is being spent in a bunch of other areas at present, don't spend more than is necessary to maintain function. At most I would remove the head and check the bores for mud wasps, mice, rust, etc etc. Look at the oil in your block (via the dipstick), for both rusty water and metallic glint.

If it generally checks out OK as per the above criteria, put it back together and make it go. When the rest of your car is about done, worry about the motor again.

We have already checked the oil, it looked fine. It was a bit low, though.

So, as per the conservative viewpoint, it doesn't run.

But that order of fixing is basically what will be done. I'm just curious about the motor, and it never hurts to know. lol.

So, i posted in the Eye Candy part. Those are all form the seller, I'll get better ones up as soon as I get it and clean it.

What did the owner say about the motor? What were his plans?

He has a Mercury Monarch, he was gonna use the 9" rear end and the 5-lugs to do a V8 swap. But he DID say that the guy he bought it from, his uncles son-in-law, said it ran when he bought it. So it probably IS just the starter or alternator or whatever controls that stuff.

When it says 9" or 8" rear end, what does that refer to?

KHC67Coupe":22mrv1xi said:

Also, my dad says too much more than 30/thousandths will run it hot...whats the most size increase I could get without running hot all the time? ALSO, if it were bored over, how would that effect MPG?
)

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Nope it won't. My 200 in my 67 is bored .040 and it has never ran hot. I get an average of about 20 MPG with it. I also just put on a 2v carb. So that will increase the MPG also.

The 8" 9" is the size of the ring gear in the differential. The bigger they get the stronger they tend to get. With strength comes weight and takes more horses just to turn it. The Ford 9" is sort of the Hot Rod standard rear, along with a small block chebby V8. There are tons of parts for them and unlike the typical GM the guts all come out together so they can be more convinent to work on. The stock 6 cyl stangs were 7 1/4" IIRC.

So, BA Mustang, if I bored it .040 over, what would need to be replaced? Would I be able to use the same pistons, heads, etc? It seems like I would have to replace all of that, but I have no real idea. So boring over helps or hurts MPG? And I figured a 2V would help. I'm totally getting one.

Fordconvert: Thanks. I've learned alot today