Turbo 240 or 300

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pmuller9
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #101 by pmuller9 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 3:41 am

I don't have an lower EFI manifold here to measure.
What is the ID of the injector holes in the intake manifold?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #102 by Ramian17 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 4:34 pm

I won't lie to ya I don't know which # ids the injectors.
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #103 by Ramian17 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 4:45 pm

So what do you think can I cut it all the way to where I'm pointing pretty much all the way up to that support that connects them? Then weld on flanges or straight to plenum?
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #104 by pmuller9 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 6:49 pm

I apologize, I wasn't thinking when I wrote ID.
I meant to say the Inside Diameter of the hole for the injector. LOL
It should be around 14mm

You just need to make sure there will be room to install the injectors and fuel rail.
There are shorter injectors available.

These are the ones I was looking at. Amazon has them for $339
The prices listed are for all six injectors.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/dwk-16u0000426

I visited their booth at the PRI trade show.
They do a great job of flow matching the injectors plus the spray pattern is better than most which will help at idle and low rpm.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #105 by Ramian17 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:01 pm

Woo hoo 339 each yeah get some. Those shorties are the ones I need for sure. I love them that will be more than the turbo for all six of them lol. Will that fuel rail company drill holes in them or will I have to do that?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #106 by Ramian17 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:02 pm

Wait is it 339 for 6?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #107 by pmuller9 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:19 pm

Ramian17 wrote:Wait is it 339 for 6?

You did not read my post carefully enough where I stated that the listed prices were for six injectors.
You must have gone into shock before you got that far. LOL
I should have made that part clear before I said anything about price.

Anyway back to my original question.
What is the inside diameter of the hole in the intake manifold for the injector?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #108 by Ramian17 » Mon Apr 03, 2017 9:54 pm

As best I can measure it's 10.79mm or .4242 inches. According to the caliper.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #109 by Ramian17 » Mon Apr 03, 2017 9:59 pm

I looked all over and I can't tell if they will fit my manifold? I really hope they do there shortlyness is going to be key in the goal of no modification to the dog house.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #110 by pmuller9 » Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:39 pm

Ramian17 wrote:I looked all over and I can't tell if they will fit my manifold? I really hope they do there shortlyness is going to be key in the goal of no modification to the dog house.

Here is the mounting instructions.
Looks like the injectors need a 13.57 mm hole both top and bottom. (Page 5)

http://www.bosch-motorsport.com/media/c ... 867pdf.pdf

Ramian17 wrote:As best I can measure it's 10.79mm or .4242 inches. According to the caliper.

That should be the small exit hole for the injector tip.
Measure the larger hole that the injector "O" ring slides into.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #111 by Ramian17 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:48 am

Yep the bigger hole on the outside is 13.57. perfect

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #112 by Ramian17 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:53 am

Can I use the stock fuel rail with those and if so do you know where I can get a stoke one? If I can't get a stock one will those custom fuel rails you showed me need machining?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #113 by pmuller9 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:35 am

A stock fuel rail will have the correct spacing and should have the right holes sizes for the injectors.
The only question is if the stock rail is big enough to flow the extra fuel volume.
I would go to a Pull and Save salvage yard and get a stock 4.9 rail from a Ford truck or van.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #114 by Ramian17 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:50 am

Do you think it will for enough? I honestly have no idea. I'll use the custom rails you showed me if you think it can be done without super crazy fabrication? Lol

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #115 by pmuller9 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:25 pm

Ramian17 wrote:Do you think it will for enough? I honestly have no idea. I'll use the custom rails you showed me if you think it can be done without super crazy fabrication? Lol


No super crazy fabrication.
The hole drilling in the rail for the injectors is best done on a mill where the rail can be clamped to the movable deck.
The rail ends get threaded for 6an fittings.

The part where you get creative is the two (or three) rail mounts that come up from the intake manifold.
The mounts should come up at an angle in contact with the side of the rail with bolts running through the lower part of the rail into threaded holes in the mount.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #116 by Ramian17 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:23 pm

Nice that doesn't sound too bad. I would love some picks of a stock set up our even a sweet aftermarket set up? So I see the mounts screw into the manifold, and you're saying that the mounts bolt to the rail?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #117 by pmuller9 » Mon Apr 10, 2017 2:49 am

The bosses with the holes that are threaded will be in the wrong location for the short injector.
Grind them off for appearance sake.

First get the new short injectors.
Drill the rail stock to fit the injectors.
Install injectors #1, #3, #4 #6 with the rail onto the intake manifold.
Make two brackets (chunks of aluminum) that bolt to the side of the rail and extends down to intake runners #2 and #5.
The brackets need to be wide enough so the 2 mounting screws straddle the holes for injectors #2 and #5 in the rail.
Curve and angle the brackets other end so it fits the curve of the intake runner and weld them to runners #2 and #5.

Did you get the new turbocharger?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #118 by Ramian17 » Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:30 pm

IMG_20170410_132117120.jpg

IMG_20170410_132122985.jpg

Wooooo hooooo it just came in today!!!! She is beautiful!! I'm acting like a crazy school girl right now!!!! So excited. I hat doesn't sound to bad I should be able to pull that off. Still waiting on pistons though..... :(
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #119 by pmuller9 » Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:53 pm

A Thing of Beauty!!
Can you spin the compressor blades by blowing into the compressor inlet?

Which pistons are on order?
What did you end up with for connecting rods?
Did you order a custom cam from Crower?

I Know, A lot of questions but this is exciting?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #120 by Ramian17 » Mon Apr 10, 2017 6:59 pm

Yep she spins real nice. Not sure where the pistons came from I'll ask the mechanic. But they actually did come in today!!!! He now has everything and will be putting her together this week. Yeeeee haaaaaa!!!! I just went over there and they are super pretty looking!! The rods are forged Chevy rods. I'm pretty sure he used a local cam guy here in Redding but I'll ask about that too. It's definitely a custom ground cam to the specs we talked about earlier. It's all good keep'm coming you've answered way more questions than I have lol. Tell me about it I'm so excited I want my van back real bad!!!!!!!

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #121 by Soldmy66 » Mon Apr 10, 2017 8:03 pm

I noticed that you celebrated receiving your new turbo by having some delicious hummus.

Good call.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #122 by sthorvictor » Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:16 pm

sorry its been awhile just came across this, subscribing! loads of work and exciting progress, curious on the pistons as well! :thumbup:

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #123 by pmuller9 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:56 am

We must have pictures of rods and pistons please!

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #124 by Ramian17 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 11:19 am

Haha copy that I'll get some pics today.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #125 by Ramian17 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:37 pm

Icon pistons and scat rods. He was pretty excited on them he seemed to think that is is going to be a total one off and one heck of a mean machine!!!! I told him that other people have turboed this motor but that u had never seen in a 1966 Econoline lol.
IMG_20170411_100733229.jpg

IMG_20170411_100733229.jpg

IMG_20170411_100626517.jpg
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #126 by pmuller9 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 3:18 pm

I'm Curious?
Those are Scat Pro Stock "I" beam rods.

The Scat 6125 "I" beam Chevy small block rod doesn't show as being available in the Pro Stock series.
Plus the SBC rods have a .940" Bid End width which is smaller than the Ford 300 .994" BE width.

The Scat 6215 Jeep rods have a larger BE width that can be cut down to the Ford 300 BE width.

The Big Bock Chevy rod BE is .992" and can be made with the smaller 2.100" rod journal to work on the Ford 300 crank.

Just wondering what rods those are or did your machinist have custom rods made?
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #127 by Ramian17 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 3:49 pm

I'm not sure but I will ask him that too. This may be a stupid question but will they not work if the BE width isn't correct? What do you think if the pistons? The mechanic was super excited on the Pistons talked them up real good.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #128 by pmuller9 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:03 pm

Ramian17 wrote:I'm not sure but I will ask him that too. This may be a stupid question but will they not work if the BE width isn't correct? What do you think if the pistons? The mechanic was super excited on the Pistons talked them up real good.


The pistons are perfect with the top ceramic thermal coating and the skirt coatings.

The rod BE width with the proper clearance to the crank rod journal width keeps the rods small end centered in the piston and controls oil coming out from the rod bearings on the crank. The clearance is around .015"
You certainly don't want the rod walking side to side any distance on the crank journal

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #129 by Ramian17 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:49 pm

Yeah I figured the wrong size wouldn't be good. That makes me so happy that you like the pistons though.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #130 by PLand1 » Mon May 08, 2017 7:51 pm

Glad to see another Econoline! I have a second gen E100 and I've been thinking about doing this exact same thing for the past year. I haven't really had the time or money to initiate it though. There is a tone of information on this thread that will help me when I do though.

I'm not as committed to keeping the doghouse unmodified (although it would be nice). My idea was actually to use one of those throttle body injection kits on an offenhauser 4 barrel intake and just do a blow through set up. Something like this:

http://fitechefi.com/products/30004/

Do you happen to have the specifications on what was done to your motor? I'm just trying to make a list so that I can start budgeting.

Also, are you using a manual or automatic transmission? And I know y'all were talking about different ignition setups, but I was just thinking of staying with my Pertronix ignition that I installed and just upgrading to an msd blaster coil or something similar. Any thoughts? And how is your progress coming along??

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #131 by pmuller9 » Mon May 15, 2017 10:33 pm

Updates?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #132 by Ramian17 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:43 am

So I finally got my engine block. It has a steel crank, forged rods, forged pistons, roller rockers, hydraulic lifters, custom ground cam, hardened valves, valve seats, and push rods on exuast and intake $$$$$$$$$ I need to install the high flow oil pump which i read isn't that easy. Any advice is always welcome, I don't honestly know but I think I need to get a custom harmonic balancer made, if yes where? I also need a gear to go on the balancer. Can I use all stock 300 parts from a 1990s fuel injected truck for that? Then it will be alternator, high flow water pump and I think that's it. Then off to the master welder for custom header and fuel injected intake. With a turbo attached all under a stock looking dog house!!!!!! Yeeeee haaaaaa
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #133 by Ramian17 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:44 am

IMG_20170612_225809476.jpg
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #134 by PLand1 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:18 am

You shouldn't need a custom harmonic balancer. That's it in the box in the lower pick. These six cylinders are balanced well enough that they don't have the big ones like on the v8s. Your engine builder should have balanced your motor too I would think. Did you ever figure out what pistons and rods you used?

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #135 by Ramian17 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:06 pm

Gotcha yeah I thought that he was going to put the oil pump and the balancer on. I was kinda up set that they weren't on there. I was just so happy to be able to go pick it up. It has been there since the beginning of December. So do I need to take it to a shop and have the balancer put on and balanced? Does the gear for the crank sensor just bolt on the balancer? Can I use a stock gear or do I need a custom one made for my application. Also the balancer I have is from a 240 is that going to matter now that its a 300? They are scat rods and icon pistons. Both forged.
IMG_20170613_070524105.jpg
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #136 by Ramian17 » Sun Jun 18, 2017 1:15 am

Where can I find a nice and tall valve cover for a 240? Needs to fit over roller rockers. I had some cheap chrome valve cover on that was actually hitting the stock rockers that where in there.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #137 by pmuller9 » Sun Jun 18, 2017 2:01 pm

I have a Clifford valve cover for sale.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9fqcb693hbxqe ... 1.JPG?dl=0

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #138 by Ramian17 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 12:37 am

Perfect I want it, how much you want for it? Is it taller than stock? Or taller than the cheap tin chrome valve cover you can get for these motors? Do you know if it will clear roller rockers? Any advice on the high volume oil pump installation? Do you know if I will need a crank sensor aka a gear on the harmonic balancer? Or will a cam sensor be enough? Sorry for the 20 questions game.

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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #139 by Ramian17 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 4:24 pm

So it's official she is %100 ready to go back into the van. Just gotta get some buddies together to help. Does anyone know if both the holes on the driver side that are being pointed at in this pic have oil pressure going to them? I know the hole on the right with a fitting in it, was the oil pressure sensor sender location.

19921.jpeg


Also does anyone know if the upper rear hole that is being pointed at in this pic has coolant being pumped to it? I know that the lower hole with the fitting is the old location for the temp sensor sender.


19919.jpeg

I'm trying to figure out my oil and coolant supply for the turbo. Any ideas?
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #140 by bubba22349 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:12 pm

The two small holes below the blocks side cover go into the block oil passages and will have oil pressure. Look at were your oil pressure senders wire it's white with red stripe is closest to one of those oil passage holes and install the oil pressure sender there you can plug off the other one or use as oil supply for the Turbo. Did you already make an oil return fitting in your oil pan or the lower part of the block for the Turbo drain?

In the bottom picture the larger hole just below the head and at the rear is were your coolant tempature sender is installed the other hole can be plugged off or used as coolant supply for the turbo. Good luck :nod:
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Re: Turbo 240 or 300

Post #141 by Ramian17 » Fri Jul 14, 2017 1:19 am

Awesome thanks bubba22349. What do you think should I use one of those coolant holes for the turbo or tap into one of the coolant hoses? Haha my van had it totally opposite. The rear oil hole had the guage sender plugged into it, and the lower coolant hole had the guage sender plugged into that. The other holes must have been plugged. As long as you are correct that will make the turbo installation way easier. No I haven't put a return hole into the oil pan Im going to wait until the turbo is mounted before I go for that.

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