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Build a hot 200

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xrwagon
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Build a hot 200

Post #1 by xrwagon » Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:09 pm

Ok, as i am confused with these little engines i will outline what i am trying to do, my car is a 1967 XR wagon, original 200 super pursuit with 3 spd manual and 75 series rear. I wanted to upgrade relatively cheaply to hot little six, C4 auto and a 78 series diff. So far i have done this to the car.

Hi-Tech Extractors, 2 1/4 system, Hooker Aeroflow muffler, dumped at diff, i rebuilt the dizzy with all consumable’s replaced, i run Penrite oil, new filters. The original head has been off motor to upgrade to unleaded, so for my mind its probably just got hardened seats installed and guides. I want the wagon to do 14’s over the quarter and over the eighth i would like a sub 10.

I have purchased a Clevo C4, cost me 20 bucks, owes me 38 dollars, i have a 2500 stall and crossflow bell housing, stall is near new, less than 500 k’s, its a 26 spline converter. Ideally i would cam the engine to suit this stall, i looked at Schneider cams and he wants to regrind mine, thus making me think there is a difference in cams somewhere. For this reason i would regrind in Australia, Tighe or Clive or Crow. Only thing is i wanted a solid cam. I was going to do a ACL piston and ring or something recommended by others hear, Sealed power, not sure, only want to bore 20 thou, ARP rod bolts (unsure if i buy clevo or windsor) and balance the lot. Head i was going to go 250 2V but if its cheaper, i may do the log head and have it ported, new valves etc. Or get the 2V head.

I am looking at some six cylinder parts today and depending on what he has i might buy the lot, i know he has the alloy 2v manifold so that i will buy and has a hot crossflow etc, may be able to make some money on the stuff to re-invest in mine. The other idea is to not worry to much about the short motor and buy a turbo, either a XR6 Turbo, wastegate etc and run it through the 350 or 500 carb on an adaptor for head. My mate can get me the steam pipe and can help me dummy it all up and weld it etc. This way, i may be able to crack a quicker time for less than a 1000 bucks of my own money. heck i might even mount the turbo down the back for the ultimate sleeper surprise.

Let the fun begin
1967 XR Wagon Super Pursuit 1968 200/221 Head, Steel Shim headgasket/3spd Man/75 series Borg/Hi-Tech Headers/2.5 Collector 2.25 Hooker Aeroflow dumped at diff. PB 11.74 over Eighth 1/8 Mile

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xctasy
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Re: Build a hot 200

Post #2 by xctasy » Sat Aug 31, 2013 12:13 am

I've scoped these out before, and know that its very easy to screw up an inline Ford 6 when you add a turbo. I've tried to do these kind of engines for a living, and its always hard to get the right info without feeling like your swiming in data. A well sized turbo can make so much power that the stock components start to melt. So can a supercharger.

I think you'd benfit from talking to Broncitis and baldrick, two M90 supercharged cars, one a 200 early Bronco (think six cylinder 2 door Range Rover) and a 250 powered XK Falcon. Each has done the work. And the Turbo, Supercharger and Nitrous forum. viewforum.php?f=22
'
If you are going to turbo it, you'll need to follow hasa68stang and Lincs 200. A few guys have turbo 2V's in Aussie, one chap here has a purple early Falcon XM with 2V 221 and turbo. Others have started, one guy had a green 2V XA and sold it half way through the turbo process, and that's sadly a 90% possibilty that you'll have the same common result, that you won't finish it...Sorry to be blunt, but that's the law of averages with any work on 200 and 250 I6's. For a cam, and carb and exhast, easy. But a turbo is easy to plump up, but very hard to sort out, heck most of us can't even get the ignition right, so adding a turbo just adds an othe layer of complication.

If you want to use the stock C4, you'll have to copy one of hasa68stang's two turbo exhasts.

Run a 2-bbl 500 cfm carb, and read drag200stang and Does10's posts. Also George250.


All of them.

Then go for it. If you going to use the C4 with its high mount starter, then you decide on battery position and turbo fittings to suit the GT3582 turbo, and Evo, Subaru or Isuzu truck intercooling. If you keep boost down to 13 to 16 pounds, it will work well. Copy a combo that works.

Your ignition system will make or break this car, so you need to discuss what type of advance system you are going to use. If your car will see street duty, your total advance timing will have to be very conservative, and your best off using a Clay Smith 264 degree cam. The execption to that is if you are going to move closer to the George250 style of engine, with a very good 2V head, you could then run a bigger cam close to the 291 degree cam with huge lift like he did, and then run port EFI or perhaps just three Holley 2-bbl carbs.

The scope needs to be defined, so I'll let you work that out for yourself.

You then need to look at the Aussie engines that are similar to the American ones, and copy a turbo one that works.

Remember, there are many different Aussie sixes, and your best bet is copying an American set up. After 1968, the Aussie engines started to change, and the American 2v head ends up on a 200 cubic inch engine, so you need to copy those set-ups.

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Having said that, there are some very good non turbo, turbo 200 and 250 custom engines

Examples of two turbo 250 peas in a pod are these guys
see fast64ranchero from Boise ID, viewtopic.php?f=22&t=52695

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and JGTurbo from Portland, Oregon. Its just like fast64ranchero, but going in a '68 Mustang, not a Fox, but you can see the idea of getting a big tall deck turbo 250 six under a low lying hood

see viewtopic.php?f=22&t=54242

and his
Image



Custom sump needed for Fox mustang, okay for any X-shell.

Some of the critical dimensions can be checked out by the US 250 (4.1) swap. This engine is 1.67" taller than the 3.3. Jack Collins and a mate built this up to a Fox 'Stang. See the sump kick? Gotta make sure you can duplicate it on the 4.9.

For the US 250, an AOD, good diffs and fitting it all in should be okay. For a Fox body, you will have to do a hood mod to clear the extra 2 inches of engine height over the little 3.3, which is a little bit futher forward.

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And for the little shallow deck US 200. well its a natural

the Finnish FEP forum member who bought FSP 80Stang's 200 w/ Holley 390 4bbl, CI/CSC 274/110, CI headers + 2.5" exhaust, Duraspark + MSD + Crane, in a '80 Notch back Mustang street car built for some fun in slalom and race track

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http://www.ponikorjaamo.com/ti80/index_repo.htm, with his hot engine project
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XEC Ltd ICBE's Inter Continental Ballistic Engines-
FAZER 6Bi (M112 & EEC5) or FAZER 6Ti (GT3582 & EEC5) 425 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
X-Flow Engine Components Ltd http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10

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xctasy
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Re: Build a hot 200

Post #3 by xctasy » Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:29 am

66Sprint6 is back Yeah!!!!

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=70797&p=542877#p542877

This is one of the most awesome specials around, And Its Still Running!

About 308 hp at the flywheel!
Image
XEC Ltd ICBE's Inter Continental Ballistic Engines-
FAZER 6Bi (M112 & EEC5) or FAZER 6Ti (GT3582 & EEC5) 425 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
X-Flow Engine Components Ltd http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10

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xrwagon
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:21 pm

Re: Build a hot 200

Post #4 by xrwagon » Sun Sep 22, 2013 10:14 pm

Change of direction now, going to cut off a log manifold and make up a injection set up, just been to machine shop to sort it and they have a log head door stop to cut first before doing mine, another guy who is a 6 guru machinist is on holidays at the moment but has done the log off before. I am negotiating a motor sale at the moment, if it goes through i will have a 170 head, been milled and cut off and running mechanical injection, then add the fuel rail and injector boss’s and see what happens. I also have my eye on a little FED dragster so either way i will be doing two motors, so may leave the mech injected motor alone and keep it for the rail. Guy over here has 280hp from a triple carbed log motor, no gas, turbo etc. I have a new stall converter that is 2800 stall and will suit the 409 grind cam i am looking at buying, but first things first, i want go a little quicker next time i race, so head is coming off to be decked and have a 2V flange put on, run the 350 Holley i have and try and sort some decent spark.
1967 XR Wagon Super Pursuit 1968 200/221 Head, Steel Shim headgasket/3spd Man/75 series Borg/Hi-Tech Headers/2.5 Collector 2.25 Hooker Aeroflow dumped at diff. PB 11.74 over Eighth 1/8 Mile

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