Header Wrap vs. Ceramic Coatings

['68falconohio]

Okay, I DO NOT want to put header wrap on mild steel headers because water is bad news bears.

A couple of my buddies had bad luck with high dollar ceramic coatings on their small blocks(bent 8s), the pipes rusted from the inside out.

I plan on buying a stainless steel header from CI when they come out or get a kit of pre-bent stainless pieces if they're cheaper(mandrel bent). I know it's going to take a lot more time but I love welding and I've always wanted to make a header myself. I've built some pure junk headers for derby cars but this will be a completely different animal.

With all this said, I'm thinking of three options.

1.) CI stainless steel header--Ceramic Coated
2.) CI stainless steel header--polish the lower portions myself and header-wrap the rest.
3.) My stainless steel header--polish the lower portions and header-wrap the rest.

I'm willing to shed a few HP if the exhaust gas isn't quite as hot and the engine bay is a little warmer. Will the header-wrap keep the engine bay temp to a tolerable level? Anyone used header wrap and is it effective? I realize I just threw out a bunch of relative terms and these questions are pretty well loaded. I'd like some insight from ya fellas. You've all been extremely helpful in the past.

The main reason I want header wrap is old school / new school look with full stainless exhaust. As soon as I get my stock air cleaner from my dad I'm going to section it up and make it fit the top of my Weber.... It's just a six?! But it looks stock?!...minus those shiny pipes coming off the side there.

Thanks,
Stephen

 

[Gene Fiore]

I have no experience with header wraps, but I had a set of Hooker headers ceramic coated by Jet Hot two years ago and they still look brand new...holding up great. Of course, I'm in Arizona so we don't have the moisture issues others may have. Just my 2 cents.

 

[rbohm]

8) header wrap is effective, but it is bulky and heavy, and unless you get the temperature up for longer than 20 minutes it will retain water that helps cause rusting. a good ceramic coating will last the life of the header, be much lighter, and obviously less bulky. a good shop will also coat the inside of the header as well to prevent rusting from the inside out. it is more expensive though.

 

[AzCoupe]

I have my headers coated by Jet Hot, and they always coat the inside as part of their standard service (no extra charge).

One problem, a lot of guys put ceramic headers on a new motor, not knowing how the carb is tuned. If they run it lean throughout the break-in period, they over heat the headers. This causes the coating to flake and/or crack, which can lead to rust, as well as voiding the warranty. I recommend installing the stock cast manifold during the break-in period. Then after you have everything dialed in, install the headers. It's more work, but certainly worth the extra effort.

We're also coming out with an aluminized dual out exhaust kit, that bolts right up to our headers. The first prototype kit has already been installed, but still needs a bit of tweaking before they are released.

 

[rbohm]

I have my headers coated by Jet Hot, and they always coat the inside as part of their standard service (no extra charge).

8) jet hot is the best

 

['68falconohio]

Thanks everyone.

Has anyone bought anything from here?
Specifically their pre mandrel bent pieces.

If you have a moment, check out their custom header section. It's pretty sweet with the mock-up components to finished product.

I really want to make them myself, and I'm still trying to find the lowest price supplier for mandrel bent pieces. Anyone have suggestions for pieces?

 

[AxeSeth6]

Like another said you do have to heat a wraped system up. My brother raced asphalt sled and wraped them which helped a lot in the small engine compartment. With the Ford six and the intake on the same side as the exhust anything you can do to help the eliminate the heat would help.

 

[Anlushac11]

Thanks everyone.

Has anyone bought anything from here?
Specifically their pre mandrel bent pieces.

If you have a moment, check out their custom header section. It's pretty sweet with the mock-up components to finished product.

I really want to make them myself, and I'm still trying to find the lowest price supplier for mandrel bent pieces. Anyone have suggestions for pieces?

That place has a neat kit where you attach their elbows to PVC pipe and adjust the bends how you want them then tighten the screws at teh elbows to hold them in place then ship it back to them and they can put that in a machine and bend the pipes and make headers to fit.

Columbia River also has tubing.

http://www.mandrel-bends.com/catalog/

 

['68falconohio]

Thanks everyone.

Has anyone bought anything from here?
Specifically their pre mandrel bent pieces.

If you have a moment, check out their custom header section. It's pretty sweet with the mock-up components to finished product.

I really want to make them myself, and I'm still trying to find the lowest price supplier for mandrel bent pieces. Anyone have suggestions for pieces?

That place has a neat kit where you attach their elbows to PVC pipe and adjust the bends how you want them then tighten the screws at teh elbows to hold them in place then ship it back to them and they can put that in a machine and bend the pipes and make headers to fit.

Columbia River also has tubing.

http://www.mandrel-bends.com/catalog/

Thanks Anlushac11,
I remembered a moderator posting a link for tubing and I thought it was you but wasn't sure. The stainless tubing seems to be pretty well priced from stainlessheaders.com, you agree?

That PVC setup was what I was talking about, that's pretty flipping sweet.

I'm going to price a custom header for a six and we'll see what they say. I'd rather built it myself, buying several 180* bends and going from there. It could be interesting, but I should be able to build a stainless header for $250. I've been working out the collectors in my mind and I'm thinking 3 pieces of 1.25" that are angled in to a 2" final diameter. This could get interesting, real fast.

 

[Mustang_Geezer]

We're also coming out with an aluminized dual out exhaust kit, that bolts right up to our headers. The first prototype kit has already been installed, but still needs a bit of tweaking before they are released.

Man....I can hardly wait to see how that comes out! 8)

Later,

 

[fastback69]

I got all my SS exhaust parts from http://www.spdexhaust.com/ . They have pretty good prices and they are quite helpful on the phone as well.

 

[aribert]

I built my own headers, at the time Clifford only had the header that required cutting a hole into the inner fender and JCWhitney only had small six headers for the Econoline. Mine are 3 into 2 into 1.

I bought a cheap header from JCWhitney for the Econoline, cut the tubes off a few inches from the mounting flange. I bought my mandrel bent tubing (mild steel) from JCW also. I used header sleeves (used to align pcs of mandrel bent tubing to keep the ends concentric) from Hooker Headers, my primary tubes are 1 3/8 and the smallest sleeves Hooker sold was 1.5 dia so I had to cut down each sleeve. I Tig welded it at work. I would cut, fit and tack weld a couple of tubes, take it to work and weld it up at lunch and back home to fit up the next segments - took me the better part of one winter. I had the header ceramic coated after I finished it. No weld failures to date (only have about 10K miles on it). Even thought I thought I was meticulus in looking at every thing - I am unable to completely remove the starter without removing the headers (#4 tube should have been bent forward an additional 1/2 to 3/4 inch). And I wished that I had made the number one tube hug the log closer now that I intend to add A/C with the Sanden compressor just below the #1 tube instead of using the '61 specific compressor brkt that hangs the compressor on the left side in fornt of the distributor.

 

[CobraSix]

One problem, a lot of guys put ceramic headers on a new motor, not knowing how the carb is tuned. If they run it lean throughout the break-in period, they over heat the headers. This causes the coating to flake and/or crack, which can lead to rust, as well as voiding the warranty. I recommend installing the stock cast manifold during the break-in period. Then after you have everything dialed in, install the headers. It's more work, but certainly worth the extra effort.

Repeated for impact!

I love my jet hot headers. My only issue is that problem there. I had installed them when I first put the OZ250 head on and the engine leaned out a bit. Wish I had just put the stock manifold on for the break in period. However, the only flaking I have is at the bend in the bottom where the headers have a slight flat spot on the top (Pacemaker Long Tube Dual Headers). The spot hasn't gotten worse in 4 years since I installed them and still look practically new, even in the New England climate (and it has seen rain and snow).

The underhood temperature difference alone was worth it. It's so nice being able to run the car around town for 20 minutes, then stop and make some adjustments without having to put on a thermal suit to get to the carb.

I don't like the wraps for the previously mentioned reasons of hiding rust.

 

[JoeJoe44]

I called jet hot to see how much they would charge me to coat a set of headers and they wanted about $300 to do it.
Not sure if that's in your budget.

 

['68falconohio]

I called jet hot to see how much they would charge me to coat a set of headers and they wanted about $300 to do it.
Not sure if that's in your budget.

Sure isn't, if I decide that I want a ceramic coated header, I will buy it from CI. I'm still very much leaning towards making the header myself which will push me in the direction of stainless steel. With stainless, the water retention of the header wraps are not a big problem.

....I used header sleeves (used to align pcs of mandrel bent tubing to keep the ends concentric) from Hooker Headers, my primary tubes are 1 3/8 and the smallest sleeves Hooker sold was 1.5 dia so I had to cut down each sleeve.....

Thanks aribert, I had never see those before.

I got all my SS exhaust parts from http://www.spdexhaust.com/ . They have pretty good prices and they are quite helpful on the phone as well.

Thanks, I need to call them for pricing and see how competitive they are with the other suppliers I found.