Weird running problem.

A

Anonymous

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This has got me confused, maybe someone here knows what I'm doing wrong. Car is a 61 Falcon, 144/auto/manual choke. Rebuilt the 1 brl Holley awhile back, due to it leaking and wouldn't run with no choke. Got that rebuilt and it ran great, but still had to run the choke 1/4 way out. Open it up and the car would shudder and instantly die. So I drove it awhile with the choke at 1/4, car would crank right up, idle, ran smooth,etc. Well I've been trying to figure out why it wouldn't run with the choke off so I checked for vacuum leaks. No leaks anywere, checked all lines with a vaccum pump. As for the carb I've sprayed it with WD-40 and Either, and no leaks around it either. Only thing I found wrong was the vaccum advance was no good. Replaced that, car ran the same as it had before, no weaker no stronger. After that I checked the timing and dwell. Dwell was 69 and timing was 6 degrees with vaccum advance unhooked and plugged. So I set the Dwell to 40 and bumped the timing to 10 degrees. Hooked it all back up set the idle speed and tried it. Still wouldn't run with the choke off, and had lost "alot" of power. :( Didn't crank as easy either. So I wound the fast idle screw all the way tight (runs wide open unless the choke is off) and the car runs without the choke now and has more power than ever, but now it sounds like it has a cam in it and dies when I stop. Now what?!?! Sorry for the long post, but I'm out of ideas.
 
HEY THUNDER


.....WHEN YOU RAN THE SCREW ALL THE WAY IN YOU MORE THAN LIKELY OPENED THE BUFFERFLY ON THE CARB. TOO MUCH. THIS WILL GIVE FULL ADVANCE TO THE DIST. AND THIS WILL GIVE YOU THE PROBLEM YOU HAVE. TRY RUNNING THE SCREW BACK IN.... BUT ONLY UNTIL THE SHUTTERING STOPS.

.....BEFORE YOU DO THAT.... CHECK YOUR TIMING WITH THE VACUUM STILL HOOKED UP. IT SHOULD BE THE *10 YOU HAD SET IT AT. YOU WILL PROBABLY BE +*35. THIS WOULD GO AS HIGH +*55 WHEN STOPPING. THAT WOULD KILL THE MOTOR.

LIVE IN GRACE

LEROY POLL
 
Ok so here's an update. went out this morning, fired it up checked the timing and it wasn't anywere near 10* like yesterday, got to looking and I hadn't unhooked my vacuum advance. Unhooked that, still no change. :x Noticed my vacuum port on the carb, was barely sucking. So I decided to start from the top. Pulled the bowl to check the float, and noticed alot of dirt, so I cleaned the carb out, put a new filter on the line and re-assembled. Everything looked good. Reset my timing back to 10* and started it up. So here is were I am now:
1. I can take out the idle mixture screw to no effect. Turn it all the way in with no effect. I can spray carb cleaner in it when it's out and the engine dies down.
2. Vacuum port on carb still barely sucks any. I haven't hooked my vacuum guage up yet though. Can spray carb cleaner in this port and it also makes the engine die down.
3. Took it for a little test drive anyways, ran ok, didn't stall out. Felt a bit down on power. On my way back, it died. While trying to fire itback up, it popped a few times. So I'm thinking timing. Pull the cap and the rotor was off the shaft. :devilish: :idea: Got that back on, fired right back up, but I looked down and my choke was all the way open. :shock: Now it idles kinda rough, but it will idle for a little while with the choke open, which it never would before. Has good power with choke open too, just won't idle smooth.
 
THUNDERGUNS71

.....YOU SHOULD HAVE NO VACUUM TO THE DIST. AT IDLE. YOU HAVE THE BUTTERFLY IN THE CARB. OPENED TOO MUCH. AJUST THE IDLE LINKAGE SCREW BACK TO WHERE THEIR IS NO VACUUM OR LOW VACUUM AT IDLE.

.....INSIDE THE CARB. THERE IS A SMALL HOLE THAT IS COVERED UP AT IDLE. WHEN IT IS MISS AJUSTED YOU WILL GET VACUUM. THIS VACUUM IS STRONG MANIFOLD VACUUM AND WILL JUMP THE ADVANCE TO AROUND *40 AT IDLE.

.....MANY ON THIS SIGHT HAVE RUN INTO THIS. THIS IS A BALANCED SYSTEM. THE CARB. AND THE DIST. ARE MATCHED TO EACH OTHER. THEY DO NOT WORK AS OTHER SYSTEMS. THIS SYSTEM WORKS ON THE IDEA THAT THE LOAD OF THE MOTOR WILL GIVE THE DIST. A SIGNAL TO WHERE THE ADVANCE SHOULD BE. IT WILL WORK WELL IF AJUST CORRECTLY.

.....DO THIS, PUT YOUR IDLE SCREW BACK IN AND TURN IT OUT ABOUT 3 TURNS FROM STOP. UNHOOK VACUUM. SET THE IDLE ADJUSTMENT SCREW, THAT IS ON THE LINKAGE TO THE CHOKE, BACK TO WHERE THE MOTOR WILL IDLE LOWER. THIS WILL BRING YOUR IDLE CIRCUT BACK AND A GOOD STARTING POINT. HOOK YOUR VACUUM BACK UP AND YOU SHOULD SEE ABOUT *10 ADVANCE AT IDLE. THE SCREW AT THE BASE OF THE CARB. IS YOUR IDLE CIRCUT ADJUSTMENT SCREW (THE ONE YOU TOOK OUT).....ADJUST YOUR IDLE CIRCUT FOR SMOOTH IDLE. HOPE THIS CLEARS THINGS UP.

LIVE IN GRACE

LEROY POLL
 
Well I think I found out my problem with the timing. My rotor button doesn't fit right. It has atleast an 1/8th" play on the shaft. In fact I can't find a rotor that fits tight on it anywere. I've checked all the major auto parts suppliers and they all give me the same one. I guess I got to get that fixed first, then I'll try what you said,

Thanks,
Sean
 
Those clips seem to be one of those non existent parts. I once got one at a tractor dealer. Also had luck with a few wraps of teflon thread sealing tape.
 
Take the rotor off, it's probably on there. Bend the tab. But yeah, your fast idle screw is open tooo far. Shut it some and richen it up a little and you'll be a-ok. The idle mixture screw won't affect anything if that's open too much. Don't forget, you ALWAYS mess with the timing FIRST, carb LAST. I'd start from ground one and try and make sure that the timing is perfect with vacuum disconnected, and that the carb is set to factory specs. Also, if you have points, swap to a pertronix, right away. =)
 
thunderguns71":3fq9biq9 said:
So I set the Dwell to 40 .
Click to expand...

If your still running the points isn't 40 to much dwell ?? :shock:
Shouldn't it be like 28 to 32 deg. dwell???

How fast is your Idle?? it should be like 650 to 750 rpm's...
When the mixture screw doesn't do anything it is usualy
1) vacuum leak
2) idle to fast and is past the idle curcit..
3) pluged up ports in the carb.

CHANGING DWELL WELL CHANGE THE TIMMING SO IF YOU RESET THE DWELL THEN RECHECK THE TIMMING
RPM WELL EFFECT TIMMING AS WELL.

Set Idle to 650 - 750 rpm
the turn mixture screw in or out to acheve smothest idle (should start at about 1 1/2 turns out from lightly seated)
reset Idle and redo mixture screw may need to do this a couple of times.

good luck, keep us posted
tim
 
Sorry for the delay in posting. I just got the clip the other day finally and the weather here isn't letting me work on it much. I'm going to try to work on it this week and post some results. :)
 
Ok I messed with it some awhile ago, I got the dwell set at 35* and the timing at 10* with vacuum advance unpluged. I'm still pulling vacuum from the vacuum advance port on the carb though, So now what do I do?
 
I'll check on the vaccum and compression the next time I get out to it. As far as the transmission, its the stock Ford-o-Matic instead of a C4.
 
Well I checked the vacuum from the carb and done a compression check, guess it's just seen better days lol. Done the compression test with all plugs out and throttle open.

Vacuum= 9.5"
1 110
2 120
3 100
4 95
5 115
6 105
 
Mine has a 272 cam and a C4 trans. In park the vacuum is 11-13, most people are around 14-16. I think your time is way to low. Put it at 12-16 BTDC and vacuum should be in the 14-16. Keep us informed.
 
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