200ci Mods\upgrades and a reality check.

[andrewdrexler]

Ok, I am in the midst of planning engine upgrades and modifications to my 200 CI 65 Mustang coupe. I need a small reality check as to the possibility\feasibility of the following upgrades.

This is what I have planned:
Long headers with dual exhaust.
Offenhauser 3 carburetor setup.
Bergstrum Power Steering
Factory AC
Pertronix ignition
Electric fan with aluminum radiator
T-5 transmission (or an automatic with AOD for those long freeway cruises).

My engine is a bone stock 200 CI that was built in 1995 or so (I don’t have the paperwork from the previous owner so I don’t know the specifics about the block off hand). My intention is to give it a little eye candy under the hood while increasing comfort while driving. This won’t be a daily driver by a long shot, just something fun for the weekends and road trips.

So is this combination of mods even possible? Do they take up the same real estate in the front of the engine (specifically the power steering pump and stock AC system)? Or do I need to trim back my expectations and plans to something less ambitious?

 

[MustangSix]

The factory AC system with the York compressor is a large, power sucking beast. Newer Sanden compressors are smaller, lighter and more efficient.

Same for the original PS pump. If you adapt the brackets, the new GM type 2 pumps are very small, quiet, and efficient. They also lend themselves better to a remote reservoir.

All of it should easily fit under the hood.

 

[andrewdrexler]

The only reason I am using the stock AC system is that I was able to pick it up for a song on CL last month. I was considering going with a Vintage Air system, but all of those dollar signs made me think twice. I might see if I can relist the system on a vintage mustang site and see if I can get what I have in it back and just go with the orginal plan. Those Sandens look sweet if that does not pan out though.

That is a tiny GM power steering pump, and they are actually pretty cheap new. I have the feeling that a run to the junkyard will be in order to harvest one in the near future. Any idea of what vehicles I should be looking at to harvest one from?

 

[rocklord]

You can still use the stock AC system pieces and just upgrade the compressor. There are adapters that allow for the Sanden unit to be attached to the stock mount.

As for transmissions, the T-5 can be used with the 200 but not an AOD, unless you have a 200 with a low mounted starter.

 

[82F100]

I see you have the Pertronix on your list I would think that the DSII upgrade would probably be a better choice in the long run.

 

[MPGmustang]

the 3 carb setup, not very fun for a long haul per say, I think you might be happier with a 2bbl IMHO. Reason being is that it's much easier to maintain, tune-up, and keep running in max efficency. th 3x1bbl setup is great and give the power that most stock lack. but from this forum it's a pita to tune, and as your only looking to enjoy the car I fear you might be under the hood most of the time you want to drive it. Also when going headers you'll have to 'make' your own progressive links as the kit won't clear the header.

I would go the GM PSP, looks small!
I have Vintage Air, it's a great system but it's a pita to install. ALL the hoses are connected INSIDE the cab, so if I ever have to replace a hose the entire underdash system must come out. Classic Auto Air (for $50 more) has all the connections in the engine bay, right up against the firewall. A much better design, if I did it agian I would go with Classic Auto Air. I have heard using the old AC box with a sanden compressor isn't as effecient as most would think when compared to the kit. as the sanden took the place of my alt, and moved the alt up, I had to extend the alt out 1.5 inches from where the relocated it to. the comes the factor of how close my AC hoses are to the header. but it's all possible and my system works great.

I agree with the pertronix, it's $100 for our 6cyl's, where as replacement parts for the DSII is 20-40 at the counter, so if you need a replacement part down the road you're forking more $$$ away with the pertonix. in the long run the DSII is cheaper (even than the DUI) in replacement parts.

I have the t-5, electric fan with alum rad, sanden AC, 2bbl, header, and the DUI in my engine bay, the passenger side looks packed and I need more things on the drivers side LOL. So yes it all fits in my 65 coupe just fine.

 

[MustangSix]

Those PS pumps are on everything GM and most Jeeps and Chryslers too. I guess Saginaw cranks them out for everyone.

Speedway motors sells them for the race cars, but you can get them in any parts store. Just ask for something like a 98 Camaro.

 

[chad]

"...Those PS pumps are on everything GM and most Jeeps..."
So they'd wrk with big tires? Jack?

I like the sm sz (wuz thinkin of an upgrade to a 'caned ham") my OEM is shot. '98 Camaro, eh...

Fella round here wuz lookin in the engine bay of a Rolls and remarked "hey why's Rolls Royce got a Saginaw?" and the owner replied "Why attempt to improve on perfection?"

Thanks,

 

[andrewdrexler]

Thank you everyone for the advice and suggestions.

Rocklord: I am pretty sure that I have a high mount starter. It looks like its pretty far up on the engine. I will have to check to be 100% sure tomorrow when I get home from work at 6am. Do you know of any vehicles the Sanden compressor is used in? Also, while I am at the junkyard, should I be pulling the steering box, rag joint and steering column while I am it so that everything will work together? The Borgeson conversion set is about 1k, it would hurt my wallet a lot less to salvage a power steering setup over buying new.
82f100: The DS2 sounds like the way to go then. Mustangs Monthly is always raving about the Pertronix system, so I figured that was the way to go. Since I am going the restomod route though, I don’t need it to look concourse correct (and MM is WILD about perfect restorations).
MPGMustang: I had not realized that the progressive linkage would interfear with the headers. When I saw JDN2158’s setup, it looked like the linkage cleared the headers w\o any issues. I will have to re-read his thread and see if he mentioned it. As for the tuning issues, from what I have read (and gleamed talking to old school hot rodders) the results are mixed. Some say once it’s tuned it works great, others say it is a pain to keep tuned. Since I just want some eye candy and some ZOOM ZOOM from the setup, it probably won’t matter if it’s PERFECTLY tuned as long as it’s close.
MustangSix: Great. I will start a junkyard crawl this weekend and see what I can find.

 

[MPGmustang]

also it's not just the linkage to the carbs, it's also that the mechanical linkage for the gas pedal won't clear the header. for a while I ran with a bent linkage bar, but if I floored it, it would then pop off , very annoying in stoplight-stoplite traffic. I have head of some people using a locar cable , but don't know how they set it up.

don't get me wrong, I do like the 3x1, I sometime wihs I had it...

 

[wsa111]

I think you would be better with 1 carburetor via a direct mount. The correct autolite or a holley will more than be adaquate to give you decent performance.

I have yet to see a post on a tricarb setup with close to presise jetting for the average guy to duplicate.

As i have said many times you can guess at the proper jetting or you can nail it down with a wideband A/f tester.

For your build i would lean toward a single carb which has a proven track record.

Best of luck on your project, the information you have received is by the best of the best. Bill

 

[chad]

you can nail it down with a wideband A/f tester
I guess that's an O2 sensor placed in a bung welded in the exhaust (where is best spot?) hooked up with some kinda 'reader'. Can you help w/what is used for the 'reader' and which sensor is recommended?
Thanks for your "time & talent" (no "treasure" to contribute right now but for future info).

 

[rocklord]

I guess that's an O2 sensor placed in a bung welded in the exhaust (where is best spot?) hooked up with some kinda 'reader'. Can you help w/what is used for the 'reader' and which sensor is recommended?
Thanks for your "time & talent" (no "treasure" to contribute right now but for future info).

The most popular is the Innovate LC-1 Wideband O2 that includes a digital gauge. It costs around $200 and can be found on Fleabay.

 

[chad]

Innovate LC-1 Wideband O2 that includes a digital gauge

Cool, thanks Dan. No wonder they call it "innovative". I seen em talk bout it here & on my ford truck site. Know where to tap the exhaust in my unmodified I6?
Thanks, yet 1 more time again...