223cid Slow revving problem...

[Drumhead_Dan]

I'm using a later(65) model autolite carb. I picked up a really sweet early model oil bath air cleaner at a junk yard near here, I think it was off a 59 one barrel holly. I'll grab a pic in the morning.

The vacuum readings I posted are test stand standards for amount of vacuum coming from the spark valve. Manifold vacuum is much higher than that.

The fitting looks like a packing nut with a built in ferrel. I'll ask at the parts house what they are called, I just showed them what I wanted.

 

[59F100]

...The fitting looks like a packing nut with a built in ferrel. ...

Are you using a rigid vacuum line?

Picture of your air cleaner would be welcomed. Thanks.

 

[Drumhead_Dan]

I bought rigid brake line the same size as the fittings, but I haven't installed it yet. I just made a rubber jumper till I line some more stuff out.

Edit: All of the originals were rigid.

 

[Drumhead_Dan]

I know I said it was a sweet oil bath, it just looks a little worn on the paint on the outside; its clean as a whistle on the inside.

Got some better wheels and tires put on today. Paint and interior coming soon. The PCV addon may or may not work, I was just trying to do my bit for the environment.

 

[59F100]

I know I said it was a sweet oil bath, it just looks a little worn on the paint on the outside; its clean as a whistle on the inside.
...Got some better wheels and tires put on today. Paint and interior coming soon. The PCV addon may or may not work, I was just trying to do my bit for the environment.

Thanks for the pictures. I need to find one of those air cleaners.

 

[59F100]

Well...not much progress, but I managed to get back on it for a little bit and my #4 cylinder is not firing. Pulled the plug and it is soaked with oil.

Cleaned it and it still wouldnt fire ....swapped plug wires and it still wouldnt fire, so I either have a bad plug or a bad cap.

As far as the bog goes, I checked the dwell again while revving it and the dwell remains rock solid at all times so I think the distributor is good (not worn).
On a whim, I advanced the distributor and it became much more responsive at idle (even on 5 cylinders) so I took it for a drive and it ran like a turd. Sputtering, coughing, etc...Turned around and limped back home.

Gonna do that compression test today and put some new plugs in. I have a feeling that things will look worse before they start to look better. My valve train has a squeek and I think there is a knock in the lower end somewhere....I'll keep you all posted.

 

[Drumhead_Dan]

The valve train needs to be periodically adjusted on these, hopefully its just a tight rocker. The Ford manual says the valves need to be checked every eight thousand miles(I'm sure every owner of a 223 ran to the Ford garage every 8k to get this done *sarcasm*). Unleaded fuel is the bane of un-hardened valve seats.

It sounds like your timing is too advanced.

This cold firing ignition system won't clean a fouled plug.

Tech specs on the 223 call for cylinder preassure@sea level to be 130-170, with tolerances up to 20 psi between them. If you have a low cylinder a squirt of oil or two into the plug hole and retesting will indicate if its the valves or the rings.

I had a cousin with one of these when I was a kid, and I know for a fact they will run blowing smoke out of every hole for years so take it for what its worth. How well is another question.

Here's some stuff you can check while you're in there.

Manifold vacuum is listed as minimum 18 inches in neutral@sea level.(mostly valves)
Hot oil preasure at 2000 rpm should be 35-55 psi.(mostly lower end)

Valve lash is listed as:
Cold:
Both .019
Hot:
Both .018
*edit*
Where did you get the .012 spec?


After re-reading everything posted here, you said your idle air adjustments didn't seem to do anything after a certain point. That typically means a vacuum leak to me. Idle air affects throttle response coming off idle, so I typically start with the one and half turns out from stop and then turn in the air adjustment screw in quarter turn increments until I get the best throttle response(how well it gooses). It really won't set properly until its very warmed up(like twenty minutes at idle) and I had to reset mine once I found an air cleaner. Once you have all this, then idle down again, and repeat with 1/8th turns until you get the best response at the lowest idle you can get. Repeat until you get down to just nudging the screw. You can choke off the carb intake a little with your hand to simulate a little more suction to see how it changes(like an air cleaner would). After you get the air set an oscilating idle is probably a vacuum leak that can be checked with carb cleaner sprayed around every connection(carb cleaner does the same as starting fluid, the idle will go up). The "correct" method of setting the idle is to get max rpm, then out one quarter to one half turn if I remember correctly. Hopefully if I'm wrong somebody here can correct me. This is essentially to get a max lean condition then enrich the mix a little to keep from hurting anything. Modern cars use a oxygen sensor to do this with exhaust gas temp, but it amounts to the same thing.

Hopefully this helps. All the spec's come from the 1964 Ford Shop Manual.

 

[59F100]

The 0.012 spec was a guess at the time. I havent gone back and adjusted them but I have only had a few hours of run time (mostly parked) on the motor since.

I'll post compression results tonight if I can get on it. It is not stored at my house so working on it is somewhat inconvenient for the time being. Plus I have a 2yo running around the house... she is a handful.

Thanks for the info.

 

[texas_rat_trap]

I have an old oil bath air cleaner you can have for the cost of shipping thats in very good shape. Don't know if it has PCV cuz it being a 1953 model but would look SWEET and I know it fits 1 & 2 barrel carbs.

 

[Drumhead_Dan]

I'll get the older(read as painted) one off of Tex, you can have my newer one

 

[texas_rat_trap]

I'll get the older(read as painted) one off of Tex, you can have my newer one

I'll let ya'll two figure that one out. I want to see a pic of the, 59 F-100, thats one of my favorite years besides my '48 F-100.

 

[59F100]

I have an old oil bath air cleaner you can have for the cost of shipping thats in very good shape. Don't know if it has PCV cuz it being a 1953 model but would look SWEET and I know it fits 1 & 2 barrel carbs.

It's not the one off your motor is it?? Where would that leave you? What's the story on that motor in the picture? Looks good...

I definitely in need of one (air cleaner). I dont have any PCV equipment.

PM Sent

EDIT: You can view the '59 pics here... http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t190 ... rd%20F100/

 

[59F100]

My one and only other thread, with some of the same pictures, is here along with some background on the truck...
http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=54196

Do these threads go on forever or will it add a page? I may have to start a new thread....getting tired of scrolling all the way down the page everytime I visit this discussion...

 

[texas_rat_trap]

that was the old 215cid...I recently installed this 223cid with lots of modification & cannot use the oil bath air cleaner will not fit under hood. Love the truck by the way nice '60's style slotted mags definitely keep them. Now you just need to give the truck a lower center of gravity, just my opinion though. that model truck is just begging to be air bagged...if your into that kind of thing.

 

[texas_rat_trap]

Damn Bro just noticed in the pic.'s.... is that a 3 car garage? Lucky!

 

[59F100]

That is actually my wife's grandparents' house. I dont have room at my house

I wish I had a three car garage...that one in the pic doesnt have but one useable stall. The rest is jam packed full of useless crap.

Thanks for the compliments. I opted to keep the mags the moment I saw them. Just got four new black wall tires so the white walles are gone. Never lowered anything much less owned an air bag car. This truck needs to drop in the front slightly I think.

That 223 looks very nice. How well does something like that run over the previous 215 set-up?

 

[texas_rat_trap]

That is actually my wife's grandparents' house. I dont have room at my house

I wish I had a three car garage...that one in the pic doesnt have but one useable stall. The rest is jam packed full of useless crap.

Thanks for the compliments. I opted to keep the mags the moment I saw them. Just got four new black wall tires so the white walles are gone. Never lowered anything much less owned an air bag car. This truck needs to drop in the front slightly I think.

That 223 looks very nice. How well does something like that run over the previous 215 set-up?

Well...I don't know how well its gonna run yet b/c of carb issues I'm having but from what I've been told it shouldn't have a problem scootin' down the road. As far as lowering the front down a little on the truck I dont know is it straight axle?

 

[59F100]

well it's not exactly "straight"....but it is one solid beam. Not independent front suspension...

 

[texas_rat_trap]

well it's not exactly "straight"....but it is one solid beam. Not independent front suspension...

Hope I don't get runned off for being off topic but in my opinion the best way to lower the truck would be a dropped front straight axle and should beable to order to the specific amount of drop your tryin' to achieve and since the axle is bent anyways just get a drop axle and far as the rear not familliar with driveline on these trucks but if its leaf spring just get drop blocks and if it has springs get shorter springs but either way you need to get shocks to compensate for the shorter travel. My car I heated the springs and they say thats not the correct way to do it but rides fine..mines dropped 3" all around...everything looks better slammed in my book.

 

[fmartin_gila]

Several ways to drop the front, Dropped axle - contact Steve at Industrial Chassis in Phoenix, Mono leaf springs, removing various number of leafs from stock spring, and reversing the eye on the end of the main leaf. On the rear, the spring is on top of the axle, therefore blocks will raise the vehicle. You can move and reverse the spring hanger on the frame, get longer shackles, remove a leaf or two from the spring pack, or go with a link type setup. You will have things to consider if and when lowering, the Caster Angle on the front axle has to be compensated for, and the Steering Drag Link Ange may or may not cause objectionable bump steer. On the rear, you will have to be concerned about the Pinion Angle, as you will be changing the angle position between the engine/tranny combo and the differential. Just things to consider while contemplating lowering. Do some serious homework before jumping.

Come over and join us at FordTruk.com. We are a group huddled around the early 60s pickups, but your pickup and the next series were almost identical except for the style. There is a lot of info over there and there are some members who have seriously lowered their rides.

Fred