Engine Family Question

[Peterproject]

Hi All - can anyone help with an identification issue I have?

My 1964 F-100 from the Warranty plate should be a 3 on the tree, obviously somethings changed in the past because its now a floor mounted 4 speed, when I checked the engine casting numbers I found the following set of codes : 3G5 (casting date) and 3CAF 6015 AC (block identifier), from the remnants of blue paint I suspect this motor started life in a car, I can't find any info on "F" the engine group.

Anyone have any ideas? - Thanks Peter

 

[manglass]

The truck is 60 years old. Lots of things could have changed over the years. Is it a truck or car 4 speed? I do think it might be the original engine though. The date code matches up with an early 1964 product and C3AE 6015 AC seems to match up with most later 223's I've heard of regardless of chassis. I think your "F" is probably an "E" with the bottom missing or so faint that it can't be easily seen. Ford tended to save to "T" for engines that were specific to trucks, like the 262.

Lou Manglass

 

[Peterproject]

The truck is 60 years old. Lots of things could have changed over the years. Is it a truck or car 4 speed? I do think it might be the original engine though. The date code matches up with an early 1964 product and C3AE 6015 AC seems to match up with most later 223's I've heard of regardless of chassis. I think your "F" is probably an "E" with the bottom missing or so faint that it can't be easily seen. Ford tended to save to "T" for engines that were specific to trucks, like the 262.

Lou Manglass

Hello Lou - looks as though you are right the bottom of the E was damaged, I can't tell if its the original motor or not, what would be the difference between a car and truck 4 speed? Thanks Peter

 

[manglass]

Hello Lou - looks as though you are right the bottom of the E was damaged, I can't tell if its the original motor or not, what would be the difference between a car and truck 4 speed? Thanks Peter

If the shifter comes out of the top of the transmission, it's from a truck. Car transmissions from that era had seperate shifters with the external linkage down the side of the transmission. I only asked to try to narrow down whether an engine swap took place. If it has side mounts on the bellhousing, swapping a transmission would be fairly easy. Is the column shift linkage still in place?

Lou

 

[Peterproject]

Hi Lou - the shift comes strait out of the gearbox, a hole has been hacked in the floor to get the stick through, the 3 speed is a mess with the linkage removed and the lever missing, the housing just goes round and round on the column.
Is the 4 speed a good transmission? would the clutch be 10" or 11" do you know?
I'm planning to fit a new telescopic/tilt column when I fit the power steering conversion, the PS system I've gone for keeps the original tie rod and drag link but has a a power steering box, the pump is driven from a twin groove pulley on the alternator.
When I start work on the truck I'll keep a pictorial record of the truck's progress, it may be of use to someone.
Peter

 

[manglass]

I don't know which 4 speed it is but I don't know of any older truck 4 speeds that aren't rugged and durable. It undoubtedly has the low "crawler" first gear which isn't much use until you need it. Most of the time you will be starting off in second. As far as clutch, I don't really know of a way to determine diameter without taking it out, especially since it may not have the original transmission in it.

Lou

 

[Peterproject]

Thanks Lou

 

[Frank]

Hi Lou - the shift comes strait out of the gearbox, a hole has been hacked in the floor to get the stick through, the 3 speed is a mess with the linkage removed and the lever missing, the housing just goes round and round on the column.
Is the 4 speed a good transmission? would the clutch be 10" or 11" do you know?
I'm planning to fit a new telescopic/tilt column when I fit the power steering conversion, the PS system I've gone for keeps the original tie rod and drag link but has a a power steering box, the pump is driven from a twin groove pulley on the alternator.
When I start work on the truck I'll keep a pictorial record of the truck's progress, it may be of use to someone.
Peter

Peter, be glad you don't have the column shift or the PS and column conversion would be difficult/impossible. I don't know if 1964 had the same issue as the '79 model, but on my '79 when I went to PS from factory manual steering, the steering box was not the same. Correct box, but the PS box is 2" taller- I.E. closer to the steering column. Required removing and cutting the column, the steering shaft and the 3-speed column shift tube, plus trans linkage modifications. A huge PITA project. . The point is, check the dimensions on the PS box compared to the MS box before ordering your new column, the length may be different.

Also, I agree with Low Manglass- your 4-speed trans is all but indestructible, a keeper IMO.