I am DIZZY!!

[66Sprinter]

I was considering a PonyCarb swap of my Autolite1100 and spent a good hour talking with Kurt at the PC shop. My engine is stock..except for pertronix..clean gas (4.5 psi to the carb) and an open air cleaner - I will add headers in the new future and this will have to hold me until a complete rebuild. My only current problem is the typical rough idle problems when hot on restart. The rough idle goes away after a mile or two of driving. Here is a recap of our conversation;

He first suggested that I reset my timing by ear. Do not use a light! and adjust to the fastest stable RPM then back down the idle screw to a 900rpms. Test drive then tweak out the ping. Switch to the highest octane gas..super reg or premium. Double check the vacum at the manifold (20.5) and plug all leaks. Look to the dizzy and if possible get a rebuilt recurved original one and then repeat the above process. If not satisfied then a rebuilt carb might be in order. He states the new 1100's are THE BEST carb's for the 200's and that the PC carbs have all the circuit problems corrected. Advises against the use of a Holley 1946 or even a 2bbl unless serious engine mods were made first.

After I slept on this info..I see some good things but I also see some confusion, especially when compared to the info gained for the posts here in the forum about fellow carb upgrades. So now to my questions. (1) What does a recurve on the orignial dizzy do for me? and (2) Any experiences with Pony Carbs you can share!

Thanks in advance...Jim

 

[CobraSix]

Well, about the carbs. Pony Carb does make a great 1100 carb. I have one...all the typical problems of the 1100 are gone, just like he said. Well worth the money if you are keeping the engine stock.

As far as if the 1100 is the best over any other carbs, including the 2V carbs being used...I don't know. Personally, I would go with people here who have actual experiences with building up a 200. Most people out there don't know a lot about getting performance out of a 200.

As far as the other advice, I'm curious what other problems you have. The hot start problems sound like the carb needs a rebuild. The RPMs he says to set at seems high, but I can't remember if you have a automatic or manual. My idle is set at around 650. High Octane fuel needed? I don't know. Are you having problems? I usually run 89 octane and my car runs fine.

Slade

 

[66Sprinter]

I have a T5 manual...and really no other driveability problems...and I have been on the short city and long cruises. On a long drive of about 1hr+ I may get the rough idle when I pull off the highway and begin hitting the stop signs.

 

[Anonymous]

I have a Pony Carb as well. I also spoke with Kurt, he told me essentially the same thing. I am in a similar state...200 stock sans Pertronix. The carb is great, and the method of timing and carb adjustment is right on, however, I dis-agree with him on the fact that the Autolite 1100 is the best carb for the stock 200. Even though Pony has worked out most of the kinks in the 1100 it is far from perfect, and I continue to have the same rough idle problem you describe (even with a Pony 1100). 900 RPMs is high. I idle around 650 when warmed up in drive. Yours being a T5 you might want 700 max in nuetral when warm. I might also add that I run premium gas 91 octane.


Bill

 

[cdherman]

Here goes. Sounds like you are having prblems with your advance and that means you need to really pay attention to what you've got for a dizzy and carb.

The early 1100 carbs were designed around a concept called Loadomatic. The carb produces a combination of throttle body AND venturi vacuum. As you may know, under certain situations the manifold vacuum may fall (WOT, partial throttle under load) and thus the advance from the dizzy (if its a vacuum only unit) may fall. Ford attempted to remedy this by providing venturi vacuum when the manifold vacuum falls.

The spark control valve on the carb controls whether vanturi versus manifold vacuum goes to the dizzy. Now, heres the problem. The whole setup costs quite a bit of vacuum, so the dizzy must be specially built for a loadomatic (read 1100) carb. It uses a max of about 7 inch vacuum, versus the more typical 15 or so from a conventional dizzy using manifold, or throttle body vacuum.

Around 65 and 66 Ford started to give up on loadomatic and began to switch to a dual advance type dizzy. By dual, I do NOT mean dual vacuum hookups. Dual as in centrifugal (mechanical) and vacuum both. These dizzys began to be used first in conjunction with the Thermactor smog pumps (though they are NOT interrelated, as far as I know). Thus the later, dual advance, single vacuum hookup dizzys are often listed as "with thermactor". But you do not need a thermactor to use them.

Once Ford switched to the dual advance, higher vacuum dizzy, the carbs were slightly redesigned. The casting retains an unthreaded hole where the spark control valve wqs, but the internals are different. The vaccum to the dizzy is higher, in the 15 range. The later dizzy has a "C" shaped shaft that is slightly springey. The loadomatic is a "D" shape, but filled in, solid shaft. With the loadomatic, you can see the spings laying on top of the plate.

Do you have a thermactor or was one on the engine originally? Do you know what I mean by a spark control valve? The valve is back of, and below the vacuum line out of the carb. You should either see a gizmo screwed into the carb, or you will have the blind, unthreaded hole.

Running a "mixed" system will either give you too much advance too soon, or too little vacuum advance, too late. Depends on which of the two is mismatched.

As an aside, there was one more dizzy that came before Ford switched to electronic with the duraspark. This was also a dual (vacuum and mechanical) advance unit, but it had two vacuum lookups. One, in the center, advances the spark. The other vacuum hookup retards the spark. It worked with the smog equipment to retard the spark under come circumstances to improve emissions. You CAN use these, by leaving the second, outer vacuum hookup unhooked. But it may be harder to adjust and is a less preferred setup.

Bad news for you too -- if your dizzy is the old type and the carb is the newer, then swaping the dizzy will be a problem, as your Pertronix will no longer fit. Bummer...

IF anyone knows that anything I have asserted here is wrong PLEASE speak up. I have learned all this in the last couple of months, and its possible that I may be wrong about some details. But I hope not......

 

[66Sprinter]

I will be checking my dizzy later in the week when I get back to STL. However, your comments bring up the quest for the right dizzy for the 200. I know alot of guys here have already switched to the Duraspark..is that really the final cure for the dizzy problem..and will the Dspark system work with the 1100...or is a carb upgrade in the works to complete this?

 

[Anonymous]

I can't speak for Jammer, but I have matched my dizzy & carb. I have the later model dizzy with the dual advance (vac & cantrifigal). I also have the later carb (as you mentioned with the remnants of the SCV). I get good vacuum at idle when warm 19inches, and good advance). I do have a rough idle sometimes, and can't track it down. Someday I will track it down, but, it's not enough of a problem for me yet. Hope you find it Jammer.

Bill

 

[CobraSix]

I'm running a DS2 with a Pony Carb 1100...works great. PErtronix worked good as well.

Slade

 

[cdherman]

Jammer -- first make sure you know what you have.

As for dizzy upgrades, the duraspark is very well accepted, either with the stock Ford externals or aftermaket (like MSD etc). But you will have more stuff under the hood.

For a clean stock look that still have a lot of modern appeal, in my opinion the upgrade to a dual advance dizzy and an Ignitor II /Flamethrower II coil will get you a pretty good setup AND a clean look. BUT, you cannot do that with a loadomatic (read spark control valve) in your carb.

There are threads about modifying the carbs by removing the SCV and plugging it. I am uncertain about that. Perhaps someone at Ponycarbs will know.

;ater.....