i think i needs some help... should i rip out my bottom end

[Patrick66]

im 17 and my 66 mustang with a 200 is my first car, i have been working on it since march (havent even driven it yet), i dont know a lot about engine building and havent really had any experience prior to getting this car.

so ive been talking to my uncle, who was a mechanic for most his life, and he has not seen the car close up and has not seen the motor (i have the block seperated from the head). he thinks i need to take the crank out and have it balanced at a machine shop because im planning to do work on the head, but i dont think it needs it.

let me give you some background, the car has 94k on it (pretty low for a 66) and the block is in great condition, at least thats what me and my friends think. the cylinder walls are smooth as glass and there is very little carbon build up on the pistons,very very little. me and my friend matt used really fine some steel wool to clean them up even more (they didnt even need it expept that the block got water in it and i wanted to make sure no rusting happened, i freaked out and spent all night looking at it to see if there would be any damage).

the engine ran well when i got it, a little rich though, completely stock. I am planning to go to a 68 or later head (prefferably 77 or later) so i can do three 1 barrel carbs like i wanted. im gettin dual exhaust headers and modifying an exhaust to fit. upgrading to duraspark II and a MSD coil. i plan to mill the head to keep compression up, ill give it a valve job too. i may upgrade my cam in the future, while im in there ill put a dual timing chain on.

i dont have an engine hoist and i dont really want to tear apart my bottom end, even though this would give me a chance to bore the block. i wasnt planning on doing a complete rebuld, just a head swap and the things i mentioned. btw how much can i bore a 200 block, and are pistons available or will i have to just bore a little and get oversized piston rings.


I guess my question is: should my crank really need it after only 94k miles, and if i do take it apart what all should i do while i have it apart?



How did my block get water in it?.... my parents pushed it out of the garage so that the AC guys could replace our air conditioner (even tho they wouldnt be there for 2 more days) and it rained. the car had no hood , i was taking the SAT when this happened and when i got home they didnt let me push it back in the garage while it rained for 3 days! so i did the best i could with tarps but water still got in.

 

[Patrick66]

i know this is a really long question and thanks.

 

[addo]

It's unfortunate that perhaps other people in your family don't share the same passion for old cars, but continue to look forward from that event. Nex time, take the wheels off. Let's see them push it then.

The motor is low mileage, and for the time being that bottom end is best left. Cylinder wear is evaluated by either catastrophic marks (scoring) or lipping (ridges) at the top of the cylinder. Can you notice a fine ridge on any of the upper cylinders?

Steel wool isn't such a good agent for the cleaning you describe, as fine scraps may be left behind. Be sure that every trace of it is gone. Light motor oil and dust/lint free shop rags are a good way to cover/protect the open cylinders now.

A 200 block may be bored up to 60 thou oversize, but this is not advisable unless wear has become excessive. Can you evaluate the deck height and piston dish volume? That will tell you what compression "potential" you have under normal circumstances, with your present setup.

 

[Patrick66]

thanks alot, this helped. there is a slight lip on cylinder 1, but none of the others, i dont know why just cylinder 1 (maybe the poor fuel distribution was cuasing the oustide cylinders to run too hot?)

i knew steel wool wasnt the best thing to use, i use a penetrating oil to lube when i was cleaning to keep from cutting scratches and to help prevent rusting. i did it because rusting had already started... Floridas so humid that any upainted steel will begin to rust in a day or 2, then again i live in between the gulf and tampa bay(salty and humid). i do have it covered with brand new towels now.

 

[addo]

#1 bore wears faster because it runs cooler than the others.

Nothing too unusual there, except that if you were to change to another set of standard size pistons, you'd want to remove this ridge.

 

[Patrick66]

i left the short block alone for 5 months, this sunday night i was cleaning the bolt holes in preparation for getting my head back from the machinist monday morning (i have it now) and i noticed water coming out of the bolt hole closest to the firewall on the drivers side. didnt concern me at first, i thought it was coolant, but that didnt make any sense. then i realised what was going on, some water must have been in the crevaces from when it got rained on. i pulled the drain plug on the oil pan, expecting to get a few ounces, and water started pouring out. filled up my bucket twice. apparently i didnt take care of it like i had thought, and i should have pulled the motor. i didnt even think of that because the water that was visible had already been dried by my parents while i was gone so i just cleaned up the cylinder walls and called it a day.

it is siezed up, i have to rebuild it, the crank adn connecting rods and everything else down there is covered in rust and goo. so im planning on pulling the motor on wednesday(hopefully). im hoping that i wont need much machine work if any, its a little optomistic seems how the short block was completely filled with water for 5 months. at least this gives me a chance to balance my bottom end, even though this motor ran great when i got it and only had 94k on it and now i have to rebuild it.

ill post pictures later.

 

[Bort62]

Oops.

It's siezed? You can't turn it by hand?

Put a wrench on the crank and crack her free... its not like you are gonna make it any worse

You would be surprised what a motor can survive...

 

[Patrick66]

it is definately siezed, i put a wrench on it and tried to turn it after soaking it in pb blaster over night and it bent the wrench. i dont think its gonna survive.

 

[Bort62]

You bent it? Better send it back to china...

That's a 13/16" bolt in there. Put a 1/2" drive ratchet on there w/ about a 4' cheater... it will come free.

 

[x21]

Yeah,, coincidentally when i was your age, I got my 68 with the 200. It too was seized- sat for a looong time without a hood. A lotta lubing later, it came undone.
Heck why not try a breaker bar on that sucker?

 

[Mercury Mike]

Sometimes a little extra effort will save a lot of money. =) Plus, how cool is it to un-seize a motor with brute strength? But we're only here to offer advice, do what you're gonna do and keep us posted!

 

[Patrick66]

Yeah,, coincidentally when i was your age, I got my 68 with the 200. It too was seized- sat for a looong time without a hood. A lotta lubing later, it came undone.
Heck why not try a breaker bar on that sucker?

breaker bar broke my wrench

You bent it? Better send it back to china...

That's a 13/16" bolt in there. Put a 1/2" drive ratchet on there w/ about a 4' cheater... it will come free.

ill send it back to sears, it was craftsman... and it still broke.

update: the bolt turned, but the crank stayed in the same position, i was just tightening the balancer on more. ill keep trying to break it free.

 

[Mercury Mike]

Soak it over and over for a few days. Blast the hell out of it, and eventually it'll loosen up! =)

 

[Bort62]

ill send it back to sears, it was craftsman... and it still broke.

update: the bolt turned, but the crank stayed in the same position, i was

Like I said, back to china...

Do you have an impact wrench?

 

[Patrick66]

i thought craftsman was made in the US... no, i dont have one.

pictures

 

[addo]

The bottom end will go fine. It could be hot tanked and the journals linished, but even a thorough degrease/hot rinse/oiling up will do OK. You biggest issue is if there's a groove corroded into the bores from the upper ring position being there so long with water. Hone and new rings would almost fix that.

 

[Patrick66]

got new rings already and planning on doing a hone. i have everything ready to go and a engine stand, just waiting on a hoist.

should i do the hone myself with the drill attachments they sell at napa?

 

[wallaka]

Don't see any reason why not. I like the ball-type, myself. It's easier to set up the right pattern with them.

 

[bigcatchdaniel555]

I'd say hone it yourself it will save you some money and takes about thirty minutes to do. Just be careful and keep the bores cool with water as long as your honing. Dont go too far just until you start to see some swirl scratches nothing deep just so your rings seat good.
Dan-

 

[Patrick66]

Don't see any reason why not. I like the ball-type, myself. It's easier to set up the right pattern with them.

couldnt find the ball type, just the 3 stone one. i dont think this is the right one. should i take it back and keep looking or use it?