In honour of Linc's 200: ITZOLD 200 6v

[xctasy]

The ITZOLD Mustang project slowly commences.

Is anyone interested in a log headed 6-bbl 3.3 producing a flywheel 200hp and 220 lb-ft?

I'm designing a triple Holley 2300 kit based on a multiple throttle body derivation of Linc's 200's ideas

see Multiple TBI's (revisiting)

old link was viewtopic.php?f=51&t=26454&start=0

Basically a 'port on port' independent runner conversion to the log head engine.
Uses carbs like this, in a similar manner, but backwards, facing the firewall for carb linkage access.

Shamelessly raided from the wooden boat forum

http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread. ... s-restored

Each carb is placed backwards like on this Aussie 13 second nitrous 63 Ford Futura

Been thinking over this one for a l-o-n-g while, so its time to do it.

Although it's just a carb set up for a Log head now, it's calibration and sizing will allow upgrading to triple 350 or 500 cfm carbs to the superior 2V and Classic Inlines head for any 3.3 or 4.1. Longer term, it will allow for a log head to recieve port EFI.

Since I don't have a 2v or CI head yet, I've started on my 82 Mustangs 3.3 engine. It's a 200 6V HO project

1. Based around the 3.3/200 cid engine,
2. Runs three non emisson #7448 2-bbl Holley 2300 series carbs.
-Initially, with the power valve channel restrictions altered
-the venturis honed out to 1.277" from a stock 1 3/16".
3. Air cleaner is stock tri power Cobra/427 element, but its designed to be emissions compliant, so has a tin enclosure allowing stock 5.0 HO 4-BBL dual snorkel and exhast heat stove
4. It has EGR ports.
5. It uses the stock Fox body emissons bits..thermal reactor converter exhast manifold, but altered to suit the Cologne V6 dual cat exhast used in Rangers and Explorers
6. It's ultimately designed to run with a roller cam from a kit I've devised,
7. If I can fund it, be potentially 49 or even 50 states emmisions compliant for 1965-1984 cars. That's based around the premis that I can get the 7448 emissions converted and an approved EO endorsed replacement to the stock 'foot ball' converter B-code Fox bodies ran organised. Cost for individual back to back emission lab acceptance on a stock but altered 82 Mustang is US $27 000.

Ultimately, its block can be US, Argentine or 1970 to 1992 Australian 3.3/4.1 based, use the CI alloy head , and I'm looking at a 300hp 6V HO 250 cubic inch roller cam version.

General reasons for doing this are: As long as there is no emissions increases, a stock 1982 spec 3.3 Mustang with my induction system and a log , 2V or CI head would be an ideal crate engine for any 6 cylinder Mustang, Falcon, Futura/Rancero, early Bronco, Ranger/Fairmont/Granada/Monarch/Cougar/T-bird/Comete/Capri et al. Anything 1984 and earlier would comply. Other reasons are that port on port carburation is a 25% power boost, and that the little I6 is the worlds best economy engine proposition.

 

[JackFish]

I missed this.
Really neat idea. Keep us updated!

 

[woodbutcher]

Thanks for the write up,AND the link to the wooden boat site.AWESOME build on the 430 Lincoln engine.
Leo

 

[xctasy]

I've had a great weekend.

Tick Sun Electronic Engine Tester from a Honda/ British Leyland service technician
Tick Machined Road Roughness aluminum parts for ITZ OLD(Ulrich Aluminium NZ)
Tick Machined Aluminum manifold adaptor parts for my Independent runner carbs (Ulrich Aluminium NZ)

Tick All 2300 parts for my 350 cfm carbs from the Honda/ British Leyland service technician




Now I just have to pick up those other IHI Holley carbs form my friend in the US, and set up my engine load tester, and I'm on to my triple carbed Mustang...

 

[bubba22349]

Lots of goodies there

 

[xctasy]

I'm really fortunate to have gotten help from a veteren car tech. I explained to him what I was doing, and told him of my independent runner aspirations, and instantly he said 76-96 Honda service manuals, including later VTEC electrronic systems. He said he also had any number of Holley parts, which he accordingly (Accord-ingly, ha ha) trundled out to me.

He was really interested when I told him I was making my own quasi dyno load tester.

I'm sidelined now digging a 51 inch deep trench in my garage to house two Ford Explorer IFS systems running disc brakes through an abs circuit to replicate road load.

 

[JackFish]

Gee have you got a few spare gaskets?

 

[woodbutcher]

Outstanding score on the parts.
Good luck.Have fun.Be Safe.
Leo

 

[STEVEN.]

HOARDING is NOT a crime,Dean! That was awfully nice of that Guy to give/get ya all that stuff. Nice little gathering of parts,but will the Garage be BIG enough for them all : ~OO6.

 

[woodbutcher]

Reminds me of a SUPER score that a fellow that I knew in Florida fell into.
Every service manual for every Ford vehicle except commercial stuff from 1960 through 1990.Price?Free,if he hauled them off.
Had to put an addition on his garage at home to house them.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

 

[xctasy]

I'm making custom independent runner intake manifolds for Cross-flow and Non cross flow Log and 2V/Custom Inlines alloy heads. Each manifold runs the same linkage and carb arrangment, and uses a common air cleaner and cool air induction set-up. I'm getting numbers for my fabricator at the moment.

For US based 144/170/187/188/200/221/250 I6's Part Number is NCHO-6V.

For Log heads, an intermediate branch alloy adaptor used to fit any non 2V/CI log head, but it does require machining the log to fit.

For the Aussie Sixes(3.3/4.1), an X-Flow HO 6V intake for 3.3 or 4.1 exists under Part No XFHO6V

Both types of intake manifold support three simultaneous 2300 series Holley 2-bbls in 350,500, 650 cfm congifurations (7748, 4412 and 6425 respectively). Odd ball 2300's like the International, IHI, Rambler, AMC , Shelby , Mopar and Ford part number pre emissions versions of the 2-bbl Holley are also valid fitments . This set up has venturi areas from 6.64 sq inches to 9.74 sq inches. This easily supports a minimum of 200 to 300 hp with the right camshafts

Optionally, another 90 degree carb adaptor allows the use of three Holley Weber 5200 and 6500 series, DGV/ADM Weber 2-bbl and DGAS Weber/EA Falcon throttle body efi to be used in non idependent runner spec. Each carb workes full time, but the 5200/6500/DGV/ADM are staged 2-bbls which result in 3 venturis working normally with 3 extra venturis mechanically actuated on demand in the HO 6V set-up. The DGAS and EA tbi unit have all 6 veturis working full time. Either way, this means that the sometimes finicky and lengthy calibration for process for independent runner systems can be side stepped. The total venturi area under wide open throttle for these set up is about 5.14 sq inches for 170 hp with a mild cam , but it is able to be taken out to 6.64 sq inches for well over 200 flywheel hp with the 38 DGAS EA TBi set-ups.

I'm currently trialling one on my Mustang in 250 cross flow form with three 350 cfm Holley carbs and a 200 non cross flow form with three Holley 350 cfm carbs. With that, there is a triple DGV32/36 set-up using the 90 degree adaptor. More details to follow.

If you are interested in buying one or more details, register your interest by emailing XECLtd@yahoo.co.nz for non cross flows (log head, 2v, Classic Inlines) quote NCHO-6V.

For Aussie 3.3/4.1 Cross flows, email Morning.Star@xtra.co.nz, quote XFHO-6V

I can supply certified hp packages with custom cam, carb, rod and ignition installs as I verfiy.

 

[xctasy]

When developing the flow rate upgrades to my triple Weber 32/36 engine, I grabbed three Taiwanese PO5-BX magnetic paper clip containers from Datamore

Sorry about the non constitutional French units that follow.

The PO5-BX were basically a plastic drum which is 57 mm outside diameter with a thin 0.5 mm wall thickness for 56 mm internal diameter. Its 54 mm tall, but has a rebate for a 48mm internal diameter lid which has a detachable iron magnet inside.

The lid is 24 mm thick, and fits on top of a rebated plastic container.

Most importantly, it has a 54 by 56 tappered knife edge splitter which is what I'm copying in metal for the NCHO-6V adaptor.


These were trial fitted for size on the three discharge points of my small 48 cc chamber C1 log head.



I've used a 2" concrete cutting tool to create a space for three steel 2" inserts with a cross sectional area equal to three 1.83" carbs. The internal porting is still large enough to make power, and there only needs to be the right cam, carburation and exhast to yield power, even with the stock 1.649" intake and 1.380" exhast sizes. Head gasket is stock Appco AP630, standard Ford Falcon 1966 XR and 1975 XB for 188/200/221/250 cube Aussie log head engines.

At present, the carb jetting for each Cortina 32/36 DGAV carb is re-jetted with a 1:1 linkage. Each carb is positioned as per Stovebolts method. With the staged carb, the arrangement splits the air fuel evenly from between cylinder 1 and 2 for carb 1, between 3 and 4 for carb 2, and 5 and 6 for carb 3. When the 2300 Holley is used, the three adaptors are replaced with internal splits swung around 90, but the carb remains in the same position.

The camshaft is to be a custom kind, but is presently the stock 1982 Fairmont item.

 

[bubba22349]

Each carb is positioned as per Stovebolts method. With the staged carb, the arrangement splits the air fuel evenly from between cylinder 1 and 2 for carb 1, between 3 and 4 for carb 2, and 5 and 6 for carb 3.

interesting though looks like is going to be a job making carb linkage to fit.

 

[xctasy]

Piece of cake. I use the lost pivot point, the handed nature of the European version of the Weber DGA used in the Ford of Europe Granada/Taunus/Cortina/Capri/Sierra, and the years of trawling Ford Six dot com contributors which allows me to use the stock 16 degree stud slew.

My influences were log headers like 75greenmachine, Danielson, bigredraza, and especially anyone who fought with the Stovebolt adaptor, and left the carb in its wacky position. Props to you all.Linc's 200 showed me that its inevitable that there will be a jog jam if you want 350 horsepower of energy to flow through one hole, and he nailed the problem, and made me think along the flow efficiency maximum the David Vizard espoused when a Log headed intake was used on a Pinto 2000 engine that outflowed the stock engines intake yielded less power due to awful inter cylinder flow efficency. Just like our log head engines.

But I digress. Care of Mr Salazar, aka bigredraza

The lever operated early round bodies hold the key



Mine is mounted that way, but the 32/36 DGA carb linkage and secondary position is reversed when compared to the 5200 Holley Weber version. That allows the linkage to work when its arched over the log manifold. A case of fitting the carb before the log.

Albert Pennello used the 5200 Holley Weber, which is a handed 32/36 DGA Weber. His Clifford set up was like this,
http://www.albertpenello.com/mustang/throttlearm.jpg

Cliffords adaptor eliminates the 16 dgree slew, but the linkage with the 16 degree slew, and the reversed image 32/36 DGA versions on the Weber, allows the linkage to canterlever off the centre of the log like it was made to be.

Landons Stovebolt adaptor put the carb on a 16 degree pitch when used without the stock water heater intermediate part, and it then lost the pivot point.

http://home.centurytel.net/fordfan/Falc ... adap01.jpg

My response was to mount a 350/500/650 cfm 2300 series Holley, 38 DGAS or 32/36 DGAV Weber like in the following frames. NCHO-6V uses one kind of multi index split port slot beneath the Weber 38 and 32/36 due to the air fuel travel, and another kind for the 2300 series.

 

[jamyers]

Maybe I'm missing something...but why not just mill the top of the log in 3 places and bolt 3 of the 2-bbl adapters down - do basically 3 of the "2-bbl conversions" instead of just one? It looks like you'd have each throttle bore really close to being right above each cylinder, and the throttle push / pull would be straight along the length of the engine, simplifying the linkage arrangement / modifications, and likely widening the choices of carbs.

 

[xctasy]

I think what I've got is as close as possible to being all things to all people, without it being 'orphaned'.

Milling is harder than drilling. You can plunge drill at a 3 or 4 degree angle in minutes, with no brazing of filling required. I use four alloy plates to flitch up the log head on the two outer carbs, which then gets the breathing spot on despite the wacky alignment. The levers then are bolted to the flitch plates, allowing the stock C3 and C4 kickdown rod or cable operated system to be used, and if the Capri 2.8/ Cortina 2.0 cable C3 or Capri 3 liter C4 cable system is used there is provision for AOD and Borg Warner 35/40 transmissions for the Aussie XK/L/M/P/R/T/Y/A & XB engines.

The size limits for carbs on the 144 to 250 small sixes in the engine bay are exteme, especially on an early I6 in a round Falcon or Econoline. Shifting the carbs out impacts on the later Sanden Air Con compressor, the later EGR ports are hit, the AIR system is impeaded on.

There are two rocker cover kinds, one for early engines, one for later, and if the right one is used, there is no problem. With respect to Fox bodies, there is no space for triple carbs under hood if you move them out to the passenger side with a 250 engine, so a problem is made worse. Using 32/36 carbs means autochoke can be linked and can energise uniformly over the three carbs, as there is free space. The 1960 to 1965 Falcon, 1964.5-1973 Mustang and 1970-1978 Maverick spring tower brace is just able to be cleared with this set up and a 200 cube engine.

Downdraft carbs make more power, but need to be independent runner. I looked at Linc's 200 with its auxilary out branch for a 2-bbl, but it looked to me that all the anicilaries above would then have to be shifted, especially on later Fairmonts and Mustangs, and earlier Mustangs with A/C too.

 

[jamyers]

OK, that makes sense!

 

[bubba22349]

I like were you heading with the 3 carb set up, I was thinking once about a 2 X 2 on my 77 250 Maverick. What ever I do though would have to be able to changed back to a stock look again to meet the smog testing (both visual and tail pipe) that we have here in Ca on the 1976 & up vehicles.

Edit: I really do like the way the 250 pulls from a stop and drives, it just runs out of breath at about 72 or 74 MPH on the freeway it's like it hits a wall.

 

[xctasy]

The sad fact is that most of us here are where the British were in 1967 when faced with the outworkings of the 1965 Clean Air act...we are morally comptemptous of how fuel grade choice, component system durability, compression ratio, carb size and jetting, ignition and cam timing, combustion chamber design and egr, AIR and exhast header design is controlled by a 50 000 mile aged sample placed on a 12 mile lab dyno run of an LA Basin circuit. Its an infringement on the fun of a multiple carbed Aston, Austin, Healy, Triumph, Jag, MG. However, the Japs proved that 240, 260, 280 Ounces and Twin Cam Supras could fan the flame on healthy in line sixes with port on port induction, and they copied an refined the port on port carb, MPI and EFI work done in the 70's by sub contractors to a bakkrupt Ford of Europe, with the likes of Weslakewith the Carpi RS 2600, and Costin and Duckworth with the BDA Escort, DFV Cosworth, Opel Manta 400, Cosworth Vega 16 valve. Ford and GM USA retreated from that advancement during 1971 to 1984...its focus was shortened by consumer legislation, and it was 13 years before compression ratios climbed to 9.3:1 from 8:1, and mean while California emissions ment Ferrari had to kill off the multiple Weber carbed 308, 400 and 512, and Lamborghini, Aston Martin and Maserati had to limit car production to less than 25 per year per model to allow dirty Weber's into LA. In a short while even they had to cow tow the electronic incantstions of Robert Bosch.

As a result, any state upholding IM testing and orginal Federal emmisions edicts makes a modified i6 fail its visual inspection, and then potentially files it as a gross poluter with a 90 day trail before resubmitting. Hence swapping an SVT 235 hp GT40 5.0 efi is okay into a 1982 Mustang, but if I put a Classic Inlines head on my 3.3 Mustang, I'm an enemy of the state. That's a little extreme, as there is a 25 year dispensation in some states, but the modified sixes frame work is too flimsey as it stands to make a real impression on the market place. If you've got a single throttle body and six independent runners, you've got a start point for certification. The NCHO-6V kit is also designed around that final aim.

Stepping back from injection, my first requirement was to meet as far as possible the visual inspection by making sure the smog gear is integrated, and then use an emmisions area carbs with prospect of CARB approval. BMW suppliers got CARB Executive Orders with the with the 2002, so a 1983 Fairmont or 1982 Mustang should be a cinch. After that, its on to making a 50 000 mile sniffer test with one of my combos. Once I've done a righteous job of it, I'll not end up doing a Boyd Caddington or worse, a British Motor industry, but get the kit out there so it can be duplicated in alloy. Like a modern day Raymond Mays Ken Rudd headed AC Ace, only with a stock set of 5200's and enough normally aspirated power to make any 200 sing.

As I've shown esleware, the penultimate Stage 5 tuned 1961-1963 AC Ace RS 2.6


This is the goal, to take all that Mike and the team here have done, and amp it up from the old days of the early 60's where Hot Rod showed Edelbrock three 1bbls, Hilborn injected sawn off 159's, and in England, a certain 170 hp 155 cube Ac Aces like this dropped low 6 second 0-60's on just three 40 mm DCOE Webers with 28 mm chokes.

When the small and big block Ford V8's came out and won SCCA events, drags and LeMans, Ford lost I6 focus. But it never really went away, it was always there, exponged from Dearborn and fortified in Europe and Australia and Argentina in the form of V6 Capris, 250 Cortinas and 2V Falcons, cars that existed because Dearborn knew that a few 100 000 pounds could create a race winning engine from two cobbled up Kent engines sharing a common crank. The 2.65 DFX/3.0 DFV era was a quite shocker (good tense) when so much developement came from such a small investment. The Cologne 2.9 Cosworth Scorpio and the Capri Essex based GAA RS 3400 engines and its relationship to the SHO development was massive, and had it been moved on sooner, it would have swollowed the world whole if Ford USA wanted them to.

Now, the tide is turning, and in America, people are rediscovering something, with people digging up old I6 blocks, and instead of blokes wanting three 94's on a 239, people will want triple 5200's on the 200's.

 

[bubba22349]

I will be pulling the head on my 250 sometime soon for repair (it’s been fouling the plugs a little) thinking about also changing out the pistons and or just the rods to tighten up the quench and boost the compression some and maybe some other mods inside. How soon before you going to have your prototype head built?