All Small Six Roller cam conversion?

[Flatiron Fabrication]

Has anyone done a roller cam conversion on a 200 or 250?
I'm looking at cam options and the high failure rate of flat tappet cams and lifters across the industry has me thinking about going roller.
Has anyone dealt with a company making billet cam cores for these engines?

 

[pmuller9]

Has anyone done a roller cam conversion on a 200 or 250?
I'm looking at cam options and the high failure rate of flat tappet cams and lifters across the industry has me thinking about going roller.
Has anyone dealt with a company making billet cam cores for these engines?

The difficulty is installing a roller lifter.
Look it over carefully and see if you can come up with a solution.

 

[vssman]

If I remember correctly, the lifter fits down inside a bore. There’s no way to fit the anti-rotational bar.

 

[pmuller9]

If I remember correctly, the lifter fits down inside a bore. There’s no way to fit the anti-rotational bar.

I’ve seen where the side of the block was cut open to install the lifters and then a plate was made to act as a side cover.

I’ve also seen roller lifters with a keyway and the side of the block had roller ball assemblies installed that rode in the lifter keyways.

 

[aussie7mains]

Argentine racers do this all the time.

 

[Engine Fan]

Found this searching for 250 roller cam. Was under post #19 by xctasy

 

[vssman]

I should have added “without modifications to the block” to my earlier post.

 

[67Straightsix]

I should have added “without modifications to the block” to my earlier post.

I believe you have to open up the side of the block like the Ford 300 to get roller lifters to work.
A guy named mike1187 (posted in the turbo section) showed how he installed roller lifters on a 250.

 

[drag-200stang]

Warranted or not, you have think about the compatibly of the billet steel cam gear and the iron dist. gear, there is no bronze gear for the small six, there is some melinized sp? gears that may work.
Mike used an external drive crank driven oil pump that takes the load off the dist. gears and the Argentine guys seem to run external pumps too.
I think that a smart skillful person could get link bars to work with some smaller work holes in the side of the block. The keyway way would work, maybe better but you would need the equipment to do so.
One day I would like to do it, but I need to wear out what I have now.

 

[Flatiron Fabrication]

Warranted or not, you have think about the compatibly of the billet steel cam gear and the iron dist. gear, there is no bronze gear for the small six, there is some melinized sp? gears that may work.
Mike used an external drive crank driven oil pump that takes the load off the dist. gears and the Argentine guys seem to run external pumps too.
I think that a smart skillful person could get link bars to work with some smaller work holes in the side of the block. The keyway way would work, maybe better but you would need the equipment to do so.
One day I would like to do it, but I need to wear out what I have now.

One other factor to consider for sure, thanks for the info

 

[Flatiron Fabrication]

Thanks for the great info, I made the post without even looking at the engine I have put away for the build.
Had I looked first I would have seen how complicated the question could be.
I'll dig further into it and see if I can come up with a solution.

 

[CNC-Dude]

I looked at this for the small 6 cylinder Ford, and many automatically assume you have to use a tie bar link setup to run a roller cam, but you dont. The setup used by the 5.0 302 can work good as well as the keyway style. The keyway style being a last resort in my opinion because of costly machine work. But the 5.0 method is simpler and most anyone can do it themselves with little effort or exotic tools....I was seeking a donor block and had countless hours of conversations with Donnie Johansson about making round lobe billet blanks for this engine and several other niche inline engines I was looking to bring this type of product to market. I saw the writing on the wall 10 or so years ago that people are just now starting to realize and take seriously....

 

[comet6]

I looked at this for the small 6 cylinder Ford, and many automatically assume you have to use a tie bar link setup to run a roller cam, but you dont. The setup used by the 5.0 302 can work good as well as the keyway style. The keyway style being a last resort in my opinion because of costly machine work. But the 5.0 method is simpler and most anyone can do it themselves with little effort or exotic tools....

I don't see how there is room for dogbone retainers. What about cylinder 1 and 6 where there is a boss ? Also a flat pad to set on.. I think the link bar on the outboard side is most feasible. You might have to load lifter from bottom and manipulate link bars on. Getting a camshaft is actually the biggest obstacle imo.

 

[CNC-Dude]

Well, as mentioned in a post farther up in this thread, another member already installed a roller cam in his earlier build. It's been done before in the small Ford six. I also had spoken to several cam companies myself about having roller cam blanks made, including Donnie Johansson, who is a legend in the Bonneville scene for creating roller cams in numerous vintage inline engines that never had them before. Plus, there are several cam companies in Oz that have them for years. One of those companies is where Mike in the build thread mentioned got his cam. So, it's not really as big of an obstacle as you might think.

 

[drag-200stang]

Well, as mentioned in a post farther up in this thread, another member already installed a roller cam in his earlier build. It's been done before in the small Ford six. I also had spoken to several cam companies myself about having roller cam blanks made, including Donnie Johansson, who is a legend in the Bonneville scene for creating roller cams in numerous vintage inline engines that never had them before. Plus, there are several cam companies in Oz that have them for years. One of those companies is where Mike in the build thread mentioned got his cam. So, it's not really as big of an obstacle as you might think.

Keep in mind that Mike was using a crossflow AU. head with the different valve layout and the cam was something that was already in production( I think).
When I was talking to Racer Brown about a solid flat tappet cam he said he could make a roller cam for it. This was a long time ago but it seem that making a roller cam for the small six was not a big thing.

 

[comet6]

Does the 200 have cam flats to clear rod swing ? That would also need consideration.

 

[drag-200stang]

Does the 200 have cam flats to clear rod swing ? That would also need consideration.

Why yes it does. But the rods do not interfere with the lobe like on a V8.

 

[CNC-Dude]

The cam barrel is much smaller on a roller cam vs. a cast iron flat tappet style cam, so the flats probably aren't needed for a roller blank....

 

[Jmustang_65]

So, bringing this thread up since it has more traction.
I e-mailed Tighe and Crow cams in Australia.

Tighe will still make a Roller cam for 680 Australia. = $ 422.38 United States Dollars plus shipping.
Bronze gear $95 - AUD ( If available)
Material used "We make these billet cams from iron. Induction hardened then Tuftrided after completion".
He mentioned we can user Ford 460 roller lifters. I asked Barry for a part number and he said he would get back to me if available.

Crow no longer makes roller cams for the inline six.

 

[Jmustang_65]

I looked at this for the small 6 cylinder Ford, and many automatically assume you have to use a tie bar link setup to run a roller cam, but you dont. The setup used by the 5.0 302 can work

Are you thinking we can drill and tap the center of dog bone into the block to hold the lifter so that we can use standard 302 roller lifters? if the distance was the same? or just cut in have/extend?