200ci Electric fan install

So,

Like others I wanted to go to an electric fan--mostly because the radiator I have is not the proper radiator for the '66 Comet with factory air. That radiator should be 20 inches wide, mine is 17 inches. Even when I get the right radiator I prefer the electric so I'm sure cool air is being drawn across the A/C condenser and radiator.

Not being as adventurous as others I wanted to buy new parts that didn't take modifying to fit. So I found this setup from Mustangs Unlimited.

http://www.mustangsunlimited.com/itemdy01.asp?T1=PC2054S+01]Procomp 16" S-Blade fan
http://www.mustangsunlimited.com/itemdy00.asp?T1=DA236+01]Electric Fan Wiring Harness with Relay
http://www.mustangsunlimited.com/it...djustable Temperature Sensor for Electric Fan

For $125 plus tax and shipping Totally acceptable for me.

Installation was a breeze. The fan can be used as a pusher or puller depending on polarity. ProComp's website says the fan comes configured as a puller, but I found that I needed to reverse the polarity.

Here's a pic of the clearance to the water pump pulley.


After installing it and letting it idle until the fan turned on I checked the temps and found the radiator outlet at 120*, the radiator inlet at 155*, the front of cylinder head 165*, and the rear of cylinder head 190*. So I need to adjust the temp sensor switch some to optimize.

I'm heading out for a drive today so I'll see how much the fan helps. After the deluge of weather on Thursday it'll be in the low 80s here in central Florida.

Hi 66comet202, Nice work on the electirc fan modification I think I had your project confused with bucfan's, that pro-comp fan looks like a nice compact install. Sounds like your cooling system is in good shape as well based on the temp differentials. Please do let us know how the setup holds up as the temperatures rise.
Good luck

Frankenstang":2ulg6tx6 said:

After installing it and letting it idle until the fan turned on I checked the temps and found the radiator outlet at 120*, the radiator inlet at 155*, the front of cylinder head 165*, and the rear of cylinder head 190*. So I need to adjust the temp sensor switch some to optimize.

Click to expand...

I noticed similar differences on on my head also, I found that if you have constant water flowing through the heater core (fan can be off) you get more even temps through the whole head, and my 195* t-stat opens on time as hot water is able to move towards it. I temps read 195* front and 240*+ rear (I don't think that's very safe for my head gasket). I really think that cyl #6 is the hottest and leanest of all the cyls as it's last to get rid if the hot water and last to get new water. if you have AC and the heater/AC is an all-in-one unit, try bypassing the heater, and to make it more "like" the heater core length you can run a longer hose. I'll be trying the hose after I get my bigger fan in there and move my radiator forward 1/2+ inch.

I have one of those "all-in-one" units and to keep water heating up my AC they gave a water valve that I can control from inside my cab. it just restricts fresh water from coming in the heater. I'm thinking I can still bypass the heater, but keep that operating as I only need it as it warms up initially or really slow traffic.

P.S. I'm jealous if the room you got... leftover

I agree too big a temp differential could demonstrate an issue....no thermostat, too low temp thermostat or constant quick flow (EDIT: stuck open?). 66comet202's diff. is not quite as large as yours...potential thermostat issue :

My shadetree $.02 would be this; some differential is normal in these engines as the rear of the head is commonly warmer than the front. Water is circulating from front to back in the block transferring/absorbing the greatest source of heat (friction sources relative to water jacket surface area); then up into the head and from back of the head to front and onto the rad (water is acutally cooling slightly as it passes through the cylinder head from back to front which does have source of heat combustion chambers & exhaust, but also has some cooling factors as well <intake flow cools, size of H2O passages, and surface area larger relative to heat source : >). Also why the temp sensor is commonly located where it is (hottest point).

MPG, I wonder if the differential would not be exagerated by bypassing the heater (speeding flow through the rest of the cooling system) Mine seemed to run a bit warmer until I restored/re-installed the heater a month or two ago...may also have to do with heater hose routing...again just my shadetree $.02. Interesting subject to ponder...

Frankenstang - I share the concern, I don't like it, but at least that's not water temp, it's exterior head temp.

My observation is just that, I have full flow when I'm warming up the engine, untill the t-stat opens, then I gradually close the heater core so full flow goes through the t-stat. Why I think the engine gets so hot is the water is not moving at all and with the heater core cirulating water freely from next to t-stat to the water inlet, it moves the stagnant water so the "hotter" water gets to the t-stat for a t-stat controled temp. granted it's not ideal but it's my theory on why I don't see warming up heat spikes any more and just a gentle temp rise to desired temp.

remember I use a valve to control the flow of water... which I will keep when I bypass the heater for the summer... need my AC and can't run the heater at the same time :roll:

Hey mpg...good convo IMO...yeah, I would not refute what you're seeing cause let's face it...you're the one seeing it firsthand. Alhtough I would think that any water circulating through the heater core is acting as additional cooling capacity (ie any circutlation occurring through a part of the system that is not imparting heat (EDIT: above norm op temps), even at 100-120* temps of inside the hot summer cabin temps, would still be cooling).

Although the routing of the heater hoses in my rustang, I'm assuming similar routing in yours, is odd let's say. Water comes from the front of the head (not quite hottest point) and then returns to the pump (bypassing the radiator cooling and being pumped right back into the block) ...maybe that explains some of it. Could the temperature spikes actually be a result of t-stat open and closing, maybe bypassing is reducing the open/close spike and averaging out temps as you say and reducing variance...again interesting to ponder .

MPGmustang":rdlrcoou said:

but at least that's not water temp, it's exterior head temp.

Click to expand...

Yes, but using say an IR temp thermometer would still yield a good approximation that will maintain the relevance of temperatures throughout the system depding on where you measure (ie water jacket/passage walls...not for example spark plug bosses). I think one of the best areas for this app is measureing function and efficiency of the rad/fan system itself, or upper tank to lower tank differentials.

All this is assuming a more stock system...

MPGmustang":rdlrcoou said:

need my AC and can't run the heater at the same time

Click to expand...

Stock system for '66 would be a heater core encased in a seperate plenum system to the under dash a/c evaporator coil. Now if you have an aftermarket system (which I'm assuming you might based on the recommended bypass valve), like in the modern system where the two coils are adjacent in the same plenum structure and same fan source, then I'd say, yeah...definitely want a valve so you don't have a circulating heat exchanger working next to a de-humidifier (ie evaporators & ac's remove heat more than they impart cold...but that's HVAC tecnicality, I digress...)....an interesting discussion nonetheless

It's making my brain itch, but giving me ideas...and as always the more I learn and the more I think I know...the less certain I am of everything :mrgreen:

Well, here's an update. The fan definitely helps around town and recovery time after highway driving. On the highway though the temp needle still climbs pretty close to H. I don't know exact temps as I had borrowed the IR temp gun. I decided to do another flush and ensure a 50/50 coolant mix. As I was doing that I found the freeze plug by the exhaust manifold was leaking. YIKES!!

(BTW I live in an apt so I can't work on it here. I'm able to do some work on it at the office on occasion.)

Given time was short that day I flushed what I could with a hose and put it back together. I had to drive to Lakeland yesterday, about 35 miles, and checked everything when I got there and that's when the gloom struck. Now, there are 4 or 5 freeze plugs on the exhaust side leaking! #%*%#%*¥£*%#%*!!!!!

I put a gallon of water (from a gallon jug) in the rad and headed home. Luckily I was heading back home late in the evening when it wasn't 90*+ outside and traffic wasn't as heavy so I could drive a little slower keeping the RPMs down in hopes of nursing it home. I did make it.

So, here's a question for y'all. How many freeze and where on the '66 200ci? if you know the sizes as well that'd be a big help! This is one thing the shop manual lacks an answer for, which is disappointing.

EDIT: looks like 1"
Just a couple threads down in this section...
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=65186

Those are for the ones running down the between the ports on the pass side of head. There is also the large one at the back end of the head...almost similar size/shape as the T-stat housing IIRC, but sorry can't remember size for sure on that one...hopefully someone else can chime in on that size.

Yeah, you'll need to get the system sealing tight, not even smalll leaks, cap, hoses, etc. to for sure how much/often it's overheating and that you've got it as full as possible.
Sorry to hear about the poor turn of events, but good you were able to keep here rolling vs full braek down...Good luck

Thanks Frankenstang. Its frustrating for sure. I found a complete set of expansion plugs--as they're called on parts websites--from rockauto.com for $17 shipped. Its a set from Sealed Power and includes the cam and oil galley plugs. Once I get the kit I'll replace the ones I can with the engine still in the car. In the meantime since I'm about to replace the entire wiring harness once I get the overheating issue solved, I'm adding a water temp gauge so I can see actuals numbers.

I will also get the exhaust manifold planed flat so I can get a good seal.

on a side note....
has anyone though of pulling water from the rear of the head to the pump inlet? I knwo some of the SBC motors will do this on the intake to even out the temps.

btw I always thought the rear was cooler? I had a Autometer electric temp gauge in my 170 and 200 and they both read 10-15 degrees low (assuming the read right and that the t-stat was opening at the proper temp)

Once I get the system flushed the plugs replaced I'll check the temps again to see the difference. It makes sense to me though, that the back is hotter than the right because of the flow direction.

4 or 5 freeze plugs on the exhaust side leaking!

B glad u have the I6, no?
Even the 1s behind the exhaust down pipe R accessable. 5 frost plugs on that side for the 200. But U No due to ordering.
I got 3 on the 170/2.8 and 5 on the two 4.1/250s (on # 2 or 3 the down tube IS in the way).

BTW: Thax 4 the fan write up next mod?

I was able to look at the engine from underneath and there's only one plug in the block thats bad or leaking. Most, if not all, of the plugs in the head are leaking. So its going to be fun replacing those behind the intake log. :nono: I will replace all of the ones in the block I can though.

Next upgrade? I'm thinking alternator since I'll then have the fan and the AC drawing power. I noticed the lights were dim at idle the other night with only the fan running.

After that upgrade, then its replacing the entire wiring. Just after Christmas the ignition switch came apart and shorted out the wiring. I luckily got back to the car with only some smoke happening. A few more minutes would've meant Car-BQ. IT fried the hot lead to the solenoid completely. Along the way it damaged a bunch of wires. So, I spent my Christmas vacation rebuilding the harness so I could drive. I've already bought the 12 circuit harness from ezwiring.com. Since I'm not that strong on the electrical knowledge I'm going through the harness manual (GM-based circtuitry) and the Comet shop manual to plan it all out. Luckily I've got a couple of friends who are very knowledgable on the wiring to help. Or at least give me advice. Or just mock and ridicule.

Then depending on the state of the engine I'll do the DSII upgrade and then add some tunes.

At some point along the way I'll spray bomb it until I can get the needed bodywork done. I made the mistake of washing it when I got it and now the roof and decklid are moldy.

66comet202":318z3iw3 said:

I was able to look at the engine from underneath and there's only one plug in the block thats bad or leaking. Most, if not all, of the plugs in the head are leaking. So its going to be fun replacing those behind the intake log. :nono: I will replace all of the ones in the block I can though.
I made the mistake of washing it when I got it and now the roof and decklid are moldy.

Click to expand...

Sounds like Tampa (my 85 y/o dad is in LongBoat).
BTW: for the frz plugs: Y not have it depresserised (w/a kit) it's cheep/easy enuff. Just hand pump the fixture @ the rediator, leave for awhile, come back, check the gage for a needle drop. That way U can tell if U gottem all.

Good luck, bro. Let us know how it goes. Sounds like you'll have a new car soon

Longboat Key is a nice area. I was up your way back in March. I helped a friend move back to her hometown of Palmer. She took me to Fitzwilliy's for dinner over your way.

The pressure test is a good idea. I'll see what I can do once I get the plugs replaced.

I hope to have a nice new 2012 Mustang... oh you meant the Comet. Ya, I hope to have it roadtrip worthy soon! Real soon!!!!

Palmer is on 1 side a me n FitzWill's, the odder (Northanpton, no? That chick is a swingin babe if she goes there, 'specially from way over Palmer...)

U can use a hand pump or fancy air 'presser one like me mates @ the garageuse!
Good luck, keep us informed...

BTW: know anyone wants a '75 250 up here?
:rolflmao:

Alright, back to our story.

I've replaced all the freeze plugs in the block and the head. Just a couple notes from that. If you can pull the engine, its much easier than trying to work around shock towers, accessory brackets, exhaust, etc. Also the plugs for a '66 200ci head are the cup-style. Not the concave-convex style. The concave style need a lip in the opening to hold them in place. I discovered that when I went to reinstall one when, with one light tap, the plug went through the hole and hid inside the head. But more on that later.

With the electric fan installed I wanted to see what kind of water temps I was actually getting, so I installed a mechanical temp gauge from SunPro. Around town--short 10 miles roundtrips--the temps were about 190 all day long. When I got on the highway above 55 the temp climbed to 210. This is with water only. It wasn't rushing to put coolant in it with the leaking I was experiencing.

So, after I replaced the freeze plugs, and as I expected, the radiator finally gave up. Now this wasn't the original radiator for the Comet with a 200ci and factory A/C. It was 2.5-inches narrower than stock. So, it was already not cooling enough. A friend had a Mustang radiator for a V8. The only thing that wasn't perfect was the radiator outlet is on the passenger side--not the driver's side. So, I installed it and fabbed a longer hose form the original lower hose and a flex hose using a hose repair kit. This worked for a day and a half. The water temps around town weren't even 180 degrees. On the highway the temp was around 195. Looking real good!

Notice I said the fix worked for a day and a half. Well, the repair kit gave out dumping the water as I was going down the road! I only knew because the water temp climbed to 280 within seconds. I pulled over and saw the hoses had come apart. So, I frankensteined them together to get me to my destination. Once the car cooled off I added water, kept the rad cap loose so the system wouldn't pressurize and proceeded to the parts store.

They let me look through all their hose trying to find a better solution to no avail. So I bought another repair kit and limped home. What I didn't do with the repair kit was let the rubber cement set up. I did this the second time and thats been fine since.

Now the next morning I filled the radiator with water and after a few seconds heard it gushing out. Not through the repaired hoses, but through a missing plug in the head. I had a couple of spare concave-convex style plugs and when I installed one thats when it went through the hole and disappeared. Forty minutes later I had it out and hit Google trying to figure it out. Finding out the problem I got four new plugs, installed them and now the block and radiator are holding water. And the temps are great! Almost 180 around town. 195-200 on the highway at 60--the car doesn't want to go much faster. If I do push it to 65-70 then the water temp goes to 210. Mind you, thats still with plain water. Changing to coolant and water wetter will help that.

And finally now to the A/C. Ya gotta have it in the southern regions of the US, right? Got the A/C working yesterday and the water temps still seem fine. I'll watch them over the enxt week or so. Then I'll flush the cooling system again and then get a good coolant in it.

Good job. Sounds like a lot of fun!

Are you going to spring for the correct rad? I've had pretty good luck with junkyard rads.
Come to think of it, I've never bought one new, but I have a fox-body.

Thanks. There were moments of sheer joy. At least I think there was...

At $450 or so for the correct one, I'm not sure. If this one works and the frankenstein hose stays together I won't. At least for a while. I'll move on to other things that need to be done with the car--bodywork, paint, interior, weatherstripping, etc. This being a daily driver--my only car in fact-- makes the whole process slow.

I'm making progress so "yipes and away" to quote a cartoon duck.

66comet202

Check out this Aluminum Radiator on ebay, $200.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Champion ... ccessories