Click Here -> Please Consider Making a PayPal Contribution to the FordSix Forum!
2019 Contributors:
NJwpod, 1strodeo, mightynorseman, maxtrux, 6d7coupe, broncr, Phase3, 68Flareside240, bmbm40, mustang6, WorldChampGramp, justintendo, BigBlue94, ags290, motorsickle1130, Rooster, ousooner919, ethanperry, rzcrisis, DoctorC, jamyers, Motorboy, fastpat, Silverback280, chad, drag-200stang, THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER, Jimmys61falcon, rjonah, Sooshi, Robert92867, Invectivus


PLEASE TEST ON http://dev.fordsix.com

<<<***PLEASE READ*** New Site Update >>>

What carb setup for my 250?

Moderator: Mod Squad

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

What carb setup for my 250?

Post #1 by Georgia200 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:01 am

I have several choices to make:

I have a 74 stock exhaust manifold and a set of dual outlet headers that came with the car when I bought it. I can buy a dual outlet stainless steel header off ebay for $120. I would prefer a single outlet header but I havent seen one of those anywhere.

I have a stock cam and the Schneider 262-70H cam that I bought from 65 Coupe.

I have 2 C9 manifolds and maybe a line on a large log manifold off a 78-ish Fairmont.

Im leaning toward a Weber or tripower. Easiest is a 1V, but it doesnt tune as well as a 2V and I dont think thats enough carb for the Schneider cam.

has anyone blocked off the center carb hole and run 2 - 1V carbs?

I think the Weber has the smallest footprint and is easiest to adapt to the head and tunes well.

Opinions and recommendations?

User avatar
Econoline
Registered User
Posts: 1443
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 8:37 pm
Location: Anacortes, WA

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #2 by Econoline » Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:35 pm

Scott Drake sells a single out header, they claim it fits the 250. They're real proud of it though.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sdk-c3oz-9430-h1
It ain't gonna fix itself

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #3 by Georgia200 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:04 pm

Yeah, SD can just go ahead and keep that.

User avatar
chad
Registered User
Posts: 5273
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:51 am
Location: Lawrence Swamp, S. Amherst, MA

What carb setup for my 250?

Post #4 by chad » Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:56 pm

I;ve seen a head hogged out for 2 2v with the center hole covered (like U suggest) in a thread here somewhere but it would seem to have the same problem as stock moved to #s 3&4 instead of 1 & 6.
Yes the late model head is the 1 (altho the M is great for the mill, fill, mill direct mount 2 or 4V). It's all in 'the Handbook'. U got one, no?

Like all automotive Qs - answered by the "My application?" answer. "Cam as center of engine build" selected by 80% of operation RPMs'n gasoline octane. Head flow CFMs are later and more directly in-line w/this Q. But as a system these all figure in on ur Q.

I like ur offie trips w/3 glass bowled holley 1904 as a theme clincher in ur vehicle (yer 1st idea). But thats 'style', looks, fashion (plenty 2 B said 4 that if yours is the same as mine
:wink:
:roll:
:twisted:
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

User avatar
xctasy
VIP Member
Posts: 7062
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2002 10:40 am
Location: PO Box 7072 Dunedin 9011,South Island, NEW ZEALAND
Contact:

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #5 by xctasy » Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:58 am

What always works with a single hole feeding a forward (123) and astern(456) set of cylinders is a two barrel carb with two idle jets and a proper, deep float bowl pointing to the rocker cover. Jets and well tubes shouldnt be uncovered much on a 12 % incline. On V8s, the jets are pivoted through a common center..on our big sixes, the whole carb is hanged out to dry on the side of a one foot pole called the 240 Big Six...

Autolite 2100's
Motorcraft 2150's
Holley 2300 350's or the earlier IHI 265 cfm.
Or the BBD Carter 2bbl mounted diagonally.

Weber 38s, 32/36's, Holley Weber 5200/6200/6500 have a small fuel bowl, a restrictive needle and seat and are effected by slope and under hood temperature. The problem with the staged Holley Weber is it often came without a second idle jet or squirter, so fuel only comes out of one circuit. The 38's are good, but for a 300 cfm carb, the float bowl is very small and the emulsufucation (added air) makes them heat prone. Ill post an example of how a 2bbl carb swap can go wrong on a 250 cubic inch six. You need to avoid wrong steps that dont work for a fence mending or haulin rock truck.

Reduced liter intakes like the stock 240/300 carb intakes work better in low rpm situations with 2bbl simultaneous openibg American origin carbs.

Id find an old Jeep 304 2150 1.08 Motorcraft, and fit that to the 1.68 inch hole opened out to 2 inches

That should help you out.

And a metal plate under the carb to deflect heat back to the exhaust.

I love old28racers intake. Great thing to copy...a work of art!

old28racer wrote:On the following picture of aluminum 2bbl adapter mounted on a modified 240 cast iron intake should my Holley 2300 2bbl carb choke plate face the valve cover?
Image



Econolines is exceptional too


viewtopic.php?f=1&t=79820&hilit=250+Bronco+38+Weber

jimmyv65 had two problems...heat soak and idle fuel distibution problems

viewtopic.php?f=36&t=70194&p=555776&hilit=250+Bronco+38+Weber#p555776

He has injected it with Chevy TBi and MegaSquirt. It works great.

viewtopic.php?f=36&t=75700
Last edited by xctasy on Mon Apr 06, 2020 8:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Image
XEC Ltd ICBE's Inter Continental Ballistic Engines-
FAZER 6Bi (M112 & EEC5) or FAZER 6Ti (GT3582 & EEC5) 425 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
X-Flow Engine Components Ltd http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #6 by Georgia200 » Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:21 pm

I have a 1.01 2100 with 50 jets. I think Im going to mill the head and run that.

It came off my 65 bone stock 289. It needs cleaning up but is in excellent condition.

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #7 by Georgia200 » Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:36 pm

I have two 2100s. 1.01 - 50 jets 1.14 - 52F jets

On the same engine, what is the difference between running a larger venturi carb with smaller jets vs a smaller venturi carb with larger jets?

User avatar
xctasy
VIP Member
Posts: 7062
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2002 10:40 am
Location: PO Box 7072 Dunedin 9011,South Island, NEW ZEALAND
Contact:

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #8 by xctasy » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:32 am

Georgia200 wrote:I have two 2100s. 1.01 - 50 jets 1.14 - 52F jets

On the same engine, what is the difference between running a larger venturi carb with smaller jets vs a smaller venturi carb with larger jets?


The jetting is proportional to the venturi size...if you divide 1.01 by 0.05 and 1.14 by 0.052 the ratio is the same. The transfer slots govern how well a 1.01 or 1.14 works in a 250. You can lean any 2100 2bbl carb by using the 4100 4bbl 5 hole well tubes inside the carb instead of the 4 hole well tubes.

For simplicity, Ford started with the 0.98 carbs on tiny 221 SBF or 272 Y block engines, and then went up to a 1.33 on the 265 hp gross 390 and yet the 351C, 351M and 4002Vs, just a 1.23 like the 5.0 1982 2V GT or Capri RS.

Exception is the tiny little 171 2.8 liter V6...that verile 109 hp net firebrand in the 1979 Mustang and Fox Mercury Capri used a 1.08.
Image
XEC Ltd ICBE's Inter Continental Ballistic Engines-
FAZER 6Bi (M112 & EEC5) or FAZER 6Ti (GT3582 & EEC5) 425 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
X-Flow Engine Components Ltd http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10

User avatar
Econoline
Registered User
Posts: 1443
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 8:37 pm
Location: Anacortes, WA

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #9 by Econoline » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:53 am

Georgia200 wrote:I have two 2100s. 1.01 - 50 jets 1.14 - 52F jets

On the same engine, what is the difference between running a larger venturi carb with smaller jets vs a smaller venturi carb with larger jets?


I'll say 1.08 ;)

I think the smaller venturi will raise vacuum and help the carb up to the point of being too small. 1.08 with 48's?

They were using 1.08 2100's long before the late seventies w/V-8's jetted in the 40's

Edited to correct jet size.
Last edited by Econoline on Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
It ain't gonna fix itself

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #10 by Georgia200 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:39 am

I pulled the 1.01 off my 65 289 and replaced it with a 500cfm 4V.

The difference is night and day. Initially I thought the 1.01 was on its last legs. The car idled poorly and had no power, The 4V will roast the tires 1-2 and 2-3, this is on a stock 289 with dual exhaust.

I opened the 1.01 to have a look inside. It is clean, no varnish or wear. The throttle shaft is tight. I think it needs a kit and is good to go.

I also have a new China carb, but it has a choke pull off on the front of it. Im not sure I need the pulloff but it will not fit on a inline six with it. No specs on what size it is but the venturi looks to be at least as big as the 1.14 carb.

User avatar
Econoline
Registered User
Posts: 1443
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 8:37 pm
Location: Anacortes, WA

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #11 by Econoline » Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:17 am

Will the Chinese one take ford jets? It wouldn't hurt to run the 1.01 but it's going to be to small for you I bet, like your experience with the 289. A 1.01 flows 240 cfms, so definitely an improvement over the 1v.
It ain't gonna fix itself

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #12 by Georgia200 » Tue Apr 07, 2020 3:33 pm

Crunch time. As soon as I measure the combustion chambers, the head is off t the machine shop.

If I go with tri-power, what carbs should I run? They need to be easy to obtain and not be out of the world expensive. Ive seen guys with almost 2k into a log head. For that money go Oz or vintage inlines.

User avatar
chad
Registered User
Posts: 5273
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:51 am
Location: Lawrence Swamp, S. Amherst, MA

What carb for my 250?

Post #13 by chad » Tue Apr 07, 2020 3:56 pm

equal the cost of the intake w/3 1904 glass bowls?
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

User avatar
bubba22349
Global Moderator
Posts: 9783
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:46 pm
Location: Flagstaff, Az. 86005 near the old Route 66

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #14 by bubba22349 » Tue Apr 07, 2020 4:06 pm

For a great Tri power set up you can take Fords lead (and Ak Millers) from their 1970 Maverick 250 six powered show car, see below link. If your 250 has a decent Autolite carb or a Carter on it now just use that for the center carb, then pick up a pair of Holley 1904 or 1908 1V for the other two carb's. You could also use a set of the Holley 1940's like my friend JD " jdn2178 " did on his 1968 200 six Mustang. Or a set of Carter YF's or RB's would work good too. Best of luck :thumbup: :nod:

The Ford Mavi GT Show Car
http://maverick.to/grabber/MaviGT.html

JD's Tri Powered 1968 Mustang
viewtopic.php?t=62804
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

User avatar
chad
Registered User
Posts: 5273
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:51 am
Location: Lawrence Swamp, S. Amherst, MA

carb for 250 - what is the final application?

Post #15 by chad » Tue Apr 07, 2020 5:09 pm

keepa choke on the center only, set up w/that carb (pretend the 2 'extra' - they're not there/block off) & get running right, then add the 2 ends. :thumbup:

I like a 2100 direct mount pretty good tho (ifa hot, revie 200 w/frame stiffeners, suspension, break'n steering upgrades). 250 is more about tq tho so a H U G E 1v...
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #16 by Georgia200 » Wed Apr 08, 2020 7:42 pm

I have a 6 month old 1100 on the 200. It was a PITA to order, I returned the first two, the one I kept does not have the AT dashpot. My 67 200 has a 69 head with the 1.75 carb opening.

The carb that was on car when I bought it was also an 1100, but with the 1.5" carb hole the AT dashpot and a SCV, my dizzy is not a LOM. I dug the carb out this morning to look at it and Im pretty sure it is one of the China 1100s that are sold on ebay. There are no markings on the body of the carb at all.

I could buy a second China carb and delete the SCVs and run three 1100s. Those run about $140 each on ebay.

China 1904s run about $100 on ebay.

UREMCO tells me that they are buying China carbs and using them as cores since there are so few rebuildable cores available now. They change the floats, gaskets and send them out the door for almost triple what they pay for them.

The other issue is, do I have room under the hood for a tripower? I measured before I removed the head. With the 1100 on the factory spacer and a SD chrome open element aircleaner, there was 2 1/4 inches to the hood. Im guessing there is less room at the front and rear of the manifold.

I have a spare 250 block and head. As soon as I get the 200 out Im going to install the bare block and head and take some more measurements. I have a set of the correct 250 mounts, so Im hoping that what I have will still fit.

User avatar
xctasy
VIP Member
Posts: 7062
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2002 10:40 am
Location: PO Box 7072 Dunedin 9011,South Island, NEW ZEALAND
Contact:

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #17 by xctasy » Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:20 pm

Visuals normally help some, try these. For the 250, they had to pull the carb height down with either a YFA Carter or the RBS Carter. 1100's and 11001's don't figure under the hood with an air-cleaner unless you do some freaky stuff like what MustangGeezer does with his foam sealed air cleaner.




viewtopic.php?f=1&t=77375&p=595574#p595574

Rath Empire

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVRjDo60XJM

Image


the Mavi GT below.


There is still room at the inn. A large hood bulge was needed then, and is today.

Image

Image



Ak Miller got away with mechanical secondaries in his Triple Carb Maverick i6's, but Offy made the kit,

Image
Image

and it was easier to just dial up two 1904's for the outside, an Autolite 1100 for the inner, and that's the way it was.
Image
XEC Ltd ICBE's Inter Continental Ballistic Engines-
FAZER 6Bi (M112 & EEC5) or FAZER 6Ti (GT3582 & EEC5) 425 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
X-Flow Engine Components Ltd http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10

User avatar
xctasy
VIP Member
Posts: 7062
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2002 10:40 am
Location: PO Box 7072 Dunedin 9011,South Island, NEW ZEALAND
Contact:

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #18 by xctasy » Wed Apr 08, 2020 9:06 pm

MustangGeezer had every different system under the sun except triple. 200'S are only 7.830" tall, not 9.469", and the Maverick had less hood depth.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=66238&start=100
Mustang_Geezer wrote:More progress today! :D

Image

Image

Took a saw and hacked off the choke housing and cleaned it up with a belt sander. Took it for a test drive and got to play around with the new Eagle S/S's. Goes like heck and hooks up! :beer:

Now on to the 4:11 gears!

Later,

Doug




using an Escort air cleaner, he could fit stuff when the engine is almost 2" shallower than a 250.


Image

Image


Image


Image


Image
Image
XEC Ltd ICBE's Inter Continental Ballistic Engines-
FAZER 6Bi (M112 & EEC5) or FAZER 6Ti (GT3582 & EEC5) 425 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
X-Flow Engine Components Ltd http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #19 by Georgia200 » Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:21 pm

I wonder how he got those air hoses to stay rigid?

Thats a nice setup and I considered dual 1Vs.

On a side note: When I try and post a pic it says the board quota has been reached. What does that mean?

User avatar
xctasy
VIP Member
Posts: 7062
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2002 10:40 am
Location: PO Box 7072 Dunedin 9011,South Island, NEW ZEALAND
Contact:

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #20 by xctasy » Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:41 pm

Georgia200 wrote:I wonder how he got those air hoses to stay rigid?

Thats a nice setup and I considered dual 1Vs.

On a side note: When I try and post a pic it says the board quota has been reached. What does that mean?



:hmmm: It could be a local fault.

If you are posting photos, there are only so many you can save to the Fordsix server.


Image looks perfect.

if you, um, "link" a picture, it wont repost if there is more than ten pictures


"https://fordsix.com/download/file.php?id=2702" in between the ""SixySix and Ninety Nine"" is the link.

outside of it goes "[img]"%20and%20"[/img]
Image
XEC Ltd ICBE's Inter Continental Ballistic Engines-
FAZER 6Bi (M112 & EEC5) or FAZER 6Ti (GT3582 & EEC5) 425 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
FAZER 6V0 3x2-BBL Holley 188 HP 3.3L/200 I-6 or 235 HP 4.1L/250 I-6
X-Flow Engine Components Ltd http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #21 by Georgia200 » Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:56 pm

I measured the combustion chambers tonight. 58-59cc's.

Im going to whack 030 off the head after I double check the block height.

Whats the thinnest head gasket that can be found now?

User avatar
chad
Registered User
Posts: 5273
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:51 am
Location: Lawrence Swamp, S. Amherst, MA

now: thinest head gasket i6

Post #22 by chad » Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:24 pm

"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

Georgia200
Registered User
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:38 pm

Re: What carb setup for my 250?

Post #23 by Georgia200 » Thu Apr 09, 2020 11:33 pm

I did some mocking up on the cylinder head tonight.

I dont think I can modify the log for a 2V and still close the hood.

That leaves me with a choice of 1,2 or 3 1V carbs.

Im going to try and get the 200 out this weekend and bolt the bell to the spare block and C4. Once I sit it in place with the 250 mounts I will know exactly how much room I have to the hood.

I put a piece of 2x8 on the 200 block and sat the head on that with a piece of cardboard for the gasket. Thats pretty close to what I will have with the 250 provided the engine mounts only raise the deck height 1.7 inches. That only leaves me about .4in of clearance to the hood. The 2V will be about an inch taller than the 1100. So, Im .5in short without an aircleaner.

User avatar
chad
Registered User
Posts: 5273
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:51 am
Location: Lawrence Swamp, S. Amherst, MA

What carb setup for my 250, what do U wanna do w/the vehicle

Post #24 by chad » Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:07 am

"...modify the log for a 2V and still close the hood...."
that's 1 reason some modify the log. I've seen it called a '2V direct mount'.
There ar 6 or 8 'raise the hood' ideas IIRC.
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests