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duce and a half six

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Fiorelli
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duce and a half six

Post #1 by Fiorelli » Thu Nov 06, 2003 7:52 pm

I recently bought a 1953 2 1/2 ton Studebaker 6x6 and it has the gas engine in it not the muilty fuel engine. This is a very big six it looks bigger than the GMC 302 inline six in the GMC 6x6. Anyone been around one or know anything about it how many CID horse anything. Interesting engine.

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Post #2 by 80broncoman » Thu Nov 06, 2003 8:29 pm

I got one of these :shock: . but mine didn't come with a engine. if you need parts or info call Clark truck parts in poca, West Virgina. I dont know if they have a web site. I havent done much with my truck in year or so. (I've been working on a new house). I did build a 67 ford 390 for it though with a f-600 clark 5-speed tranny.
sorry I dont know much about those engines Jim
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80 bronco FUV (farm utility vehicle)300 T-18 3.50s EFI head, offy C dual plenum, 500 edel carb, 1.7 roller rockers, Crane 260 cam EFI Exh

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Post #3 by MustangSix » Thu Nov 06, 2003 9:42 pm

This one I know.

That should be an M34 built by Reo/Studebaker/Curtis Wright. They came equipped with the very rugged Continental OA331 inline six. It was 331 cubes and made 127 hp @ 3400 rpm.
Jack Collins

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Post #4 by Fiorelli » Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:24 pm

I'm not sure it is a Studebaker I think it is a Kizer (sp) The engne has Gold Commet power on the exhaust maniflod There is no intake manifold and a water manifold on the out side of the head.

I don't know which 6x6 you have 80broncoman but stick with the six. I was wondering on one of the GMC's about putting a EFI 300 with the AOD in it. This one has a drive shaft between the transmission and the transfercase so it could be done I'm planning on sticking with this engine unless something happends to it or the transmission. The 300 should run with the 390 or eat it up in one of those. The neighbor has a small truck with a 292 chevy that loves to eat the 350 in his other truck and the 392 IHC engines in ours. It has more torque and with the low axle ratio they have the torque multiplication on the six is so great the V8's must not be able to over come it with the higher rpm's. The local fire department has an old GMC duce and a half with the 302 GMC engine and a Ford truck with a 534 V8. That little six isn't very far behind if it is behind. The 6x6 with the mulityfuel engine will out run both and it's only 124 hp I think. The 5 ton 6x6 with the cummins (250hp) runs away from all of them. I just have not seen those gas v8's do anything in an application where they have to work. They like light cars where all they have to do is rap up. Not my kind of engine. We have some 428's and a 390 or 391 power units. The 390 or 391 which ever it is we don't need it's 0.040 over if your interested. There are a few 428 parts from engines that broke cranks if you need some of those. I think we still have a good 428 block but no crank.

Thanks MustangSix I'll have to run out and look at the tags again and see what it says. I'll try to get some pictures of the engine!

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Post #5 by Lazy JW » Fri Nov 07, 2003 11:02 pm

My neighbor has a WW11 vintage Studebaker 2 1/2 ton truck with the old flathead six in it. This one has the square fenders and the cab is pretty straight. There is a an old jammer mounted on the back and a tree growing up through the frame rails. My Dad used to have one that he hauled logs on when I was very young, I remember going for a wild ride in it once when the brakes went out. He just left it in gear and the engine revved up so fast it exploded the distributor. He told me many years later that he would have bailed out but my sister and I were with him, so he rode it out. I would love to restore that truck to driving condition for parades and such, I figure a 300 should power it just fine. Those things had a zillion U-joints, they ran two separate drive lines back from the transfer case to the rear ends. For parade use I should be able to get away with only driving one. Got to get some other projects done first though.
Joe
"The White OX" 1974 F-350 300-6, Stock single exhaust, Carter YF, T-18A, Dana70 w/4.11, Flatbed dually w/dump bed. "Where no oxen are, the crib is clean, but much increase is by the strength of the ox" (Proverbs 14:4)
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Post #6 by 80broncoman » Sat Nov 08, 2003 6:05 am

I didn't get an engine with my truck at all. I got a truck in very good shape but no engine. btw my 390 is not a truck 390. it is a car unit with 9.5 to 1 compression. a 216' degree cam 110cl and if i remember about 500 lift and a alum 4bbl intake. it will run much better than most truck engines. the factory hp of this 390 in 1967 was 260gross and that is with a 2bbl and 9.5 comp, without the parts I have added. I like six's but this is one HEAVY truck. I got the clark 5-speed and a blown up 391 out of a f-600. all i used off the 391 was the brackets and mounts.
Mine happens to be a 55' REO but the parts I think that I will never tear up is those 6.72 gear axles. For real fun you always have a 2 :1 ratio transfer case!! Now if i could just find brake parts cheap!!!
Jim
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80 bronco FUV (farm utility vehicle)300 T-18 3.50s EFI head, offy C dual plenum, 500 edel carb, 1.7 roller rockers, Crane 260 cam EFI Exh

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Post #7 by Fiorelli » Sat Nov 08, 2003 8:47 pm

I went out and looked at the truck it is a Studebaker M35.

80broncoman Our 392 IHC V8's are 240 hp very lame a 175hp diesel will run away from them. I don't know about the axle ratio of these trucks but the one's that the fire department have that have the GMC six have 6.17 axles if I remember right. I think the truck is around 13,000 lb's heavey but not bad. I think a high torque DT466E would be fun in one! The multi fuel one the fire department has sounds sweet with the turbo but no great powerhouse but it does OK. The way I under stand it the gas and multi fuel trucks have the same running gear just an overdrive transmission for the multi fuel truck. Fourth and fifth are backwards on the multi fuel one and the one with the Cummins.

What break parts do you need? I"m going to need some too. My break pedel goes clear to the floor and does nothing I'm sure it is low or out of break fluid so it probably has a break cylinder or all of them that are bad and need kits or replaced. There are lots of these trucks owned buy the forestry survice who own 3 of the 4 6x6's and one pickup that my local fire department has so parts shouldn't be to hard to find. The gas GMC's are being replaced buy the multifuel one's. As are the older 50's like ours. Did your's orginaly have the gas engine?

Lazy JW my neighbor used to have a WWII half track with the flat head six. It ran but he never did anything with it then one day someone came along saw it and bought it from him. He was happy he wanted to fix it up but bought it mostly to save it from the Iron men.

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Post #8 by Lazy JW » Sun Nov 09, 2003 1:39 am

There used to be lots of that old surplus equipment around here, most of it got torn up in the woods and then scrapped. I hate to see it all melted down and turned into Toyotas. Maybe the Japs really did win the war?
Joe
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Post #9 by 80broncoman » Sun Nov 09, 2003 2:49 am

I had a few issues of military vehicle magazine. It is out of new jersey.
I am gonna need EVERY brake part. they are available just a little more than ford and chevy parts!! and remember we have another axle to do.
mine did come with gas engine. but i didnt get one maybe that is why i got mine for $400. It did have a large water tank on it. What i am planing is a short fixed boom and twin winches for the rear (It has a winch already on the frount). guess i'm going to half to get my cdl operators so I can be legal to drive this thing.
Jim
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Real men don't wear Bowties
When it come to engines If its .001 loose nobody knows, But if its .001 too tight EVERYBODY KNOWS!!
80 bronco FUV (farm utility vehicle)300 T-18 3.50s EFI head, offy C dual plenum, 500 edel carb, 1.7 roller rockers, Crane 260 cam EFI Exh

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Post #10 by Fiorelli » Sun Nov 09, 2003 12:14 pm

I hate to see the Iron men get that good old stuff. I've seen a lot of very nice stuff given to them you can't buy it from them so they just distroy it. I've never figured out why they won't let me give them $100 for something they gave $20 or less for and are going to destroy and get $30 so they want $500 for it. There are a few of them I have been able to work with. Green cash does help!

I gave $601 for mine most of them sold for 400 to 600 that did run. I got the one that I though was the best and glad I got it. I've seen them bring $1500 for the old GMC gas one's that didn't run but "nothing mecanicaly wrong". ??? You did OK on yours expecally if it was close to you! I don't see any reasion you couldn't put a differen't engine in one. Monday we are supose to pull the head off of one of the firedepartments GMC the one I got hot. I'm sure the head is cracked not a head gasket. I have my fingures crossed though. When it is running water is comming out of the exhaust. The sad thing is it runs the best it ever has. If it get's fixed it will have a working temp gage and the radiator will get hot tanked.

Keep us posted on your projects.

I'm not sure if you have to have a CDL to drive one or not! It has hydrolic breaks I don't know what the GVWR is but no more than the tags allows us to carry it may be under 26000 if so you shouldn't need a CDL. It really isn't that hard of a test you might as well take it and have it. I don't know what kinds of trailer you pull but if the GVWR of the trailer is over 10,000 I think you are supose to have a CDL. But that seams to be some gray area. I gave up on trying to figure out all that stuff and got my CDL this way I know I'm legal and legal with the semi. I have a class A CDL with air breaks.
Jeremy

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Post #11 by 80broncoman » Sun Nov 09, 2003 12:49 pm

The truck i have is equipped with what ia commomly known as air over hydralic. I was told even because it had tandem rear axles it fell into comm. vehicle , but i am not sure i'm not a comm vehicle enforcment officer. the gvw plate on the dash cleary states 25k but anyone who looks at these things up close know it would haul a whole lot more than that. :wink:
Jim
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Real men don't wear Bowties
When it come to engines If its .001 loose nobody knows, But if its .001 too tight EVERYBODY KNOWS!!
80 bronco FUV (farm utility vehicle)300 T-18 3.50s EFI head, offy C dual plenum, 500 edel carb, 1.7 roller rockers, Crane 260 cam EFI Exh

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Post #12 by Fiorelli » Sun Nov 09, 2003 10:48 pm

Jim

You will have to talk to a DOT man for sure but if the GVWR is 25000 you don't need a CDL for that it dosen't matter how much it looks like it will carry if you cross the scales and it weighes 25950 you will get a fine for exciding your GVWR if they checked it. At least I think if you remove the tag that gives the GVWR then they can't bother you I've been told????? My 4700 IHC does not have the Tag and did not when I bought it. As for the breaks they are air assisted but not air breaks. I don't know how they would look at that. You couldn't get the air breaks part of the CDL with it so I don't think you need that.

We should both ask a DOT person and see if we get the same answer.
Jeremy

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Post #13 by 300_I6 » Sat Nov 15, 2003 10:26 am

I know a guy with a AM General Army truck and its about that size, and you dont need a CDL.

BTW, that looks like alotta truck for a 300 to move around.

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Post #14 by Lazy JW » Sun Nov 16, 2003 9:12 am

[quote="BTW, that looks like alotta truck for a 300 to move around.[/quote]


Yup. If you ever get the chance to follow a WW11 vintage 6x6 powered by an original flathead six you'll know why they quit building them :shock:
Joe
"The White OX" 1974 F-350 300-6, Stock single exhaust, Carter YF, T-18A, Dana70 w/4.11, Flatbed dually w/dump bed. "Where no oxen are, the crib is clean, but much increase is by the strength of the ox" (Proverbs 14:4)
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Post #15 by Fiorelli » Sun Nov 16, 2003 11:11 pm

I can immagin how they would run. I'm sure 15MPH would seam like you were flying.

I found a tag on the axle of mine that gave the ratio as 6.72. That should make 60 at 3400 with the 9.00 X 20's.

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Post #16 by Lazy JW » Mon Nov 17, 2003 8:44 am

The Studebaker that my Dad had topped out at about 45mph and 4mpg loaded or empty. That's why he quit using it.
Joe
"The White OX" 1974 F-350 300-6, Stock single exhaust, Carter YF, T-18A, Dana70 w/4.11, Flatbed dually w/dump bed. "Where no oxen are, the crib is clean, but much increase is by the strength of the ox" (Proverbs 14:4)
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Post #17 by Fiorelli » Mon Nov 17, 2003 9:13 pm

The Studebaker that my Dad had topped out at about 45mph and 4mpg loaded or empty. That's why he quit using it.


The gas trucks we have are that way it dosen't take much of a head wind or a hill to make 45 the top speed and I don't know if they would quite get 4. The one I drove last week to get suplment for the calves took one hour and 45 minutes to go 70 miles and I can't make the full 140 mile round trip on 40 gallon of gas.

The gov should stop my truck at 60. We'll see if it has the power to pull it's self that fast what little I've drove it I've sure been impressed. I really don't expect it to get better than 6MPG ever and most of what I'll use it for 1 to maybe 2 if I'm lucky. The one the firedepartment has dosen't have any problems running 56 where the gov stops it. One of the local's that followed me with his F250 with a 351 pulling a trailer and a 1000 gal water tank full was impressed with it he didn't have anymore power than I did and didn't weigh as much. The 5ton with the cummins dosn't slow down for the hills the pickups with there 250 gallon tanks don't out run it on the gravel roads or up the hills, but it gets 4MPG on the road.

Jeremy

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