Ford 200 question on crankshaft endplay.rebuild question

[sctty1986]

i just got my fresh shortblock back from the shop.and while pre -reassembling everything i noticed that once i got the main bearing in that the crank end-play was obnoxious without the main-caps installed. i looked at the back bearing and it looks to me like theres something missing between the crank kinda looks like im missing another half of a bearing or does the rear main cap take up this play??? i hvnt installed them yet. so im just wondering if its time to send the block back, i have to send it back again anyhow to get it decked.He didnt do that part of the job. for zero deck i have to mill .035, but .040 should be good right?? .005 above deck .040 pistons, 53 cc heads, .045 gasket or maybe even a stock .025 steel shim i have 4 laying around. so what would any of u gurus recommend. and what camshaft should i install. On another note the heads have been ported street strip, back cut valves polished backs and faces.

Anyone have any idea what kind of power im looking at with a solid 278 camshaft?or the dual grind 264-274 cam?

Do any of u know how much it would cost for a normal machine shop to perform the 2v conversion?

 

[64falconsix]

You need to have all of the mains torqued before checking end play. I would plastigage the bearing clearances too, also have to ask if the thrust bearing is in the right position. I read a post with a similar problem where the bearing was in the wrong position.if you have done that and are still out of spec. You may have a badly worn thrust surface on the crank. Not sure on the decking ,As for cam I would ask mike for his recommendation .

 

[drag-200stang]

sctty1986,

64falconsix is right.

The thrust bearing does not go on the last journal. I can't remember which journal it is but its closer to the middle. I can check if you need me to. The thrust bearing, of course, is the one with the side flange. If you look at the crank and the block, you should be able to see where it fits right. I think what you're looking at, at the last main, is the oil slinger. Its not the surface for the thrust bearing.

These engines were actually built well considering their economy use. Bolts actually hold the damper on, rocker shaft systems stable to 7500 rpm. No rubbing push rod guide crap. Retaining plate that holds the cam in place, not just rubbing on the timing cover. The 70s cylinder heads were flat on top so handy hotrodders could mount carbs inline with the ports if they wanted to, but few did.

 

[bubba22349]

If you use the steel shim head gasket you would want the pistion about .005 down the hole so you end up with a .030 (about the min) to .035 inch quench. If you go to the comp gasket adjust this to its crompressed thickness so you end up with the same quench ie the pistion is out the hole. .005 maybe even .008 or more. Dont forget to check the cam degree and valve clearance when you assemble it. good luck

 

[sctty1986]

ok my heads have 56 cc chamber unshrouded, so i think the most i can mill off from now on coul be .030 max, they were at 62 with the unshrouding i did to the heads i dont know how much they had been milled before.is there any way to measre from the spring seat to the surface of the head? if so what is the stock measurement?. but back to camshaft the cam i am wanting to run is the 278 solid or the 264/274 seeing as how i am running my c3 trans for now until i grab a c4 to install a stall converter. ok the most readily available gasket i can run across is a felpro with .045 compressed thickness on the Fire rings. so in other words a .030 would be the minimum to use for quench ; ive heard ideal for an NA engine is .040 with flat tops but seeing as how i am using silvolite .040 over size dished pistons with 5.4 cc dishes and 1.5 compression distance, i think i could get away with .035- .040. so the pistons are down in the hole .035 mill the deck .040 sticking the pistons .005 above deck. .045 gasket - .005 above deck = .040 quench. so with all this being said im leaning towards a 264/274 camshaft seeing as how ill be using the car as a daily driver and occasional race here or there.

 

[64falconsix]

264/274 would work with an auto but would be better with a looser converter and 3.20 and lower gears. I have 24 1/2" tires and 3.20 gears , at 60 mph I am at around 2900 rpm and feel like I am pushing the motor. The 260 comp cam in the 200 has strong mid range but is a little soft off the line.

 

[sctty1986]

hey 64 falcon ive seen the vids on youtube of your car, nice work i must say only thing is the exhaust note to me i think is tacky id rather stick with my single pipe and super 44. stock engine sounded nice with it. maybe a comp cams 252 camshaft would work then?

 

[bubba22349]

ok my heads have 56 cc chamber unshrouded, so i think the most i can mill off from now on coul be .030 max, they were at 62 with the unshrouding i did to the heads i dont know how much they had been milled before.

Heads can be milled about .090 or .100 from stock so it depends how many times its been cut. I don't know how you would tell other than measureing the CC's of the chamber, and compareing to what the origanal volume was supose to be. Note that many Ford heads measured with bigger chambers than were listed as factory.

 

[sctty1986]

i know they have been cut before i cut them .040 bc the engine had been rebuilt well rebuilt by a retard that installed a half of a broken top ring on piston #1 what a moron i must say. he also used the wrong cam bearings the two center bearings werent even making contact with the cam journals. kinda bad on power when i got it and i wondered why,...... so i advanced the timing, and i guess thats what made the engine knock the rod bearings out. but anywhos back to the head. i didnt measure the heads before i unshrouded the valves FOUL mooove!!!!ahhh what a moron i must be. i didnt have the seringe. but before i milled the .040 they measured out at 62ccs. im guessing that the heads had only been touched up to true the .mating surface if even that hehehe. now they measure 56ccs- 56.5...... so umm on the other hand i didnt remove much material maybe 4-6ccs at the most.

 

[64falconsix]

If you went with comp go with the 260. the 252 is one step up from stock and would not let you take full advantage of the head work and direct mount 2 bbl. but the comp lobe profiles are an old design. my next build will use a clay smith cam from classic inlines.I would reserve the 278 solid for a serious weekend cruiser/strip car with the aluminum head, high stall converter and low gears. I would guess mike would recommend the 264 with 110 lobe seperation or the 264-274 with 112 lobe seperation. most likely the latter to take advantage of the direct mount 2bbl. and the port work on your head.the point with the gearing and rpm is that in order to keep an engine with the 278 snappy on the low end the higher stall and the lower gears required might make it an unpleasent cruiser.after putting some miles on mine I am seriosly thinking of a t5 swap to get rpms down at cruising speed.

 

[sctty1986]

ok so the 264/274 camshaft it is. tomorrow im taking the engine block back to the machine shop to get it decked .040, should i take the head to get the guide bosses inder the valve tip cut or would it be safe with the lift of this cam being .450 or am i safe?

 

[64falconsix]

Your machine shop can verify or if you have a dial indicator you can put the retainer on without the spring and measure with a dial caliper or machinists ruler.make sure to have the valve stem seals in also. I don't remember the recommended min clearances by I had to cut my guides and add teflon seals due to both the lift and the thicker center of the crane cams valve retainers.