First Timing Advice

[blaze65]

Looking for some advice on Timing. Have a rebuilt 200 project that has been several years in the making. Engine was rebuilt by a local shop, is supposed to have 9:1 compression, has a new Comp Cam (Mild) and the log has been modified with the CI 2V adapter plate. Also as a new DSII from CI , headers and has a 1.08 Autolite 2100. Car has been started, but only for a few seconds each time as the tank was not hook up and i believe it has to be timed properly. When it did start it seemed strong but it did pop a few times.

Going to tackle this tomorrow morning and wanted some advice on where to start with the timing. I was going to start at 12 degrees and see where it takes me.

Thanks in advance

Bill

 

[rbohm]

i usually start between 10 and 14 degrees initial timing, so 12 is an excellent starting point. push the initial setting until you get detonation, or hard starting, and then back off a couple of degrees until either of those issues stops, and then lock it down.

 

[MPGmustang]

Timing is fun, it trains you to listen to the engine running. one of the many things I miss doing myself.

if a stock engine, go 10* and then add 2* static until pings then go back 2*, remember to set static with the vacuum disconnected.

So, what cam are you running? did you get your DSII recurved or is it just 'classicinlines', I'm not to bash Mike, he's a great guy and can't do everything as everyone's car is different. but I highly recommend getting your DSII recurved FOR YOUR ENGINE specifically. I had my DSII recurved, and it was AMAZING how well it ran vs the DUI stock settings. It was timed for 18* static, and 32* total, with the vacuum, and the guy said to get the strongest idle with my cam, it needs to be 1000 idle rpm. I'm telling you before the recurve, 1000 rpm was way high, but with a recurve, it just sounded right, weirdest thing.

you already went this far, ask this forum for member who know these DSII's and ask them to recurve it for you. they will do a GREAT job and tell you EXACTLY where everything should be, it will be worth EVERY penny.

Sadly I don't recurve, but I wouldn't hesitate if I had carb setup again.

 

[First Fox]

I am one of the few here that run a comp cam and with my low compression ratio and the 110 LSA of the 260 cam, the engine just LOVES a lot of initial timing. In fact I have the distributor locked out at about 26 degrees and it idles like a dream with a nice little chop. 10 or 12 degrees initial in mine and it will barely run if at all. With your higher compression ratio you may be able to run 16 or so, but if it wants more timing to idle correctly, let her have it.

Just watch the total timing, that really is what will damage things if you are not careful.

 

[blaze65]

Thanks to all for responding. I'm not a mechanic and I would lying to say I followed every bit of that. To answer one of the questions the cam is a Comp 260H.
Several other questions that come to mind are
How i
1 - Is there anything I can hurt here or that I need to be carful not to do. There is no Drive shaft in this car so it is not actually going to get on the road tomorrow. I just want to make sure this engine is OK and runs after all the work / pitfalls of the last few years (that's another story). Basically I am going to start around 12 degrees and work back and forth a few degrees until I get to something that feels smooth. Sound OK.

2 - I get Initial timing or at least I think I do. It is static timing or just idle timing. Is that correct ? Question is how is advance timing set ? Do you take it out and drive the car and see how it feels under load, etc. and make adjustments from there ?

Many thanks for the help

 

[rbohm]

Thanks to all for responding. I'm not a mechanic and I would lying to say I followed every bit of that. To answer one of the questions the cam is a Comp 260H.
Several other questions that come to mind are
How i
1 - Is there anything I can hurt here or that I need to be carful not to do. There is no Drive shaft in this car so it is not actually going to get on the road tomorrow. I just want to make sure this engine is OK and runs after all the work / pitfalls of the last few years (that's another story). Basically I am going to start around 12 degrees and work back and forth a few degrees until I get to something that feels smooth. Sound OK.

2 - I get Initial timing or at least I think I do. It is static timing or just idle timing. Is that correct ? Question is how is advance timing set ? Do you take it out and drive the car and see how it feels under load, etc. and make adjustments from there ?

Many thanks for the help

ok your best bet right now is to stay conservative. get the engine running and your initial timing set. then get your carb set for the smoothest idle you can get. after that get the drive shaft in and take it for a drive and see how it feels. then start playing with the timing, usually by advancing it a bit at a time until you get detonation under acceleration, usually at part throttle under a load, then back the timing off until it goes away.

 

[blaze65]

Many thanks for the help and assistance. Will start slowly tomorrow and will post the results.

Thanks again

Bill

 

[wsa111]

All engine combinations need a different curve.
Just remember if you keep advancing the initial timing you could invite engine damage from too much total advance.
Reman distributors are the worst as far as getting all the centrifugal advance at the most productive rpm for 99% of our engines.

 

[blaze65]

Thanks again. So what is the right way to do this. Get the initial timing set and then get the car to someone with that can recurve the Dist or put it on a machine ?

Bill

 

[First Fox]

Yes, staying conservative is a good idea especially if you are still figuring it out. You can connect a vacuum gauge to the intake and set it for best idle that way and it is a really the best way to do it. BUT don't be surprised if you check it with the timing light and it reads 20 degrees or so. That won't hurt anything at all. What will hurt something is driving it around that way because the centrifugal advance will add another 20 to 30 degrees and will be way too much advance at higher engine speeds and likely cause detonation.

If your vacuum gauge shows that the engine likes 20 degrees initial at idle, then that's what you want to run. You then want to remove your distributor and send it out for a recurve letting them know you want to run 20 degrees advance or whatever your magic number is. They will then tailor the rest of the curve for you including advance rate and total timing.

 

[JackFish]

viewtopic.php?t=30894
There are a few stickies with some good info.

 

[blaze65]

Well she looks like she is a runner. Started at 12 degrees and continued to adjust the dist until it smoothed out. Looks like it is at around 13-14 and it seems to idle very well there. Starts immediately with a turn of the key. Will work on the driveshaft and get the advance timing worked out. Had a few new issues I have to work out now and will check the forum for advice.

One issue is that I am not sure the alternator is working. It is new ( or was 3 years ago) but the amp gauge was not moving and everywhere I tested I was getting a straight 12 volts. This car has 66 mustang wiring so it has 3 wires at the voltage regulator and 3 on the back of the alternator. There is no Stator wire as from what I have read that was for cars with the lights not gauges. I would have expected that I would have at least had 12 V off the back of the stator terminal and I have zero. Was going to use the stator for the electric choke as I had seen a lot of people had used that to power the choke but I get no reading at the stator terminal.

Many thanks to all again. Really appreciate this forum and all the support.

Bill

 

[wsa111]

In the early 80's ford did use stator voltage to activate the electric choke, But ford did use a special electric choke housing which was designed for 9 volts.
You can use the stator power to a relay to trigger battery voltage to a 12 volt choke housing. Be it ford or holley.