Flex Plate Bolts?

[Anonymous]

Howdy all.

I am starting to collect parts to install a '66 170 and a C4 trans into my 63 Ranchero.

I have a bunch of questions, but I figured I would split them up into different posts to try to get all of them answered...

I need to figure out what to do about connecting the flex plate to the back of the engine.

I found a set of 6 fine threaded hex head bolts from another project, and they thread into the holes on the engine flange just fine, but they seem to bottom out about 1/4 inch before they are tight. Maybe they are from a V8 and are longer? I have no idea.

Can anyone tell me exactly what I need to attach the flex plate? Am I missing something?

Here is a photo of the area in question:

Thanks in advance!

-Zim

 

[61Futura]

Your missing a piece that looks like a big washer with 6 holes to match the crank flange. It's not 1/4" thick, but with it and some lock washers, your bolts might fit.

 

[Anonymous]

OK. Thanks.

Anyone know where I can find one, or at least see a picture of it?

-Zim

 

[addo]

Manual trans bolts to secure flywheel to crank are longer than for an auto - by ¼" or so. Those bolt holes run right through - it would be ill advised to go over-length on the bolts. Also use Permatex#3 sealant on the threads, basically as Ford did. The missing enforcer ring is probably best found off a salvage motor.

I'm not sure if it's this model or not, but one of the early flexplates is famous for developing cracks. Inspect well before you torque it in place.

Cheers, Adam.

 

[Mercury Mike]

I've got about 3 of those spacers.

 

[addo]

You mean

Rare NOS NIB Shelby Cobra Mustang Falcon Sprint Futura Hardtop Fastback Coupe Convertible Mint Rebuilt Core NICE LQQK Flexplate Enforcer Rings for a 170 6 cylinder.

:roll:

Who else gets sick of Ebay hype?

 

[xctasy]

Good on for being smart enough to ask simple questions, you've saved a lot of heartache!

Talking log head 170's and 200 US auto I6's:-

Don't ever use the longer bolts, you will ruin the rope seal. The rope seal is in behind the crank flange, and the longer bolts will first result on the engine not turing over, then, after its turned and ruined the seal, it'll then leak like a stuck pig.

Use the standard Auto bolts, never Windsor ones.

 

[kukm66]

Get a new flexplate - they cost anywhere from $12 to $30 depending on who sells them.

Shank length on the bolt is 15/16" in length. Do not use the V8 type as the head is wider and will not clear the recess area. ARP has these new and are supposed to be the same as the Chevy. Email them to get the stock number. I did this several years ago but have misplaced it.

Torque Specs:

Flexplate to Crank 75-85 ft/lbs. Use loctite or similar
Convertor to Flexplate 25-35 ft/lbs.

Note: The bolts do not go into the crankcase as they will bottom out into the crank flange. This is different from many types which allos the bolt to go through. Hence, the correct shank lenght is critical.

 

[Anonymous]

Get a new flexplate - they cost anywhere from $12 to $30 depending on who sells them.

I am new to the Ford Six world. Will most of the usual Mustang parts places sell these? Local auto parts stores?

Shank length on the bolt is 15/16" in length.

I took a closer look at the bolts I have.

The threaded part is exactly 15/16 long.

They appear to ba a 7/16-20 Fine Thread. Black Oxide coating.
They are hex head, and would use a 3/4 wrench.
The heads themselves are slotted with a recess in the center. They look similar to other high-torque engine bolts I have seen.

Sounds like I might have the right bolts?

Thanks,

-Zim

 

[XFlow_Fairlane]

yup sounds right just missing the spacer ring.

 

[Anonymous]

You mean

Rare NOS NIB Shelby Cobra Mustang Falcon Sprint Futura Hardtop Fastback Coupe Convertible Mint Rebuilt Core NICE LQQK Flexplate Enforcer Rings for a 170 6 cylinder.

:roll:

Who else gets sick of Ebay hype?

He's just using keywords for more search hits.

 

[addo]

It's the opportunism that gets me. I don't understand why people sell Mustang T-shirts with ads worded (tagged) in such a way they come up when you're looking for a headlamp switch.

Imagine fronting the bar and you're ready to order drinks. The barman turns to you and says "Would you like to buy some Hello Kitty socks?". :roll:

 

[Anonymous]

I finally got the load spreader ring.

As I thought - I still don't seem to have the right bolts.

I snapped these pics after getting all of the bolts finger tight.

http://www.svs.com/zim/ranchero/images/IMG_6205.JPG
http://www.svs.com/zim/ranchero/images/IMG_6206.JPG

Since I want to actually put this together on saturday morning, would it be possible to just bring the bolts to work and shorten them without causing any problems?

I can do that without messing up the threads.

I would think these should start getting tight only after they press up against the spacer.

Does anyone have one of these bolts that they can measure the shank length for sure? Mine are 15/16 long and use a 3/4" wrench.

This is a 66/67 170 and a C4 flex plate...

Thanks!

-Zim

 

[kukm66]

15/16" shank length.

 

[Anonymous]

15/16 is exactly what I have.

3/4 or so is as far in as they will go. (in the photo above)

Since this is kind of an oddball - a late 170 from a Bronco - is it also possible that Ford changed the depth of the holes in the crank flange?

In another thread, we talked about how this specific engine wasn't even listed in the Ford Six Manual...

 

[addo]

I looked at Summit's ARP offerings for a Ford eight. Length is stated as 0.680 inches. That sounds like what you need to shoot for.

Regards, Adam.

 

[kukm66]

A couple of things to do:

1) Make sure just for clarification check that the bottom of the holes are cleaned out. Do this on several to double check each other.

2) Get a depth gauge and check the measurement from the face of the flange. I will check all of mine as I have several engines on the floor. I have a 250, 170, and 2 200's.

This story is getting more bizzare. Generally, Ford was very frugal and made very few variations on specific parts during that time period as it was very cost effective. To make a specific crank just for that engine just does not sound correct.

 

[MustangSix]

On all the 200's and 250's and other Ford engine's I've built, the crank flange bolt holes go all the way thru to the crankcase. Yours may be gummed up with something that prevents the bolts from going in completely.

Pull the bolts and poke something in the bolt holes to check if they go all the way thru. If so, get a tap and clean the threads.

When you install the bolts, make sure you use some sort of sealer. I've found that Loc-tite blue works fine.

 

[kukm66]

I just checked all 3 engines I have on the floor. Jack is correct in that the holes go all the way through the flange. However, the rear mounting flange on the block and the main cap will only allow the bolts to go so far without hitting. The thickness of the flexplate and torque ring and the flange together will allow the bolt to slighlty extend past the rear of the flange when torqued, so adequate clearance is obtained.

I rechecked all of the flex plate bolts I have and all are confirmed at 15/16" with a 3/4" head. These were all taken off of a 200 with a C4.

 

[Anonymous]

Finally figured out what was going on.

In a previous life, this engine must have had shorter flex plate bolts in it.

Using a flashlight and a scale, I saw that there was indeed a little more than 1" of space for the bolts.

And I also noticed that the last few threads in each hole were corroded pretty bad from never being used.

So alfter a little bit of persuasion from a wrench - they did finally go in just fine.

I guess I was trying to be careful. But the 15/16 bolts are now all torqued to 75 lbs with red loctite - and the engine has been installed in my Ranchero as of today. Hopefully - I will get it started this week sometime!

Thanks - and sorry for the confusion!

-Zim