Gas tank question

[Anonymous]

I'm considering a conversion to multiport fuel injection at some point on my 80 Ford Futura and its 200 I6. The problem is that aftermarket hi pressure, hi flow fuelpumps are very EXPENSIVE! I was wondering if the fuel tank from a 89+ mustang or other Fox chassis car will fit the Futura? If so I could put this tank in for now and use a regulator to drop the pressure for my carb till I install the injection setup. Anybody got a clue as to if this will fit?

 

[MustangSix]

The cheap solutiion that I used on the Crossflow was to use a Bosch inline pump from a 351W Ford E150 van (thanks, Ted) and add a return line to the fuel filler neck. The pump will support over 350hp according to the Bosch specs and will deliver up to 65 psi if needed.

 

[Anlushac11]

8)

Yes the 89 EFI tank should work in your Futura but you need to make sure you get the tank straps and the plastic tank shield. I was going to have a 83+ 16 gallon tank put in my 80 with the 11 gallon tank but no one wanted to do it. They would only put the stock tank back in.

One of the mods I want to do is cut the floor out in back and adapt a 66 Mustang tank to fit in floor.

 

[Anonymous]

those things only had 11 gallon tanks??

 

[DaGr8Tim]

The cheap solutiion that I used on the Crossflow was to use a Bosch inline pump from a 351W Ford E150 van (thanks, Ted) and add a return line to the fuel filler neck. The pump will support over 350hp according to the Bosch specs and will deliver up to 65 psi if needed.

The inline pump, is it electric or mechanical?

 

[MustangSix]

Electric. I put an EFI filter into the line from the tank, then hooked up the pump to push fuel thru the original fuel line. I added a return line that runs parallel to the feed. It goes from the regulator directly to the fuel filler tube. I bolted a fitting to the tube to attach the return line.

 

[DaGr8Tim]

Electric. I put an EFI filter into the line from the tank, then hooked up the pump to push fuel thru the original fuel line. I added a return line that runs parallel to the feed. It goes from the regulator directly to the fuel filler tube. I bolted a fitting to the tube to attach the return line.

Intresting. Might be good to combine that with some newer mustang injectors.

Yet one of the mods we are working on over in Tempo Land.

 

[MustangSix]

I'm currently using 24lb/hr 5.0 injectors and they are working well.

 

[DaGr8Tim]

I'm currently using 24lb/hr 5.0 injectors and they are working well.

Hmmm....we're talking 19lb/hr's. Might be something worth while to look into. Thanx.

 

[MustangSix]

19# injectors are a bit small for a 200+ hp six cylinder, but just about right for a 200 hp V8. On a six, each one has to inject more fuel than on a similar hp V8.

 

[DaGr8Tim]

19# injectors are a bit small for a 200+ hp six cylinder, but just about right for a 200 hp V8. On a six, each one has to inject more fuel than on a similar hp V8.

Remember, I'm talking injectors for use on a 2.3L 4 cylinder. Our stock injectors flow something like 14lb/hr.

 

[MustangSix]

Still, it's a matter of how much HP per cylinder you are making and the brake specific fuel consumption of each. Just because the engine is smaller doesn't mean it needs smaller injectors. If you make half the hp on half the cylinders, you still need the same size injectors.

A 14# injector supports enough fuel to make about 80 hp at 85% duty cycle. If you manage to bump that 2.3 to, say 150 hp, you'll need much bigger injectors, something in the range of 26 lbs/hr at 85% duty cycle.

 

[DaGr8Tim]

Still, it's a matter of how much HP per cylinder you are making and the brake specific fuel consumption of each. Just because the engine is smaller doesn't mean it needs smaller injectors. If you make half the hp on half the cylinders, you still need the same size injectors.

A 14# injector supports enough fuel to make about 80 hp at 855 duty cycle. If you manage to bump that 2.3 to, say 150 hp, you'll need much bigger injectors, something in the range of 26 lbs/hr at 85% duty cycle.

The number 150HP seems to be the holy grail. It is believed with the right internals it could be achived with the 2.3. That's a great thought to know.

But I still think I need to talk my uncle out of the 200 in his 81 Mustang. Then chop my car down, add a tube frame, lengthen the front clip alittle, and afew other mods. Whatcha think?

 

[MustangSix]

I've torn apart a few 2.3's and I think it can be done. Like with all other engines its about airflow.

The stock manifolds, ports, and valves are small and optimized for velocity at a low rpm. You'll need to open them up considerably. The stock EFI will not go 150 hp without some significant work, so I suggest you can it and make one ala the SDS Method. Use an aftermarket controller or maybe you guys can figure out how to use a 2.3 Mustang controller.

An alternative would be to build a carbed manifold for a pair of H6 SU's or 175CD strombergs or a 350 Holley.

The biggest hurdle is the cam, but you should be able to have one reground to 210-215 degrees @.050 with about .450 valve lift. You could probably go 224@.050 with a manual transmission and still make it streetable. Take a look at late model 5.0 rockers. The stock 1.6 ones look like the same design. If so, then roller rockers are easy and cheap and a 1.6 or 1.7 rocker upgrade is a cinch.

4-2-1 header design, Big exhaust, keep the converter if you can to keep it clean.

150 is doable with enough work but you're looking at non-existent aftermarket support.

 

[DaGr8Tim]

I've torn apart a few 2.3's and I think it can be done. Like with all other engines its about airflow.

The stock manifolds, ports, and valves are small and optimized for velocity at a low rpm. You'll need to open them up considerably. The stock EFI will not go 150 hp without some significant work, so I suggest you can it and make one ala the SDS Method. Use an aftermarket controller or maybe you guys can figure out how to use a 2.3 Mustang controller.

The biggest hurdle is the cam, but you should be able to have one reground to 210-215 degrees @.050 with about .450 valve lift. You could probably go 224@.050 with a manual transmission and still make it streetable. Take a look at late model 5.0 rockers. The stock 1.6 ones look like the same design. If so, then roller rockers are easy and cheap and a 1.6 or 1.7 rocker upgrade is a cinch.

150 is doable with enough work but you're looking at non-existent aftermarket support.

Being as I have an extra 2.3L HSO (high specific output) engine in my parts car. One of my first goals is a basic port job.

We're looking at several options for computer & fuel management chips/setup's. I think we can find one that's do able.

As for the cam. The HSO's have a more radical cam. I believe it's longer duration, not sure if it's a higher duration. But I've got an old friend with his own automotive machine shop. He's willing to take a crack at some custom ground parts for my car.

As for aftermarket support. The guy with an SHO motor in his Topaz has no support what so ever. Besides being unique has some special costs of it's own. I don't believe they are too high. I just need to learn more alot more.

BTW, since finding your site, the more I learn, the more I realize how little I actually know. I wanna thank you guys for the crash course, you guys have already given me in performance.

 

[MustangSix]

I wouldn't bet on that HSO cam being very HO. :roll: In stock form that one only made a few more horses than the regular version, didn't it? A regrind is your best bet.

Most of us are simply eclectic loons who cannot keep in step with the drumbeat of the rest of the world and don't really care how many cylinders it has or which wheels it drives as long as it's real and you put your heart in it.

 

[DaGr8Tim]

I wouldn't bet on that HSO cam being very HO. :roll: In stock form that one only made a few more horses than the regular version, didn't it? A regrind is your best bet.

Most of us are simply eclectic loons who cannot keep in step with the drumbeat of the rest of the world and don't really care how many cylinders it has or which wheels it drives as long as it's real and you put your heart in it.

Ford says the HSO makes 2 more HP and alittle more torque than the HSC. In my experience (driving my 88 Tempo HSC & my 89 Topaz HSO), the Topaz feels alot stronger. I've been told that it's because of the more aggressive gearing in the tranny's mated to the HSO's. I'm not sure if I totally buy it. I think the HSO may be underrated and could possible be 110 HP. I think I read somewhere that insurance rates are cheaper on a car that's rated at 100 HP or less.

I grew up in front of the alter of the chevy veee 8. All of my buddies from high school still think the 350 was the best engine ever produced by any company. I've gotten to the point that I perfer to work with what I have because it's usually cheaper, and I'd rather smoke another car with a 4 cylinder than a v6. To me there seems to be more pride in that.

 

[LEROY POLL]

HELLO MY80********

YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO GO TO A 1983 3.8 TBI LTD (SMALL FORD)AND EVERYTHING SHOULD JUST BOLT UP. THE FILTER SET JUST THREE FEET FORWARD OF THE TANK. BE SURE TO TAKE THE WHOLE PACKAGE TO MAKE A SMOOTH INSTALL. IT WILL WORK FOR YOU NOW BUT NEEDS SOME KIND OF REGULATOR IF YOU USE IT ON A CARBURETOR. THEY COST FROM $40.00 TO $75.00 AT THE JUNK/Y...

I WENT THE OTHER WAY. I WENT FOR THE BIGGEST TANK I COULD GET FOR MY LTD. I FOUND A 1981 T-BIRD WILL FIT RIGHT IN. IT HAS 23 GALLONS BUT YOU CAN GET 24 GALLONS IN IT. I BELIEVE IT WILL HOLD OVER 25 GALLONS. I ALSO HAD TO MOVE THE TAIL PIPE ALONG THE SIDE, JUST UNDER THEBACK FENDER. THERE IS A STOCK PIPE FROM FORD YOU CAN GET TO MAKE THE MOVE.

THIS STRING HAS GONE DOWN AND OFF THE ROAD ALITTLE....!